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bandito Posted on 23/9 17:13
What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Someone please tell me. Valid reasons only. Cliche's not accepted. Enter the word "negative" at your own risk. I call it being cautious. If my memory serves me correctly, Rioch overstayed his welcome, Colin Todd was pants, Lennie Lawrence was taking us to oblivion before Robbo arrived, Robbo put us on the map, failed miserably tactically and then Stevie Mac arrived.......since then, I dont really need to explain what he has achieved but in all reality I think a lot of you are just moaning for moaningsake. If you think were negative now, just look at how we couldnt beat Notts County in the play offs at home under Todd or lost to Oldham at home in a vital 6 pointer under Lawrence as examples of how bad it was. Now that was shyte. However I suspect the majority that are jamming the radio phone ins or penning garbage to the gazette didnt bother going then and instead chose to have another hobby until captain marvel arrived. Get a grip you pathetic people. some of the stuff said about McClaren is total bile and is being stirred up to ridiculous levels. Just stop and think before some of you start spouting your hatred.

dooderooni Posted on 23/9 17:21
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Mr bandito, please accept your double first in Ra-Ra-ness from the clique and go forth and spread your gospel amongst the great un-washed of Stocktonshire.

rob_fmttm Posted on 23/9 17:23
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Well, I'm going to reply to this if no one else is. Only to underline what Bandito has said and make sure it goes back to the top where it needs to be.

It's surely time to draw a line and start supporting this guy - he's the only Boro manager to ever reward our support with silverware and European football (twice) - I happen to think that is a massive acheivement. I want it to continue. I've waited long enough.

Support your team. Support your manager.

--- Post edited by rob_fmttm on 23/9 17:23 ---

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:23
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I HATE McCLAREN!!!!!!

rob_fmttm Posted on 23/9 17:24
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Why?

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:24
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Rob, I don't agree with you.

I anticipate my banning.

rob_fmttm Posted on 23/9 17:25
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Don't be stupid. But why do you hate McClaren?

Matelot Posted on 23/9 17:25
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

You have done it now.

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:25
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

He is tactically inept, terrible relationship with the fans, consistently picks the wrong team, wants to be England manager and is just using us as a training course... I could go on but I can't be bothered.

beeline Posted on 23/9 17:26
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Maybe that's because you love yourself so much you've nothing left for anyone else?

dooderooni Posted on 23/9 17:26
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I know the little fella comes in for some abuse over his views on cinema visits and telly and the like but he's spot on with this little rant.

I'd have called the dissenters ungrateful little wassocks who want the moon on stick but then I'm not as diplomatic as Napoleans stunt double.

borobadge Posted on 23/9 17:27
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

absolutly nothing....

the guys just about (after Sir Gibson)the best thing that has ever happened to Middlesbrough f.c.

i say after Sir Gibson for the simple reason that i expect Steve to be at the helm of the Good Ship Middlesbrough for the rest of his life..

Mac WILL move on at some stage , as all managers do...

support your team..support your manager..support YOUR club...

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:28
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

He also didn't sign an autograph for me claiming he was "in a rush" I saw him a few minutes later having a relaxed telephone conversation. I just don't like him... I think he is over-rated beyond belief.

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:28
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

For once can we have a reasoned debate without any sillyness?

Is that too much to ask?

My sleeves have been rolled and I want answers

boyfromtheboro Posted on 23/9 17:28
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

For someone who is always picking the wrong team, hes done exceptionally well for a Boro Manager.

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:31
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

He is disasterous in the transfer market aswell.

Maccarone?

Wright?

Ricketts?

Pogatetz?

I know he has made a few decent little signings but that doesn't make up for his dealings.

grainger1981 Posted on 23/9 17:31
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

He is doing an amazing job and long may it continue. The reason's some people give to not liking him are stupid to say the least.

speckyget Posted on 23/9 17:32
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

He gave me one of the happiest days of my life. And it's been a long life containing plenty of happy days.


