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Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 12:18
Southgate Ratings

How would you rate the boss man? My ratings are below.

Management so far: 7/10
Signings so far: 7/10
Legend Potential: 9/10


Bandy Posted on 15/01/2008 12:19
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 7/10
Signings so far: 7/10
Legend Potential: 9/10

Were in full agreement!

bororeddaz Posted on 15/01/2008 12:20
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 6/10
Signings so far: 5/10
Legend Potential: 7/10

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 12:21
Southgate Ratings

You know your stuff, Bandy!

mattyk50 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:21
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 4/10
Signings so far: 7/10
Legend Potential: 7/10

Libbins Posted on 15/01/2008 12:21
Southgate Ratings

I agree 100% with you two up top.

Management so far: 7/10
Signings so far: 7/10
Legend Potential: 9/10

Uptheboro Posted on 15/01/2008 12:21
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5.1/2. /10...(But getting better)
Signings so far: 7/10....(will be an 8 if Afonso comes)
Legend Potential: 7/10..Potential is there ..

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:21
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 7/10

Funghi79 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:23
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 7/10 - is learning his trade but shows promise
Signings so far: 8/10 - By and large very good signings.
Legend Potential: 9/10 - I am sure the Gate will become a fantastic manager for us!

grantus Posted on 15/01/2008 12:24
Southgate Ratings

Hairstyle - 8/10
Interviews - 6/10 (needs to be more assertive, have more gravitas)
Fashion sense - 7.5/10

Overall - 7/10

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 12:25
Southgate Ratings

Even SAS, the most miserable of miseries hasn't scored lower than a 5. It seems Southgate has the full weight of our supporters behind him.

indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:26
Southgate Ratings

Management so far 6/10 - Could do better but has got some good results, along with some terrible ones
Signings so far 5/10 - Only made 3 decent signings who have proved to be decent
Legend Potential 8/10 - great captain for club, if he starts to improve us over the next season or two as manager and gets us back into top 8/10 he would be definitely be considered a legend in my eyes

prepman Posted on 15/01/2008 12:29
Southgate Ratings

legend potential?ha ha ha no chance.only to the ra ra squad.

indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:31
Southgate Ratings

"Signings so far: 8/10 - By and large very good signings."

I am confused by thus Funghi. He has signed 4 strikers who couldn't hit a barn door.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 12:31
Southgate Ratings

Southgate is the brightest manager we've ever had. Prepman, prepare to eat your waords.

indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:34
Southgate Ratings

Prepman, why could he never be a legend?

Borocelt Posted on 15/01/2008 12:36
Southgate Ratings


Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 5/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

Funghi79 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:43
Southgate Ratings

Indestructible_7 I consider his signings to be very good, by and large.

The two poor signings for me were Jason Euell and DGL, though we only paid £300k overall for the two of them I believe so not really any massive loss. Secondly, I believe DGL was a marketing tool nothing more and so whether it was actually the Gate's decision to sign him is open to debate.

Asides from that I think :-
Arca has been an excellent buy
Woody was a fantastic signing
Luke Young has been excellent value for money too
Gary O'Neil is possibly his best signing to date
Tuncay has started to show he is a real quality player
Robert Huth is immense
Still early days for Shawky
Herold Goulon was always a long term prospect rahter than someone who was going to march into the first team
Mido was unlucky to get injured but he looked good when he signed so the potential is there with him
Aliadiere is a very good player who gives a lot to the team though I agree with those who believe he might be better on the wing

Does this answer your question?

FunkyPotatoe Posted on 15/01/2008 12:45
Southgate Ratings

Arca and Young are his best two signings. GON is quality but he don't score or create goals and isn't really a wide player, but he's quality and has loads of energy reminds me a bit of Greening when he won player of the year.


sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:48
Southgate Ratings

going by some scores on here, it made me nearly forget we are 1 point away from a relegation place.
we seem to have some good players apparently, so why languishing 1 point above the drop zone. maybe i was a bit generous on his management score. dropa couple for being unable to keep his best players too.

boroboymike Posted on 15/01/2008 12:51
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10

-persists with wasters like Rocky too much when they clearly need replacing
-clearly no ability to coach defences given backroom staff comprised entirely of defenders
-sits on leads/draws too much
-total lack of ability to spot striking talent and recognise end product
-no knowledge of foreign market unlike hughes/redknapp

Signings so far: 5/10-

Woodgate - v.good
Young - v.good
O'neil - works hard, but woeful finisher
Shawky-pointless
Alliadiere-disaster (and a very foreseeable disaster given he couldn't hack it in various Mickey Mouse leagues)
Mido-unfortunate with injury
LDG-pointless

Legend Potential: 6/10-Likeable bloke, can only hope he's learning fast as he isn't up to it at the moment.

mattyk50 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:52
Southgate Ratings

bloody hell, i gave a lower management score than sas! worrying times.

how can people give him a 7 out of 10 for his signings (which is reasonable enough) - But then also give a 7 out of 10 for his management of these players, when we are 1 point off relegation?

Pauluka Posted on 15/01/2008 12:52
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 6/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 9/10

sean_boro Posted on 15/01/2008 12:53
Southgate Ratings

foundations sas, foundations.

you shouldnt stamp your feet when we dont get instant success - it makes you no different to a geordie.

wait and see where we are in 3 seasons time.

prepman Posted on 15/01/2008 12:53
Southgate Ratings

because legends are someone special and this fella is nothing special,as we will find out in time.....lisbon jack charlton no doubt before your time.

MarlonD Posted on 15/01/2008 12:53
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 6/10

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:57
Southgate Ratings

"you shouldnt stamp your feet when we dont get instant success - it makes you no different to a geordie."

yeah, sod a mid table position. lets be happy with 1 point aboove relegation! Thing is we wouldnt be in this situation if we got a manager in with decent experience. SOuthgate has no experience as it is showing through and we have gone backwards in last 18 months and our better players want to leave.

"wait and see where we are in 3 seasons time."

so we have to wait 5 years for southgate to make us anything better than a team fighting off relegation? FFS, what a waste of 5 years!


indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 12:58
Southgate Ratings

It does answer my question, but I don't agree with most of it.

Arca has been an excellent buy AGREE
Woody was a fantastic signing AGREE
Luke Young has been excellent value for money too NOT CONVINCED YET, HE IS BETTER THAN PARNABY BUT THAT'S NOT SAYING MUCH
Gary O'Neil is possibly his best signing to date I THINK ARCA HAS BEEN, BUT I DO LIKE O'NEIL
Tuncay has started to show he is a real quality player TO SOME EXTENT
Robert Huth is immense BUT HAS HARDLY PLAYED, NEED MORE TIME TO MAKE A JUDGEMENT
Still early days for Shawky YES
Herold Goulon was always a long term prospect rahter than someone who was going to march into the first team YES, THEREFORE YOU CAN'T MAKE A JUDGEMENT YET
Mido was unlucky to get injured but he looked good when he signed so the potential is there with him DISAGREE, I THINK HE LOOKED PRETTY LAZY AND AVERAGE BEFORE HE GOT INJURED, SEEMED TO LIKE THE FACT THE CROWD PLAYED UP TO HIM AND ACTED LIKE HE WAS THE DOGS BOLLOX, I'LL RESERVE JUDGEMENT UNTIL HE'S PLAYED MORE THAN 6 GAMES
Aliadiere is a very good player who gives a lot to the team though I agree with those who believe he might be better on the wing HE HAS POTENTIAL BUT IF HE DOESN'T START SCORING GOALS SOON I DON'T SEE HOW HE CAN BE JUDGED AS A SUCCESS.