*sings* Monday, Tuesday, happy days, etc.

rob_fmttm Posted on 23/9 17:32
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Why the question mark after Pogatetz? Isn't that speaking a bit too soon.
What about Rochemback, Juninho, Mendieta, Boateng, Southgate... ?

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:32
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

and he's ginger.

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:33
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I'm a keen follower of the Austrian football team and he's not that good.

Capybara Posted on 23/9 17:33
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

How old are you, PaddlingBack?

lawnranger Posted on 23/9 17:34
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

reading into this i know the fans are split big time on this issue i myself would say that the main reason is the negativity in our play and this has gone on now for far too long . What frustrates me most is that we have a wealth of exciting players who i feel are been held back in our tactics which are sometimes so defensive its untrue , the game against arsenal was for me the best we have played since the Lazio game but we do not have enough of these days when to be fair we should be having more especially the squad we now have. Lets see what happens on sunday

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:34
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

too old for you.

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:35
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

<taps finger on desk and awaits some sensible debate>

--- Post edited by bandito on 23/9 17:35 ---

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:35
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

to be honest bandito you aren't looking for a serious debate your looking for people to agree with you.

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:36
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

fair point lawnranger. At times I think the same but overall you have to say we are progressing very nicely. We do attack teams. We just are not gung ho and naive at it.

borobadge Posted on 23/9 17:36
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

on the subject of transfers..all managers get players in that dont fit or cut it..just ask fergie and his 7 goalies...wenger his his 4/5 goalies and crap strikers like jeffers 10M ffs...even mourinho has phuqed up and his only been there a couple of reletive months..

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:37
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

ok black you know best. Dont spoil yourself. Youre a decent poster, dont let yourself be the next boateng

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:39
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Do i detect a hint of racism from you bandi? I treasure your kind words. I just hate the fact I pay thousands of pounds a year to watch grass grow.

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:40
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

racism? where you coming from on that score?

dooderooni Posted on 23/9 17:40
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

A little request to those who believe Mac instructs the team to play negetively.

Take time during the game to watch Mac and his staff in the technical area and then come back on here and tell me that you never saw them urging players forward or showing frustration when the players knock the ball backwards and stifle another attack.

You might be surprised to see how much passion this allegedly self-serving, career-led next England manager shows if you only took the time to notice.

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:41
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

dont pay the thousands of pounds then. Go and watch darlo. Its miles cheaper and more entertaining.....

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:41
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

<puts dood on xmas card list>

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:42
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

OH! and players ignore his instructions.

Read you post carefully bandi and you will see where i'm coming from... I know it was a mistake.

borobadge Posted on 23/9 17:42
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

"I just hate the fact I pay thousands of pounds a year to watch grass grow."...

your not looking hard enough then..or dont know what to look for..

give us some idea of what you want/expect to see...!

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:42
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Because I love the club bandi..... because I love them

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:43
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

22 men having a good old ding-dong... not some game of chess.

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:43
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

mistake spotted!

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:44
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?


borobadge Posted on 23/9 17:47
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

for give me with the numbers..but isnt that called Rugby ?

"22 men having a good old ding-dong"...

..enjoy it man , enjoy it.

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:48
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I like men getting dirty with eachother, it arouses me.

MrAngryInKuwait Posted on 23/9 17:50
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I don't hate McClaren. I just don't happen to agree with some of the things he says and does. I don't expect him to be perfect, but I do expect him to learn from his mistakes, and often he seems unable to do this.

If he was as good as he say he is, and if the team he's built was as good as he says it is, results should be a lot more consistent. At times, I feel performances are negative, but if it ended up with 3 points, I could live with it. But, as has been proved, there are no guarantees in life. But you have a greater chance of winning a game if you actually attack the opposition, not sit back and let them attack you.

piggy_nichol Posted on 23/9 17:53
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

He has done nothing to deserve abuse.

I sometimes get very frustrated with the team selections, the often negative approach, and the excuses for poor performances.

But, and its a big but, the man has delivered.

In 4 years he has rebuilt the team, won that elusive first cup and given us 2 european campaigns.