Therefore, I only see 3 signings out of 10 which have worked out so far. You also missed off DGL, and I'm sure we have the same opinion on that one. Please note, I wasn't shouting, used caps so that you could tell the difference between what I had written and what you had.

PS Forgot about Jason Euell

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 13:00
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 6/10
Signings so far: 8/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 13:01
Southgate Ratings

Prepman, he captained us to our first trophy and in the UEFA Cup final. He was a great player for us and an England international. I don't dispute that Jack Charlton was a legend, but proposing someone from the last 30 years as a POTENTIAL legend does not make you one of (as you so eloquently put it) "the ra ra squad".

Critical_Bill Posted on 15/01/2008 13:04
Southgate Ratings

Management so far - 4/10 - from a European Final to relegation battlers in the space of 18 months

Signings - 6/10 - Some steady signings, some duds, some less than frugal panic buys

Legend potential - 5/10 - He could be remembered for being the manager to lead us to our worst tally of home wins in a season since I first started watching the Boro. Good players don't necessarily make good managers.

Sleaford Posted on 15/01/2008 13:04
Southgate Ratings

"It seems Southgate has the full weight of our supporters behind him"

Yeah, this week.

uttoxboro Posted on 15/01/2008 13:06
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

uttoxboro Posted on 15/01/2008 13:06
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

uttoxboro Posted on 15/01/2008 13:06
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

uttoxboro Posted on 15/01/2008 13:06
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

uttoxboro Posted on 15/01/2008 13:06
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

uttoxboro Posted on 15/01/2008 13:06
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

uttoxboro Posted on 15/01/2008 13:06
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 8/10

kermit Posted on 15/01/2008 13:09
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10 (Some good results but as of yet we've barely even had a sniff of the top half of the table)

Signings so far: 7/10 (DGL/Euell are/were awful but they cost next to nothing)

Legend Potential: 9/10 (Shown in glimpses the football he's promised, with a stable side and some actual strikers maybe we'll see the side he and the fans want)

Borocelt Posted on 15/01/2008 13:10
Southgate Ratings

Herold Goulon was signed by Steve McClaren.

Also, with regards to Huth, as good as I think he is, you can't rate the signing as immense really, when he has played so few games since signing almost 18 months ago.

Southgate signings

Mido 7/10 - Good start, who knows when he'll be back, some feedback from the club to what exactly is wrong would be nice.

Huth 5/10 - Excellent when he's played. Cost a lot of money for ten games or so, so far.

Shawky 6/10 - Hasn't been given a go, I reckon he could be ok though. He looked good at Pompey, hopefully he'll have a good cup of nations and come back fighting fit.

Woodgate 7.5/10 - Good last season, hasn't built on last seasons form this term though

Young 8/10 - Very good and cut price tag as well.

O'Neil 7.5/10 - I worry that he can't shoot, but 100% commitment can't be doubted. Looks a good signing.

Arca 7.5/10 - I'm still not convinced by his capacity as an attacking midfielder. He dosn't push forward enough and get into the opposition box. Better than I expected though and a very good passer of the ball. I'm just not sure of his best position.

Dong Gook Lee 1/10 - Abysmal.

Euell 0.5/10 - Even worse.

Aliadiere 6/10 - Does not score enough goals.

Sleaford Posted on 15/01/2008 13:12
Southgate Ratings

Can we have a section for keeping the first 11 fit for more than a week rating as well?

Management so far: 6/10
Signings so far: 7/10 (could of got a 9 if it wasn't for Gook and Euell)
Legend Potential: 9/10
First 11 fitness: 0/10

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 13:14
Southgate Ratings

"Therefore, I only see 3 signings out of 10 which have worked out so far. " -- signings aren't just in two categories - quality and S***.

Woody - As a loan signing he was 9 out of ten. As a permanent he has been 5.

Arca - 8 out of ten, could have been higher but for injuries.

Euell - 5, was never more than a cheap squad filler. He fulfilled that job, just about.

Huth - 5.5 out of 10, due to injuries. However it is plain to see that if he is over them, this could rise and he could be a top player.

DGL - 3, has been a failure, but was always a backup striker and wasn't expensive.

Young - 7, steady and has removed the problem with our problem RB spot.

Ali - 6 - played well but not got the goals to match it. Cheap for a striker.

Tuncay 7 - free transfer, starting to get the hang of prem league, but needs to be more consistent to match his big wages.

GaryO - 6.5 - worked hard, and shown glimpses of quality, but needs to show a bit more int he attacking 3rd.

Mido - 6? - it's a little hard to judge, due to injury. Looked good before inury, and has an excellant proven goal scoring record. when fit this could rise significantly.

Shawky - ? - cannot judge after 1 1/2 games. Could be a good player next year. cheap also.

Also he introduced Taylor and Wheater as first team starters which should be taken into account, as that saved us spending money.

BarnesBoroFC Posted on 15/01/2008 13:16
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10 - He's a novice and it's rare he turns a game for us, though I like his interviews, especially his recent MOTD comments. Please note we have only won 2 home games this season.
Signings so far: 6/10 - Solid signings, but we DO NEED a goal scorer.
Legend Potential: 8/10 - Thought he already was one, didn't he captain the team that won our only trophy?

indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 13:17
Southgate Ratings

Ok then, let's introduce another category.

Ability to replace players who've moved on - 0/10

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 13:19
Southgate Ratings

indestructible_7, how can he get zero when he replaced himself and Ugo with Woody and Huth/Wheats. He replaced Mendi who has moved on mentally with GaryO.

borolad259 Posted on 15/01/2008 13:23
Southgate Ratings

Management 6 (but improving)
Signings 8 (9 if he lands Alves)
Legend potential 7 ( a long way to go for that, but not a bad score for a novice).

indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 13:27
Southgate Ratings

Ok, he replaced himself with Woody, fair enough. Huth signing was already a done deal before he took over if I remember correctly?

Mendi wasn't even a regular when he took over, so I'm not counting that one. He spent his first year without a proven right winger despite the fact that Steve Mc didn't have one when he left either.

He has also replaced 3 top class strikers (Viduka, Jimmy, Yak) and Massimo (who would get you 6/8 a season) with 4 who have scored 7 league goals between them in 22 games. That is where he has fallen down really.

Therefore, 1/10 (for getting in Woody to replace himself.

scuzzmonster Posted on 15/01/2008 13:27
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5.5/10
Signings so far: 6/10
Legend Potential: 9/10

Stabilo_Boss Posted on 15/01/2008 14:05
Southgate Ratings

Management 7/10
Signings 6
Legend Potential: already a legend from playing days. One of the, if not THE best, defender I've seen in a boro shirt.

I know we're 1 point off relegation so my management score takes into account: long term vision, attitude and honesty, difficult circumstances (i.e. 2 best strikers leaving club - no, I don't blame GS for that) and the aging unbalanced squad with which he was left. I think he has tried to address this with varying success. It was inevitable that we'd have to take a step backwards to restructure the club and I can see a really base of good, young talent taking shape.

People critcising him for the drop in ambition with his appointment seem to be blaming him for being himself. He can't control people's pre-judgements only work to change them.

I backed him when appointed, back him now and have never wavered. An absolute asset to MFC.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 14:08
Southgate Ratings

The boss mans average ratings so far:

Management so far: 5.7/10
Signings so far: 6.4/10
Legend Potential: 7.9/10

Libbins Posted on 15/01/2008 14:10
Southgate Ratings

Good post Boss... Boss.

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 14:12
Southgate Ratings

"I backed him when appointed, back him now and have never wavered. An absolute asset to MFC"

his man-management skills leave a lot to be desired. hence why top players are leaving. plus he is still picking aliadiere upfront and given DGL too many chances

BoroInLondon Posted on 15/01/2008 14:13
Southgate Ratings

"clearly no ability to coach defences given backroom staff comprised entirely of defenders"

Ever thought that he has defensive coaches because he is the MANAGER? Thought not, you were just desperately scurrying around for another stick.

Management so far: 6/10
Signings so far: 8/10
Legend Potential: 9/10

I think his signings have been excellent, with the exception of one or two. Plenty of potential and a lot more to come.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 14:15
Southgate Ratings

"his man-management skills leave a lot to be desired. hence why top players are leaving. plus he is still picking aliadiere upfront and given DGL too many chances"

His man management is first class and which top players are leaving? He's persisted with DGL because due to injury we have had no other options.

Libbins Posted on 15/01/2008 14:16
Southgate Ratings

"he is still picking aliadiere upfront and given DGL too many chances"

Who the hell else is he going to pick?

Sorry sas but your speaking out of your backside on this one.

indestructible_7 Posted on 15/01/2008 14:20
Southgate Ratings

Lisbon, Viduka, yak and Jimmy have all left since he took over, and now Stewy looks like he is, and George nearly did. I don't see how you can judge his man-management skills if you've never worked for him either.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 14:21
Southgate Ratings

Jimmy was old, Viduka was greedy and Yak was a doyle. Downing is leaving because of the fans, not cos of Southgate. Plus he's not gone anywhere yet.

Algarve Posted on 15/01/2008 14:22
Southgate Ratings

As he was the guy who lifted our first ever trophy, how can he ever be anything other than a legend, whatever he does in management

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 14:24
Southgate Ratings

George almost left but instead produced a man of the match display against Liverpool and scored his first goal of the season. Top class man management.

Stabilo_Boss Posted on 15/01/2008 14:26
Southgate Ratings

Sas, who do you think he should pick up front?!

Overall I've been disappointed with Aliadiere but he's clearly a better option that LDG. If he played Tuncay up on his own people would only slate him for that.

Man management is a tricky one. I'm not really sure how we can say for definite. There were rumours of the George bust up but that's gossip. I think it showed he was prepared to take tough decisions in dropping him.

People said he'd fallen out with Tunc and then he ran to the dugout after scoring.

He never singles out players for criticism in the media and the development of and courage in, for example, Wheater has been great.

Downing? Who knows. I'll be gutted to see him go but whether this is more to do with GS or agents is debatable.

Stabilo_Boss Posted on 15/01/2008 14:29
Southgate Ratings

Also re Aliadiere, some might say that sticking by an out-of-form striker and showing he has faith in him is good man-management.

...Although I do think in this case it's lack of other options!

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 14:32
Southgate Ratings

Libbins, not talking out of my arse. aliadiere has proved he is not a goal score time and time again. Even an inexperienced centre back has outscored him.

southgate is a legends as a player but as a manager he is not a legend.

Critical_Bill Posted on 15/01/2008 14:34
Southgate Ratings

"Downing is leaving because of the fans"

Absolute gash. If you believe that you are more gullible than you actually appear.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 14:35
Southgate Ratings

You're obviously one of the culprits then Bill trying to denounce your guilt.

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 14:45
Southgate Ratings

"Huth signing was already a done deal before he took over if I remember correctly?" -- so was Douala, and he pulled the plug. Huth is a Southgate signing, full stop.

"Mendi wasn't even a regular when he took over, so " -- OK he has replaced the lightweight Morrison with GaryO, it's still a case of Southgate replacing a player with a better one.

Mido for Viduka is like for like......I'm sure your next point will be Midos injured all the time and lazy, but then everyone argued the same points about Viduka when he was here.

"aliadiere has proved he is not a goal score time and time again." -- Ali has started 22 league games, many of them he has played after coming back from an injury and he has often played on his own up fornt for us. I fail to see how he that constitutes 'time and time again'. I agree his goalscoring has been dissapointing, but lets not go overboard here.

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 14:51
Southgate Ratings

right on queue! boromart still trying to justify aliadiere as a goal scorer! you should have listened to what i said in the summer!

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 14:53
Southgate Ratings

Sas, I don't think Southgate thought he would be a 20 goal a season man but thought he chip in with his fair share, say 10 goals.

Critical_Bill Posted on 15/01/2008 14:53
Southgate Ratings

sas, I think Boromart should be a criminal lawyer.
defending the undefendable

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 14:58
Southgate Ratings

not at all. Firstly I agree with Lisbon, 10 goal a season man. But to acheive that he has to be played in the right role. alongside a target man, and he has to stay fit, so that he can acheive his optimum match fitness. Neither of these things have happened.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. He looked a goalscorer alongside Julio Baptiste for Arsenal, he looked a goal scorer in his 1 1/2 games alongside Mido.

Bandy Posted on 15/01/2008 15:00
Southgate Ratings

after skimming this rather tasty thread, so far I have gathered that Lisbon, Algarve and Boromart are on the ball as usual and sas is diggin himself an early grave.

I'm well happy with Lisbon's Southgate vision. he's a changed man!

Libbins Posted on 15/01/2008 15:02
Southgate Ratings

His goalscoring is unacceptable, you can't defend that, However, there is no way on earth you can say he is a bad signing. When he's in the team we're far more dangerous. He just has no confidence what so ever. He'll be great coming off the bench when we get some proper marksmen.
I agree with a few of you when you say he's a poor striker by definition, but you one thing i don't agree with is that he's a bad signing.

Revenelli Posted on 15/01/2008 15:02
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 7/10
Signings so far: 7/10
Legend Potential: 10/10 - He's already a legend for lifting the CC but as a manager he has the potential too

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 15:06
Southgate Ratings

"10 goal a season"

i think you mean "1 goal a season"

i do think he may get 2 more goals before end of season plus 1 against mansfield. but just not enoughg really. iu think he will end up wrming the bench once southgate gets some strikers in at some point. what is his right role. where he will score goals? do you think southgate is aware of this role you have discovered for him?

what is southgate vision? get rid of our best players and spead the money round the team

Critical_Bill Posted on 15/01/2008 15:07
Southgate Ratings

Bandy, I think you and the others that you mention seem a bit too easy to please.

Bandy Posted on 15/01/2008 15:10
Southgate Ratings

Sas, you are getting more naive by the minute - I though you were smart? Do you really think for one second southgate wanted rid of Yak, Viduka and Downing? Honestly? Circumstances dictate...Viduka was trying to shaft the club into financial meltdown, Yakubu stopped playing for the which is criminal by any standard as he has ripped you off right infront of your very eyes and Downing looks like he is off which is purley down to politics so what is gareth supposed to do - beg Viduak to stay and only ask for an extra fiver a week, kiss Yaks arse or lick downing boots??