I dont think we could have realistically hoped for anything better than that.

bandito Posted on 23/9 17:53
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I agree Mr angry. I just think he is cautious in his approach. He aint Mr negative. He knows that to win games you need to attack teams. A fool could work that one out. However, he likes to find the balance. Surley that doesnt make him a bad manager?

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 17:53
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Well done PaddlingBack. I've never read so much dibble in one thread.

Your obviously a wind up case.

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:55
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

At least I go to matches Briggsy just because I don't agree with you it doesn't make it dribble.

Reveal your bottom.

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 17:57
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I havnt got a problem with you disagreeing with me. Its just the dribble you speak of.

I dont agree with sas but at least he talks some sense!

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 17:57
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Calm down dear, it's only a commercial.

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 17:58
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Have you got a red and white top on?

Buddy Posted on 23/9 17:58
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Exactly right bandito and dood. Including the bit about "urging them forward". And the fact that we have played the most consistently good football under this manager that I can remember. Yes we had flashes in 96/7 but they were the exception to a lot of rubbish. Since 2002 we've always had the potential to play cracking football without the real fear of going on a run of ten defeats.

There have been a couple of injury-plagued blips to that but we have done nothing but strengthen the squad, even this year when I think Rochemback will adequately replace Zenden and Yakubu looks like at least a half-decent swop for Job - PLUS we have left back competition now.

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 18:02
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I have got a pink top on to show off how cool and comfertable with my sexuallity I am.

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 18:03
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

You big puff.

But pink, come on!! Thats something bandy would wear!

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 18:05
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Only real men can wear pink. I obviously am a real man.

bandito Posted on 23/9 18:07
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

quite right briggsy, I have a pink work shirt and a pink lacoste polo. I'm married with a 3 month old son and I'm not gay.

Thats fc uked you hasnt it?

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 18:08
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I shaft approximately 10 girls a week.... therefore I am not gay.

Oh dear Mr Briggs.... or should I say Miss Briggs

bandito Posted on 23/9 18:11
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

anyway Mr Briggs, sas and I have been lookign for you today. You bought your ticket yet? I assume if you dont answer then you arent going. 2 free pints in doc b's if you want aswell.

Redekk Posted on 23/9 18:12
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Recent examples of McClaren magic,we are on target after four games,we have four points,so we expected to loose 0-3 against Charlton then.McClarens dicision at Wigan to sub doriva for the injured morrison cost us two points.Maccarone should have been a direct replacement,allowing rochenback to remain in the middle,not on the right wing.My memories of McClaren when he leaves will be his encouragement to his players to run the ball to the corner flag to gain a point AT HOME and sit and watch 90 minutes of football when his team never had a shot at goal

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 18:16
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

10 girls a week, yeah and I'm the king of Senegal.



I replied to his thread bandy, look further down. I havnt got my ticket with been at work all week. But I'll no doubt end up going. I'll pop in DB's if I do. What time do you land?

tees_dan Posted on 23/9 18:17
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I think he is OK but these are probably some of the reasons?

1. He came from Manure and probably dreams of returning.
2. The Leeds move gossip?
3. The Jawdee move gossip?
4. Saying magnificent when we were crap.
5. Ricketts?
6. Maccarone?
7. Failing to defend the Carling Cup?
8. Letting the little fella go.
8. The constant negative comments from Slaven, Gates, Macdonald, and the constant slating of him from Boro fans live on air?
9. Being England N02

bandito Posted on 23/9 18:20
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

"But I'll no doubt end up going."

in simplest terms that means you're not.

Not flying to doc browns this week as my concorde is in the garage but will be landing at about half 2

Boromart Posted on 23/9 18:20
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I think its a mix of things that get peoples goat about Steve Mac (although I am not one of them):-

- Paradise Syndrom. We win something and qualify for europe twice, the fans suddenly don't know how to handle success. They end up rejecting it and the man who steered us to it.
- People will always find something to moan at, it human nature, and particularly Western cultures nature to magnify failure. There are were people on here whining about the Charlton performance then cheering the Arse performance. Unfortunately that sums up human nature.
- Our changing ambitions. People expect year-on-year progress, it is getting more and more difficult to acheive that.
- Over-exposure of Football, people will whinge at anything that includes a leather ball and 11 people kicking it at the moment.
- A bland premiership. We really need someone to do a Notts Forest, otherwise the TV contracts will dwindle as fans loose interest in watching Arse/Manure/Chelsea win everything, or is that just Chelsea. We could also do with a world cup semi-final at LEAST to keep interest for the next couple of years.
- A few windup merchants
- Even more idiots (call me arrogant if you like but I beleive some people are, just being plain stupid with negative comments).

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 18:23
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Dont jump to conclusions bandy. You may see me there.

bandito Posted on 23/9 18:23
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

enjoyed reading that post boromart.

bandito Posted on 23/9 18:24
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

"You may see me there"

playing the invisible man in pub routine again eh?

face it, you cant be arsed to go cos you wont pay the wedge.

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 18:29
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I've never ducked out of games.

bandito Posted on 23/9 18:33
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

See you in Doctor B's then. We wont bite

borodavey Posted on 23/9 18:34
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I can say it is simply cos fans are bored, the games are boring, i know its happening everywhere, but more so here. Villa has the biggest drop, next its us by a slither. Villa have had no success in recent years, yet we are in europe. You can say its all down to prices, that has something to do with it but more than anything its entertainment value. Slag me off if you want but its true. Sunderland this season have had more shots on target and more crosses put in that us. Granted we have scored more but we have the better players and forwards. I just wish he would say go out and attack teams. I find we do attack teams but only for a 10-20 minute spell each game. I would love for him to go out and do that for 60-70 minutes.

Thats my opinion on it, im not a fan oif his but im not going to boo him. I know many will come on here saying he is fantastic cos he won us a cup. Thats fine he has, he came in got us sorted out and won us something. However after a while, having tasted Europe fans are starting to think i wish we would entertain. We want to move forward, we want the next step to be entertainment, this is something he promised when he came, he said i will play fluent attacking football. There has been very very little of that since he came.

The facts speak for themselve, i think more than half now think its getting boring thats why half the normal attendance turned up for xanti.

PaddlingBack Posted on 23/9 18:34
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I'll be there.

20_Briggsy Posted on 23/9 18:38
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Ok Bandy.

bandito Posted on 23/9 18:38
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

some good points there davey and some that I agree with. It makes for a much better debate when people actually sit down and pen their thoughts with accuracy instead of the personal vitriol. At times we dfo play some turgid stuff and its hard to watch but at other times we play some great stuff. It all balances out and to be fair our league position of 8th at the moment is a true reflection of how we are as a team. We will win some and we will draw a few and then lose a few. Only Mourinho, Ferguson and Wenger can maintain consistency. I think were doing ok but many expect the earth

ellesse69 Posted on 23/9 18:42
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

you can just spell bandy with a b, ampersand, y.

i'm bored!

borodavey Posted on 23/9 18:48
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

dont get me wrong i would love McClaren to send out his teams to attack this season, i dont care who where playing, if we lose i dont care as long as i can come away and say we had a go, most fans wouldnt either. Where not chelsea where not going to win everygame, we just dont want to see the team go out to draw, we want them to try and win. Even McClaren fans must agree with that. If we did that alot of these pick and choose the games fans will come back. If we go out and play like we did at liverpool or charlton they wont.

Even if he went with a 541 i wouldnt mind if he got the team to attack, i mean Brazil play it as an attacking style cos they do use the 2 widemen to push right up and make it a 433 which is how it should be done.

dooderooni Posted on 23/9 18:55
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

As an addition to my earlier comment about having an eye on the off-field action, I wonder how many of our fans recognise that the way we play is directly affected by how the opposition play.

Some say we should attack more but what if the opposition don't let us?

Take Xanthi for example. First half they had two banks of a 4 and a 5 that compressed the game into the midfield and we struggled to get behind them and instead decided to play the ball about at the back and try and play our way through them carefully. They were so compact that we were restricted in our success at doing it and it was only when we opened play up with either a bit of pace or a diagonal ball over the top that we got them turned towards their own goal.