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 15:11
Southgate Ratings

We can see the bigger picture Bill whereas you just enjoy a good whinge.

BoroThruNThru Posted on 15/01/2008 15:11
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 5/10
Signings so far: 6.5/10
Legend Potential: 4/10.
We are one point above relagation and have been for the last 10 -15 games and people give him 7's and 8's and 9's. ????
Quite incredicle how low the standards and expectations in place by SOME supporters of Middlesbrough. If Southgate actually gets us to a comfortable mid table position what might the likes of Lisbon Leg end and other low standard folk actually do ?

Bandy Posted on 15/01/2008 15:12
Southgate Ratings

thank you lisbon. Bill, take off your cyprus goggles

Critical_Bill Posted on 15/01/2008 15:13
Southgate Ratings

"The bigger picture"

Pointless cliche alert.
Where did you get that from, the 'Middle-management bollox phrase-book'

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 15:14
Southgate Ratings

BoroThruNThru, I can understand your point but I actually enjoy going to watch the team now whereas for a while there I would rather go to the pub. I think that now we're injury free we have a superb defence and potentially a great attack by the end of the transfer window, fingers crossed.

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 15:15
Southgate Ratings

with southgate the players were all behind him when he did did that team talk a few years ago when smac was manager. But now the top players are leaving, southgate is finding it difficult to persuade players to stay. they players just feel the club isnt going place anymore and looking to jump ship. I tend to feel southgate isnt imposing any influence on these players and they want to get out. this migh explain our poor league form and only playing well against top teams as they want to impress.

Maybe the players feel the club has lost some ambition with southgate as manager. Seems like players want to leave and play for a manager who has a good reputation

its like the roeder factor.

hewielewie Posted on 15/01/2008 15:16
Southgate Ratings

Borothruandthru how can you put that for Legend potential? He is the only Boro captain to lift a major trophy so he is already a legend in my eyes. You sound like a Geordie talking about expectations and the like

hewielewie Posted on 15/01/2008 15:19
Southgate Ratings

Sas, players have and will always leave clubs like Middlesbrough. It isn't a nice thought but it is the way of life.

Libbins Posted on 15/01/2008 15:20
Southgate Ratings

Bill,

It's not our low standards, it's simply patience.

We have a gem in Southgate. It's his 2nd season FFS!


Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 15:20
Southgate Ratings

" iu think he will end up wrming the bench once southgate gets some strikers in at some point." I wholehartedly agree, and I think he will be a supersub coming on against tired defences.

" what is his right role. where he will score goals? do you think southgate is aware of this role you have discovered for him?" -- I've just told you, playing off a target man. It's simple, his strength is pace. If he is playing as a lone striker, then he can't flick the ball on to himself, he isn't THAT fast. Your not gonna get a lot out of Aliadiere if you ask him to lead the line and hold the ball up. It just isn't playing to his strengths. I've seen Jermaine Defoe play as a loan striker and it's very similar. He needs to be facing goal and picking up the knockdowns, lay-offs, and through balls from someone like Mido. He still won't be prolific, but he will do OK.

I've given examples of when he has played in this role and been a goal threat. Brum being the prime example, very unfortunate to not score. Hit the post, keeper made about 3 stunning saves. It shows that in that role he gets into the right positions. He did the same at Arse in the cups with Baptiste, always looked a threat and scored a few too. But if you have examples of when he has played off a target man and been awful feel free to share them.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 15:22
Southgate Ratings

Exactly Libbins, spot on mate.

What Sas knows about football you can put on the back of a postage stamp. Bill knows a tiny bit more but is just on the wind up.

kermit Posted on 15/01/2008 15:24
Southgate Ratings

Am not sure how people can give his management ratings of over 6 because as of yet we've barely even been in the top half of the table, i'd go as far as to say we've probably been in it for a couple of weeks since he took over.

(it's probably more than that but my memory fails me)

We flirted with relegation last season and we are doing so this season. The odd result apart it's not been brilliant.

If Gareth didn't have such a status on Teesside I don't think he'd still have the support he does.

This January transfer window is a massive opportunity for him to win back some fans who are starting to lose patience, it could equally though be a disaster.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 15:27
Southgate Ratings

True kermit but we've continued to try and plaqy football despite having many of our better players injured. This proves he is strong mentally as there was a week or so there when the pressure was really on him. We responded by beating Arsenal, Derby, Portsmouth, Bristol City and a point against Liverpool.

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 15:27
Southgate Ratings

I think tuncay would play better just off a target man. plus he will score goals. so bang goes that role for aliadiere.

i bet in 12 months we are still having the same conversation about aliadiere. ie he will score goals when he is played in his proper position and free from injury.

"We have a gem in Southgate. It's his 2nd season FFS!"

yes and gone from a mid table, uefa cup finalists to 1 point above relegation in 18 months

southgate as manager is like shearer as newcastle manager. it is a joke when you think about it.

Critical_Bill Posted on 15/01/2008 15:28
Southgate Ratings

I'm not on the wind up.
We have moved backwards since he took up the reins.

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 15:30
Southgate Ratings

"I think tuncay would play better just off a target man. plus he will score goals. so bang goes that role for aliadiere." - possibly. I think you may get more goals from Tuncay in that role, but more assists from Ali. But yes they play a similar role. It's the lazy option to state that Tuncay is obviously better, he has been allowed to play his favoured role, Ali hasn't.

BoroThruNThru Posted on 15/01/2008 15:31
Southgate Ratings

hewielewie - your the sort of supporter that Boro want rid of !!!!!! Not low standards, you have NO standards.
You have expectations and people then jump on you and say your impatient. FFS!
We were on the crest of a wave after the UEFA Cup final and an experienced manager would've been able to make the changes necessary without the 'transition' bollox we are being fed.
Lisbon and his cronies are like 'ducks in a row' waiting to be shot. Complete yes men. Tell the truth FFS!
We are fighting relegation, rumoured to be losing one of oour top players and linked with some no-mark striker from Motherwell who rangers released!
Southgate = wrong manager, wrong time.
Gibson = either no money left or bottled it when appointing someone who actually knew how it is really done. Management that is.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 15:31
Southgate Ratings

Yes but sas we weren't mid table were we, we were bottom half of the table with an expensive ageing squad. We also got smashed in the UEFA cup final 4-0.

Bill, as soon as you said you weren't on the wind up, I knew you were.[:)]

BoroThruNThru Posted on 15/01/2008 15:39
Southgate Ratings

Sas - keep explaining to these rose tinted glasses folk the truth. We have gone back over because the likes of lamb and gibson who own the club say we overachieved in the last 10 years or so ? (and so now just above relegation in their minds we are doing well are we ?!!!)
And then they defend SMAC when his brand of football put everyone to sleep, so, what do they do, they go and appoint a total novice to manage an established (yet boring) premier league club when they could've appointed a top manager (O neill or hitzfeld) and started to actually fill the staduim, because we can fill the f***ing staduim if we seen a top manger here demanding top permformances week in week out, but no, we get southgate and his namby pamby approach and a passionate performance only when the big boys come to town because players can motivate themselves for those games.
You lot cant see the wood for the trees.

Libbins Posted on 15/01/2008 15:40
Southgate Ratings

We needed to rebuild the squad anyway after the final.
Our current position this season and last season is inevitable considering we needed 1 or 2 seasons to build the new foundations.