In the second half they realised that being 1-nil down meant they had to come forward a bit and they began to threaten and we struggled to adapt before getting our second to give us a fairly comfortable lead.

The game is tactical by nature and is far more akin to a game of chess than anything else.

As the competitive level of teams increases it's far more likely that games will become more of a battle of wits than of a test of skill.

You only need to look at the likes of Madrid to see that gung-ho attacking will only get you so far and even then you need bloody big pockets for it to be anything like remotely succesful.

If our players could perform more consistantly then you'd see far better games both home and away but unfortunately, while they are very skillful, their very good games are often out-weighed by their stinkers.

Appreciate that the game is about 2 teams on and off the pitch and you start to realise that sometimes the best efforts of your team are simply not enough. Charlton caught us on bad day and we cought them on a good one. The result was inevitable in that case just as a few days before the roles were reversed at St Andrews and it was us who played at our potential and Birmingham who had no answer.

Simply put, it was more likely Charltons efforts and tactics that won the game on the day, rather than ours that lost it.

uncle_harry Posted on 23/9 19:01
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I'm not sure but I sometimes wonder whether McClaren's authorative disciplinarian style rubs the people who dont like discipline and authority up the wrong way. I've never suggsted it before because I anticipate getting a 'fook off you daft coont I hate the ginger coont' type of reply

but then I thought wtf

borodavey Posted on 23/9 19:09
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

that might be the case sometimes mate but yu cant say that all the time, for intance playing 2 defensive midfield players is like playing 6 at the back. You only need 1 if that, the succesful utd team of the 90's had Keane but he got forward too. Ours like parlour, doriva and Boatang dont so you cant play more than 1 at a time. Thats being negative. saying that i dont mind if we a petient in certain games, i expect that, all teams are sometimes, but often we need to be more positive. they have been so many games when we havent attempted to attack till the second half or after we go a goal down when i think we should do it from the start. As we did in the Carling cup final when we put them on the back foot straight away

London_Jinx Posted on 23/9 19:14
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

'fook off you daft coont I hate the ginger coont'

the_stallion Posted on 23/9 19:21
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

The best manager we've had before MacLaren was Jack Charlton- but Christ that was dull. Mac is learning his trade. he's made mistakes. i think he's got the intellect to see them. Remember the team he inherited- Vickers, Fleming et al.
Under macLaren we've seen players improve- Boateng is a far better player than the one that joined, likewise quedrue.
He gives youth a chance. In his first season he said, 'I see the first team in three years time, and it excites me'. That team is coming through now. He saw the young kids, and believed they could make it.
He's also a lucky manager- the Carling Cup run, the penalties, the save at man City.
I like that.
He is one of the best managers around.I was still livid about Wigan mind!

borodrew Posted on 23/9 19:26
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

i think we do attack, and do try to attack, but a mixture of inconsistency and the right type of players being available affects it.

thats why i think weve bought rochembach, to only play one holding player in the future. early in the season weve had little choice but to play parlour doriva etc till we signed rocky.


i dont think mcclaren deliberately sets out to be negative, i would say away from home were set out to counter and it works, but at home we struggle because of other teams stacking men behind the ball, and it doesnt suit our play.


inconsstencys our problem in my opinion at the min. arsenal,. positive selectionand performance good attacking football good result, same with brum, spurs unfortunate.

but then charlton wigan and liverpool fairly poor, and not much going forward.

i think in general its a mixed bag and its a mixture of team selection, but possibly more, player performance for us to be more consistent.

smoggieinmanc Posted on 23/9 19:45
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Obviously at times I disagree with certain decisions mclaren makes! But McLaren has done alot for this club and i feel he has alot more to offer the club!

I respect the fact that people have opinions different to mine but what I cant stand is people who are just totally unreasonable and resort to childish insults and name calling! How someone can say he always picks the wrong side is beyond me, I wish they would explain what makes them better qualified to pick a side than mclaren!

I am aware that alot of opinion is taken with the moment and if we tonk Sunderland on Sunday many people will be shouting from the roof-tops but if we lose, draw or even only win by the odd goal, they will be quick to call for his head! People obviously have raised expectations but I wish people would show a bit of common sense and accept we will lose some games and cant win every week!

scoea Posted on 23/9 20:23
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

The answer to the question Bandito is nothing. Obviously, there will be the odd decision that attracts criticism, the odd performance that is poor, the odd transfer that goes horribly wrong but it is all about perspective.

Anyone with an ounce of knowledge about our history and tradition should be able to accept that this is truly a golden era.

McClaren took over in June 2001. On that day if any of us had been offered a Cup win, getting further in the UEFA Cup than any previous team had on it's maiden voyage, a highest ever Premiership finish and points total and a second successive qualification for the UEFA Cup then it would have been a dream. In fact, many would not have thought it possible.

Have some perspective people. Not everything is perfect, mistakes will be made but look at the whole picture. We are truly making progress. It may be slow but it is there.

I cannot for the life of me understand the criticism the manager gets. I'm not talking about objective criticism of any aspect of his management but the bile that is produced on a daily basis on here, on the radio and in the letters sections of local papers. Steve McClaren should go down as a Boro legend. Anyone that does not accept that hasn't got the first idea about football or about Middlesbrough Football Club.

hodgiemfc Posted on 23/9 20:33
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I don't often post on here, more of a lurker really, but it is good to see something more of a debate/discussion than usual. Some people always see it as a polarised debate but it's not black or white as some think it is. There has been year on year improvement since Smac came and I don't see how anyone can argue with that. It might be slower than what some would want but it's improvement nevertheless, and the higher you go the more difficult it is. I don't always agree with what he does (Wigan is a good example) but I don't want to see him go. I think there's more we will achieve with him as manager. I go to every home game and as many away as I can with my 12 year old son and to be honest I'd much sooner see us win 1-0 with what some would describe as a negative performance than for us to lose 4-3 in an entertaining game (it might be entertaining for Sky but its not for me!). But I don't honestly think we are negative we adopt tactics to suit who we play. It might not always work, and we can always have an off day but that's football. I really do think some people just simply don't like Smac and when that happens what they say and think is subjective not objective.

uncle_harry Posted on 23/9 20:37
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

'I don't often post on here, more of a lurker really'

well you should mate top post that - salut UH

scoea Posted on 23/9 20:38
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I agree with that as well. i think it is a myth that McClaren is a negative manager. I think he is pragmatic. We can have good games and bad games but in his reign I recall that we have been amongst the top scorers at home (02/03) and last season were the top scorers outside the top 3. In addition, McClaren has spent the bulk of his transfer monies on attacking players.

These are not the actions of a negative coach.

bandito Posted on 23/9 20:55
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Hodgiemfc: You should get your opinions down on this board more often. You're talking sense. Hopefully some of the blinkered lot will take note. Keep it up!

Briggsy_22 Posted on 23/9 21:02
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I agree with bandy.

ccole Posted on 23/9 21:03
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

fook me bandi, what a great post. I didnt think you had it in you.

BTW - The answers to your question is nothing

bandito Posted on 23/9 21:05
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Thanks. I'll always fight Mac's corner. The bloke has made mistakes but he has done nothing wrong. This media merrygoround is turning into a fiasco and people are starting to believe the hype surrounding it all. I pity them. They obviously dont watch the game hard enough.

Briggsy_22 Posted on 23/9 21:07
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

True bandy. I wish people would take a leaf out of your boke rather than Slaven's..........