Libbins Posted on 15/01/2008 15:40
Southgate Ratings

double post.

BoroThruNThru Posted on 15/01/2008 15:45
Southgate Ratings

Libbins - Hey Sas, have you heard the latest interpretation of 'transition' ..its 'we needed to build a new foundation' hahahahahahahahaha...
complete and utter bollox. you just fancy defending the indefensible. It's Gibson who is responsible for where we are not Southgate. Southgate is execueting and Gibson is the architect.
Boro while Gibson remains in charge with the mentality of - 'we have been over achieving' will take us no-where.
Awaits abuse from the mindless folk who cant see a fault in their beloved.

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 15:47
Southgate Ratings

I see aliadiere as a nice footballer, techincally good with pace but the problem is there is no position for him where he is the best player for that position. he doesnt score goals so cant play as a striker, he has pace which could be used out wide but i dont think he is a very good crosser, can he tackle in midfield? probably not. I think wenger found the same issue and finally realised there is no role he fits into. At best i think he will be a supersub type player who can come off the bench with 20 minutes to go with his pace. Even wheater in as a centre back is outscoring aliadiere upfront.

Lisbonlegend, we have gone backwards it is pretty obvious. players are wanting to leave and we are closer to relegation than we have for a few years now. after the uefa cup final the club could have thought big and look for a proven manager to push us on and attract players. instead we appointed a player as manager. when was the last time a top flight club did that?

after being told we were going for continuity, we now are going for rebuild. Another problem with appointing southgate as amanger was that his ex team mates probably cant get use to the fact he is now their manager rather than a team mate. A top draw manage would be more influential on players.

BoroThruNThru Posted on 15/01/2008 15:52
Southgate Ratings

Here's one for you - If gibson thought we have been over achieving for the last 10 years, then why fill in the corners because surely when we find our 'true' level, whatever he thinks that is ???????
Then we wouldn't be able to fill the stadium with 34,500 supporters because we are only either a top championship side or a low premiership side ?
Ultimately though, Gibson's logic is totally floored.
If we can (and we did for a spell under Robson) fill the stadium then how is finishing low to mid table year on year and getting to the odd cup final over achieving with a 35k sell out crowd ?
Complete and utter bollox from Gibson. Total spin from Lamb and Gibson as always.
I love Boro and always will but there is a scent running through the club which smells awful. Its a stale smell from our top management.

Bandy Posted on 15/01/2008 15:56
Southgate Ratings

"Gibson's logic is totally floored"

Flawed

Tom_Fun Posted on 15/01/2008 15:57
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 6/10
Signings so far: 7/10
Legend Potential: 10/10

BoroThruNThru Posted on 15/01/2008 16:00
Southgate Ratings

Sas, you are getting more naive by the minute - I though you were smart? Do you really think for one second southgate wanted rid of Yak, Viduka and Downing? Honestly? Circumstances dictate...Viduka was trying to shaft the club into financial meltdown, Yakubu stopped playing for the which is criminal by any standard as he has ripped you off right infront of your very eyes and Downing looks like he is off which is purley down to politics so what is gareth supposed to do - beg Viduak to stay and only ask for an extra fiver a week, kiss Yaks arse or lick downing boots??

BANDY - This is why it is Gibsons fault. A top manager wouldn't have had these issues. The players would've felt somewhat inspired by a top manager coming in NOT ex player now telling them whats what.
You couldn't make it up - things like this only happen at Boro.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 16:01
Southgate Ratings

"Lisbonlegend, we have gone backwards it is pretty obvious. players are wanting to leave and we are closer to relegation than we have for a few years now. after the uefa cup final the club could have thought big and look for a proven manager to push us on and attract players. instead we appointed a player as manager. when was the last time a top flight club did that?"

Erm, which players are wanting to leave? We did look for a proven manager and decided he wasn't right for the club sp we went for potential. A slower process but hopefully a more fruitful outcome. If you haven't got the patience or intelligence to see what is happening at Middlesbrough Fottball Club then that is your problem I'm afraid.

Does it matter when the last time a top flight club appointed a player as a manager. Do you have to follow all the old traits to achieve success? Did it work for Newcastle?

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 16:27
Southgate Ratings

yes patience, ..err like waiting 5 years after uefa cup final to see if southgate can get us back to where we were before he was appointed. how about getting in a proven manager who can have an impact in half the time or less

hewielewie Posted on 15/01/2008 16:29
Southgate Ratings

Borothrunthru, don't you have a Youth Club to go to? You are the type of Geordie sound-a-like that this club doesn't need. I couldn't be bothered to read all your drivel but I get the gist that you don't seem to realise the climate football is in at the moment. You seem to think that throwing money at it is the way forward, well I have news for you Borothrunthru (but only after 1995). The current financial climate cannot be sustained and when the chips land I know whose camp I would rather be in. Now why don't you pop up the road to a club where your short sighted, spoilt kid views will be appreciated.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 16:29
Southgate Ratings

How do you know that another manager would have made an impact in half the time or less? You live in cloud cuckoo land.

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 16:35
Southgate Ratings

because he is would have been a proven manager, certainly more chance of succeeding than appointing a player as manager

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 16:36
Southgate Ratings

In your world maybe.

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 16:38
Southgate Ratings

"We have gone back over because the likes of lamb and gibson who own the club say we overachieved in the last 10 years or so" -- I'm afraid they haven't said that, ever. You made that up.

"(and so now just above relegation in their minds we are doing well are we ?!!!)" -- again they never said that. Making up things actually weakens any credibility your argument has.

"they go and appoint a total novice to manage an established (yet boring) premier league club when they could've appointed a top manager (O neill or hitzfeld)" -- At last a little sens. Although I don't agree that O'Neill would be a top manager. The world of footy has moved on since his Leicester days, and the reason he has got Villa up to UEFA cup spot is because his chairman has supplied him with 50million in the transfer market in 12 months. Hitzfeld however, if it's true he put his CV on the table, should have been snapped up. We did let the UEFA cup momentum subside, we didn't take advantage of our successes. But lets not forget that from 04-06 was easily this clubs high water mark. It is naiave to think that year upon year improvement is sustainable, or that the other 19 teams won't do everything they can to try and catchup and ultimately take over.

The biggest reason we have gone backwards for me, isn't the choice of manager, it is the fact that since that UEFA cup around 6 or 7 prem teams have been bought out by and had massive sums of money invested in their playing staff. Pompey, West Ham, Villa, Newcastle, Sunderland, Man City. We were certainly higher in the financial pecking order than 6 of those teams, and low and behold we drop about 6 places in the league. Coincidence???


sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 16:40
Southgate Ratings

In the end we are 1 point away from the relegation zone and that has to be down to the manager and coachign staff

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 16:54
Southgate Ratings

so the players available to the manager, and how those players apply themselves is irrelevant?

I think you are oversimplifying the cause of the effect, so that its suits your argument. The manager, chairman, coaches, players, fans, Sky and the prem are all partially to blame for our demise in the last couple of seasons.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 16:57
Southgate Ratings

"In the end we are 1 point away from the relegation zone and that has to be down to the manager and coachign staff"

Partly, yes but it's also down to the players, the crowd, the weather, the referees, the fixture list, etc.

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 17:01
Southgate Ratings

make your mind up boromart, either the players are carp or players are good but the coaches and managers arnt getting them playing to the best.

Lisbon, good reasons..you should email them to southgate.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 15/01/2008 17:05
Southgate Ratings

The season hasn't finished, it's a marathon and not a sprint. Are you Freddie Shepherd in disguise?

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 17:13
Southgate Ratings

sas, my mind IS made up, you just chose not to accept that. They are all partially to blame, it's quite a simple concept to understand.

Why does everything have to be extremes with you? Why the need for individual blame? I wuoldn't like to be in the trenches with you, your not really into the concept of shared responsibility!

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 17:16
Southgate Ratings

it is not extreme. do you not understand the logic in appointing a proven manager over appointing a player as manager with no coaching experience and qualifications. How can you expect to improve or succeed with an inexperienced manager. You are givcing yourself a handicap even before the season kicks off. I think some of the players think the same and want to move on. Is there any guarantee that under southgate we will be anything mroe than a team fighting off relegation rather than pushing for europe.

you would never see a top 4 club appoint a player as a manager with no experience or qualifications. it the sort of thing you would expect from the barcodes

Boromart Posted on 15/01/2008 17:20
Southgate Ratings

"do you not understand the logic in appointing a proven manager " -- read my post of 16:38.

" Is there any guarantee that under southgate we will be anything mroe than a team fighting off relegation rather than pushing for europe" -- is there any GUARANTEE that under Hitzfeld we would advance forward? e wouldn't have had any/much more money than southgate, so your still asking him to perform miracles to keep up with the Jones's.

"you would never see a top 4 club appoint a player as a manager " -- I've got news for you Sas, we are not and have never been anywhere near a top 4 team in my life. Comparing us with them is a waste of time, Manure made a 60million pound profit this year, we lost money.

Moses_Kiptanui Posted on 15/01/2008 17:25
Southgate Ratings

Sas, why are all your points so negative?

Do you not realise all the positive points of employing an International defender who has been through almost everything as a player, has been a leader at every club he's been at, knows MFC inside out, is respected by players and fans, is incredibly intelligent and is a proven winner.

Sometimes I think you must be posting from your creche.

Moses_Kiptanui Posted on 15/01/2008 18:05
Southgate Ratings

The boss mans average ratings so far:

Management so far: 5.7/10
Signings so far: 6.5/10
Legend Potential: 7.9/10

sasboro1 Posted on 15/01/2008 18:15
Southgate Ratings

"Sas, why are all your points so negative? "

because we are 1 point above relegation position and 1 point above sunderland. Southgate has spent about 25m+ and no nearer improving. plus we have lost 2 star strikers and probably going to lose our star creative player. All because we appointed a player as manager.

br14 Posted on 15/01/2008 18:19
Southgate Ratings

This could be his worst moment at the club. On the other hand maybe it's sheer brilliance. Only time will tell.

Losing Downing looks like weakening our already toothless midfield - regardless of how much we spend on a striker.

We need to strengthen our midfield not weaken it.

One point above the relegation spots so I hope he knows what he's doing.

HolgateEnd Posted on 15/01/2008 18:35
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 3/10
-Has made poor tactical decisions on numerous occasions
-Makes poor substitutions
-Doesnt seem to be able to motivate the team before or during a match
-Doesnt seem to instill confidence in the team
-Players refuse to come off when he tries to sub them (Mido twice, O'Neil twice)
-Doesnt have the experience needed to manage a modern-day premier league club
-Claims he doesnt like the January transfer window and "cant wait to see the back of it", when we're in a position where we desperately need to buy some quality players
-Has taken us from mid-table and a UEFA cup final when McClaren left to being 1 point from a relegation place in 18 months despite spending £30m +

Signings so far: 5/10
-Euell, Dong Gook Lee, Hutchinson all shyte
-Huth, Woodgate, Mido, all good players but with poor injury record which has continued here
-Aliadiere, bought as a striker but couldnt hit a cows arse with a banjo
-Tuncay, Arca, O'Neil, good buys but I wish O'Neil could shoot

Legend Potential: 5/10
-He does have the potential to become a legend because of his status when he was a player, but has a long way to go to emulate the only 2 real legendary Boro managers, Charlton and Rioch

Posted on 15/01/2008 19:10
Southgate Ratings

Right, let's try and get this one point above relegation thing in perspective. Who actually thinks we'll go down? I certainly don't feel any more worried than I did after the 4-0 home defeat to Villa in McClaren's reign. And then we had a wonderous, world-beating team apparently...

Mmmm, in reality it was a team of experienced, talented but old and expensive players. Hasselbaink, Viduka, Ugo, Mendi, George... big names on high wages with no profit left in them.

Over this period or since, Villa, Pompey, City etc have received a huge influx of funds from foreign investors. Boro (wonderfully imo) show no sign of taking this route and therefore can not afford to directly replace the likes of those listed above.

So we appoint from within, a man of intelligence and respect, who knows the club's youth system, understands the fans want an improved style of football yet also realises the financial constraints we now operate in have increased.

So we buy young, hungry but unproven players, we promote the youth team and we move out the big earners... and we take a step backwards. Why are people shocked by this?! Football goes in cycles - only the idiot Man Utd and Arsenal fans called for Ferguson or Wenger's head when they missed out on trophies in recent seasons. Most of the sensible ones realised that you can't have endless or instant success. If you want a team to grow you have to accept that they are going to make mistakes learning. And now Arsenal's team of youngsters that people said couldn't cut it are proving them wrong.

And no, I'm not saying Southgate is the new Wenger or we're going to be challenging at the top but as a model for success I am delighted that we're investing in youth and talent over greed for instant gratification.

Will it be successful? Who knows. But I know if we want it to it will take time. And I also know that if you're impatient and try and maintain success by spending and spending, you can easily end up like Leeds.

Yeah, we're in a battle and it'll be a long hard season but I get just as much pleasure seeing a young, local centre back finishing off a sweeping move against Bristol City as I did seeing Zenden or Geremi (or any other player who used us as a stepping stone)scoring against the big boys.

I think we stand out in the current climate of football and although it doesn't have the perceived glory of before, I think we should be proud.


Tomdoodle Posted on 15/01/2008 19:16
Southgate Ratings

Management: 6/10
Signings: 6/10
Legend Potential: 9/10

HolgateEnd Posted on 15/01/2008 19:30
Southgate Ratings

Mr Anonymous, I for one think we have a very real chance of being relegated, for the reasons in my post. If you watch the team every week you will see that they are not motivated, have no confidence, totally lack ideas of how to get back in the game when we concede a goal, miss chance after chance after chance. These are all things which Southgate's job as a manager is to improve. He isnt doing that, and we're in big trouble.

I for one, would rather see us sign Alves, fook Tottenham off and keep Downing and sign someone else to try and ensure we're still in the premier league next season. If it doesnt work, at least we'll have tried and can sell whoever doesnt want to stay.

The way its going, we're selling Downing, not sure if we're signing anyone and still not winning enough home games. All in all, that is a receipe for disaster.

dagwaie Posted on 15/01/2008 21:12
Southgate Ratings

Sas - comparing GS to Roeder is INTERESTING but I think incorrect. Hear me out.

You said:
"now the top players are leaving, southgate is finding it difficult to persuade players to stay. they players just feel the club isnt going place anymore and looking to jump ship. I tend to feel southgate isnt imposing any influence on these players and they want to get out. this migh explain our poor league form and only playing well against top teams as they want to impress."

You may well be right that the club isn't making as much headway as it used to a few years ago. But it is hard to tell whether Yakubu's comments were correct; Viduka's leaving (for money, not ambition) might have swayed his head.

But more importantly, the players ARE playing for the manager. Hansen commented on it on MOTD. I've linked Gary O'Neil's comments from a few weeks back. So your conclusion that players "want to get out" is going too far.

You are very entitled to your opinion, but in the same way some are too optimistic, you are too harsh.

As for only performing in big games, all teams suffer from that; even Sir Alex must struggle to motivate United for a game against mid-table teams compared to a game against Milan.



Link: \"We\'re all fighting for boss\"

John_Boro Posted on 15/01/2008 21:15
Southgate Ratings

calm down a bit lads,

management so far 5/10
signings, 8/10
legend potential, (it exists) 7/10

Lisbonlegend Posted on 16/01/2008 08:54
Southgate Ratings

Sas says "because we are 1 point above relegation position and 1 point above sunderland. Southgate has spent about 25m+ and no nearer improving. plus we have lost 2 star strikers and probably going to lose our star creative player. All because we appointed a player as manager."

He has spent £9m net. Players leaving is a fact of life, why does it upset you so? We now attack teams and give it a go instead of trying to bore teams into submission. We're not there yet but the signs are amazingly positive.

Losing our star creative player? We're not losing him, it's a choice the manager has made in order to improve the team. He will live or die by his decision but I feel it's in our best interests.

Sometimes the hardest decisions are the best decisions. Your Geordie mentality is quite laughable.

Boromart Posted on 16/01/2008 09:27
Southgate Ratings

Jeesus Sas, talk about twisting the facts to suit your argument.

"Negative.....because we are 1 point above relegation position and 1 point above sunderland." -- Yes we are, but your negative when we are higher up the table, in a cup final, or even when it is pre-season. If we were 6th you would still bleat about lack of ambition and weaknesses in our squad.

"Southgate has spent about 25m+ and no nearer improving."
No he has spent less than 9 net. He has dramatically reduced the age of the squad, which long term will serve us well.

I'm sure you will be thinking well, we haven't seen 9mill worht of improvement. that is correct, but you have to spend to stand still. Players get older and lose there worth. Take Boat we bought him for 5, and with the inflatted transfer market he was probably worth about 8mill 3 years ago. But age has now reduced his value/worth to about 1mill. You have to spend just to stand still, and we had an aging squad.

Also Our 9 mill net spend pales into insignificance against the other teams, fulham have spent about 25mill net. Two years ago we must have had about the 10th most expensive squad, now we have about the 17th. We are financially falling behind, but expectations from some fans have stayed the same. That isn't to say that I have no ambition, just that I expect it to be more difficult and a slower task to acheive those ambitions.

To say that is all down to southgate is blinkered and naiave. I'm sure he would have loved to spend more than he has, equal to the other prem sides. I'm sure he would have loved to keep Viduka and Yak, but his hands are tied. Surely if you think the loss of those two players is a major part of the issue, then you are actually blaming Gibson, he is ultimately in charge of the purse strings.

Bandy Posted on 16/01/2008 11:23
Southgate Ratings

sas, here's your spade mate :)

Lisbonlegend Posted on 16/01/2008 11:26
Southgate Ratings

I don't think there's a spade big enough, Bandy.

smoggieboy Posted on 16/01/2008 11:28
Southgate Ratings

is it really southgate who makes the signings or even decides on them or is it lamb, gibson, scouts?

Bandy Posted on 16/01/2008 11:29
Southgate Ratings

when sas gets his defensive head on he thinks like a businessman and not like a football man. There's the difference.

sasboro1 Posted on 16/01/2008 11:29
Southgate Ratings

what spade? a spade wont be anyuse in moving us away from a relegation position.

like i said look at the table, we are only 1 point above sunderland,bolton,wigan, birmingham and a relegation position. a more expereinced manager would not have us in this dire situation. lets be honest this situation was not written on the tin when we were promised a top draw amanger but then ended up with a southgate botch job

Lisbonlegend Posted on 16/01/2008 11:31
Southgate Ratings

Sas doesn't understand the game or what it takes to be a successful team. He thinks if you spend money you are gauranteed success. Sas, you need to have a rethink and then come back and post.

sasboro1 Posted on 16/01/2008 11:36
Southgate Ratings

haha! you are funnt lisbon..all just to get a double ton!

Lisbonlegend Posted on 16/01/2008 11:39
Southgate Ratings

I'm afraid it's true sas and wasn't meant in jest. You're views are unbelievably blinkered and lack any foresight. You are the Freddy Shepherd of the Boro Board.

sasboro1 Posted on 16/01/2008 11:42
Southgate Ratings

of course my views are blinkered..obviously you havent looked at the league table this season [:D]

Lisbonlegend Posted on 16/01/2008 11:49
Southgate Ratings

I have and I'm not happy with all that's gone on but Southgates response for me has been key to my beliefs. I think I love him.

Bandy Posted on 16/01/2008 11:52
Southgate Ratings

If sas was chairman we'd have had ten managers in ten months and we'd be playing Plymouth next week

Lisbonlegend Posted on 16/01/2008 11:56
Southgate Ratings

Exactly Bandy. Sometimes I think he's just escaped from a mental institution.

Sas stars as Jack Nicholson in 'One Flew Over the Cuckoos Nest'

sasboro1 Posted on 16/01/2008 12:00
Southgate Ratings

if i was chairman i would have got a better manager in than southgate and wouldnt be 1 point from a relegation place

Lisbonlegend Posted on 16/01/2008 12:20
Southgate Ratings

Who would you have got like?

BoroThruNThru Posted on 16/01/2008 12:22
Southgate Ratings

Sas - you have presented the facts as they stand, but when it suits them the likes of bandy and lisbo and boromart and moses like to twist facts, thats right facts! 1 point above the relegation zone, to suit their point of view.
No-one jumped out of their chair when southgate was appointed and they know it.
The problem lies with who choose southgate.
But, for the record, for his first job southgate is doing ok considering the circumstances he was appointed. This doesnt though answer the Middlesbrough football club question of is southgate doing well enough for ME AS a middlesbrough supporter ? The answer is a resounding NO.

ExFootyLegs Posted on 16/01/2008 12:25
Southgate Ratings

Of course Southgate is struggling to find his feet and IMHO he wont find his feet despite the 'spin' that lisbon whoever he is called comes out with.
I agree with Borothruandthru. The issue is who appointed him.
And to answer the original post :
Management so far: 4/10
Signings so far: 5.5/10
Legend Potential: 5/10
This is realistic since we have fallen so far behind when we couldve pushed on and appointed a top manager but we appointed a lame duck.

AyresomeJoy Posted on 16/01/2008 12:38
Southgate Ratings

The thing is southgate has given it his best shot. But his best isnt good enough. people on this board swallow whole and believe everything gibson and lamb and southgate tell us about being in 'transition' . You didnt hear O neill say that when arriving at villa. He couldve said that, but BECAUSE HE HAS EXPEREINCE ! He knew what to do, how to mould a team and squad without having to use a bollox spin word like transition to buy himself time.
Boro have fallen way back. Good on you sas for sticking to your guns with these people who refuse to see any isses within the club.
I like southgate, dont get me wrong, but is he fit to lead us ? The facts prove he isnt, no major signings other than woodgate and now he cant get a performance out of him !
The yak farce wouldve been avoided had an expereinced manager beed dealing with that.
Viduka may of stayed had another more inspiring and expereinced manager been at the helm.
(and all those who say we were best rid of a player like that - no pace etc...look at MIDO!!!! HE IS A POOR Mans Mark Viduka)
Southgate said he wanted a change in style to fast flowing football - what a laugh - and then signs slow coach Mido, very similar to Viduka but with a worse injury record !!

Bownstar Posted on 16/01/2008 12:40
Southgate Ratings

Managment so far: 7
Signings: 5
Legend: 8

Bandy Posted on 16/01/2008 12:44
Southgate Ratings

Sas, you seem to think it is so easy to go out an employ a proven manager that would guarantee instant progression. These guys come at a price and even if the price is right why would they come to Boro in the first place. Look at the problems newcastle are having getting a manager and they are a far more attractive proposition. Why cant you see this? Gibson isnt as daft as he seems in your eyes, he's a millionaire, and pays himself to make important decisions, more often right than wrong, thats why he doesnt spend half his time on here and we do

AyresomeJoy Posted on 16/01/2008 12:46
Southgate Ratings

l-i-s-b-o-n leg ender - Gibson bottled it with O Neill who quite rightly wanted to bring in his own staff and gibson wanted to keep the likes of round and harrison etc...I wouldve been worried if O neill didnt want to bring in his own staff!
Hitzfeld - another top notch manager who was available and Gibson looked at him but decided he wanted an english manager because he didnt want his club ran by germans. Why not ?
What is Gibsons logic here ?
Gibson is searching right now for players all over the globe (so we are led to believe) but wont have a foriegn manager. Hypocrisy of the purest kind is the word for that.

Bandy Posted on 16/01/2008 12:47
Southgate Ratings

Ayresome Joy: you must have been chief recruiting officer at the time were you? Either that or you are just casting bullS*** assumptions to make yourself look better

AyresomeJoy Posted on 16/01/2008 12:52
Southgate Ratings

Bandy - do you call losing 10,000 fans in 3 years clever thinking by Gibson ?
He still thinks the SMAC era was the best we have ever had. He is right it is from a purely achievement aspect, but because of all the fans we have lost then you have to look a bit deeper that this simplistic view. The majority of the football played under the last 18 months with robson and all of the era under SMAC was boring, passionless and poor.
People wont pay to watch that and have rightly walked away, only to hear Gibson still defending that era and spinning it to suit him, when the truth is it was largely crap.

Bandy Posted on 16/01/2008 12:56
Southgate Ratings

largely crap?????

Enlighten me as to why. We beat teams all over Europe and got to a major final. You dont do that by playing crap football.

Oh, we won the League cup aswell. I'm guessing you were about 15yrs old then and have never witnessed crap football before.

It was crap when rava and Juno were here. I remember us shipping more goals than we have this season.

AyresomeJoy Posted on 16/01/2008 13:33
Southgate Ratings

Bandy - i was at the games were we came back from the dead. we were out of it and SMAC threw on players with no discernible tactics and it worked.
In the game against steua southgate got injured when we went 0-3 behind and HAD to come off so SMAC threw on a forward in Maccarone otherwise, when would he have made a change ? who knows.
These highlights were excellent but, thats all they were, highlights. I dont remember one game leading to the CC Cup final other than playing aresenl's 2nd team at highbury - remember that ?
Hardly inspirational / but, we beat who we had to beat, but in truth we didnt pull up trees and we only play a we average side in bolton in the final and still beat them despite skippy throwing a goal in for them!
Other than that, everything else was largely poor. we beat teams away in europe with dour football and hardly any shots on target, players continually playing out of position...do you want me to go on ?

sasboro1 Posted on 16/01/2008 13:39
Southgate Ratings

let us not beat around the bush about this season, the football has been pretty poor and dull in general and not the attractive attacking footballl we were promised

Stabilo_Boss Posted on 16/01/2008 14:13
Southgate Ratings

Ayresome Joy, I'm guessing your user name is ironic then?

So we've gone miles backwards from the Uefa cup final... However we were never any good during that time anyway. Contradictions galore.

Whilst we had the individuals to produce big results at that time, I do actually agree that the football was generally not great and McClaren seriously damaged the relationship between club and fans. Which is exactly why I think Southgate is trying to revamp the whole system. What do fans want? More local intergration, more youth development, openess and honesty. I think he's brough all those. If all fans want is big name signings then they're not the fans that the club can rely on long term anyway. And if people can't see that we're trying to play a more open, progressive style then they're not watching properly.

I can't deny it's not produced the results this season. Clearly the points tell a story but we go back the Rome wasn't built in day thing.

I can't deny that a bigger name, experienced coach may have had more pulling power for players but the problems would have been the same. We were still a club spending too much on aging star names, having to replace these massive earners on regular basis in an increasingly competitive environment. It's simply unsustainable. Call it lack of ambition if you like, I'll call it sensible management.

We're trying

atarisdodds Posted on 16/01/2008 14:42
Southgate Ratings

Southgate signings

Mido 4/10 - Disappointing, lazy and moody and has been out for ever.

Huth 5/10 - Excellent when he's played. Problem is he never plays.

Shawky 6/10 - Not given a chance really but looked decent against Pompey.

Woodgate 7.5/10 - Good last season, hasn't built on last seasons form this term though

Young 8/10 - Very good and cut price tag as well.

O'Neil 7.5/10 - I worry that he can't shoot, but 100% commitment can't be doubted. Will he ever score a goal?

Arca 7.5/10 - Good signing but not captain material. Has not been as good this year as last IMO but still a very important part of the team.

Dong Gook Lee 1/10 - Worst player i've ever seen at the Riverside.

Euell 3/10 - Looked promising on his debut but rubbish ever since, delighted he left the club.

Aliadiere 5/10 - Runs a lot and tries hard, but one goal all season, same as Dong Gook Lee€€

Boromart Posted on 16/01/2008 15:08
Southgate Ratings

"Sas - you have presented the facts as they stand, but when it suits them the likes of bandy and lisbo and boromart and moses like to twist facts, thats right facts! 1 point above the relegation zone, to suit their point of view."
That is one fact. There are plenty of other facts, by taking one fact and ignoring all others then that is the ultimate in
twisting facts to "to suit your point of view". It's an over-simplification, a child-like view of the world. How do you expect Boro to improve as a club if we invest less than almost every other prem team? I've yet to here anyone answer this one.

"No-one jumped out of their chair when southgate was appointed and they know it." - sorry but thats rubbish, I wasn't impressed at the time and in this very thread I have repeated my view.

"But, for the record, for his first job southgate is doing ok considering the circumstances he was appointed. " -- so in that case you agree that Sas's 5 out of 10 and constant slating of Gate is silly?

Gate could yet become a very good manager, we just don't know. Moyes and Fergie both came close to the sack and are lorded as brilliant managers.

Tuncays_3rd_leg Posted on 16/01/2008 15:15
Southgate Ratings

Management so far: 6/10
Signings so far: 8/10
Legend Potential: 8/10