BroughtonLad Posted on 23/9 21:11
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

STEVE McCLARENS RED AND WHITE ARMY.................

sasboro Posted on 23/9 21:17
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

has smac got the ability to take a team from nothing with no money to spend , to two consecutive promotions?
has he got the ability to get a team promoted and into 3 cup finalS?(yes we lost them all). his spending (sales and purchases) is more than any other boro manager. he goes through more strikers than arthur scargill did. look at his league record it is very average!He over tinkers which costs us points. he worries about the opposition too much rather than just let them worry about our big name players. lots of players have under achieved and under motivated under his regime

--- Post edited by sasboro on 23/9 21:18 ---

Briggsy_22 Posted on 23/9 21:29
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Sas pass the gun when your finished.

sasboro Posted on 23/9 21:32
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

got your ticket for the game yet?

Briggsy_22 Posted on 23/9 21:34
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Tomorrow.

karembeu_ca Posted on 23/9 21:35
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

borodavey: " if we lose i dont care as long as i can come away and say we had a go, most fans wouldnt either"

That's utter cr@p davey. The only game I recall thining like that was the Arse 5-3 game. If we went after someone like Wigan for 80 minutes and lost 4-3 this place would be crawling with moaning and real nasty stuff toward SMAC ... don't kid yourself.

sasboro Posted on 23/9 21:36
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

where you gonna sit?

dont forget your 2 free pints off me and bandito before the game

Briggsy_22 Posted on 23/9 21:39
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

North or South.

I'll try make an appearance. I'll be coming down by myself mind.

ccole Posted on 23/9 21:40
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

"has smac got the ability to take a team from nothing with no money to spend , to two consecutive promotions"


Who knows, he hasnt had the chance, but he has had more successive seasons in the top flight than any other Boro manager for the last 50+ years.

aliasme Posted on 23/9 21:41
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

scoea - to be fair the reason he spends the bulk of his transfer budget on attacking players is because the ones he tended to buy were crap - Ricketts, Maccarone, Nemeth et al. Besides, the midfield was clearly the priority this season and the players weren't brought in. Not that I blame McClaren for that I think Keith Lamb needs to shoulder some of blame.

Anyway the question was what has McClaren done - it depends principally how you define success. If you take the narrow view that all that matters is results than well done McClaren - Carling Cup victory and 2 successive seasons in Europe ain't bad going in anybody's estimation.

However, (and there's a big but coming) the last time I looked football was classified as a spectator sport and frankly this win at all costs attitude is wearing a bit thin. When I go to see the Boro I want two things to happen:

1. The Boro win
2. The Boro display attractive, slick and passionate football

In the absence of both I'll take the Boro win, the reason being that after supporting them for over 40 years I'm grateful for anything - but should I be?

If all I was interested in was the Boro win then I'll just check the results on Teletext - I go to the games to be entertained and in this respect McClaren fails me as a football supporter in general (I'm not talking about simply following the Boro here but just enjoying the game of football itself).

I take the point that we are statistically a high scoring team but as Cloughie used to say it only takes a second to score a goal and frankly the entertainment factor for the rest of most games is, in my opinion, sadly lacking.

I believe that the players at your disposal should mould your formation. We are top heavy with attacking players so should play an attacking and expansive game. Instead he displays a tactical ineptitude by continuing to play players out of position in order to fit his preferred system. Pogatetz is not a left sided midfielder anymore than Nemeth/Mendieta/Maccarone/Parlour is a right sided midfielder. When you have players playing continually out of position the performance not only of those individual players but also of the team overall suffers, hence the lack of attacking flair and real cohesion.

Final point I would make is that it's also a question of attitude. Some teams who are 1-0 up in a game will continue to press and attack the opposition in search of the second goal to kill the game off. McClaren's attitude (and he's not alone in this) is to pull 11 players behind the ball and put up a tremendous and magnificent backs to the wall performance. Not my way of thinking but can understand others who get a kick out of it.

To those people - I hope you enjoy renewing your season tickets at the extra inflationary prices, me? I think I'll pick and choose next season (yes I'll do so even if we win the UEFA cup) because the beautiful game I once loved is being ruined by the win at all costs attitude of people like McClaren and the success starved supporters who continue to blindly back him.

chboro Posted on 23/9 21:43
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I like SMac.


There you go - 100 posts

Briggsy_22 Posted on 23/9 21:44
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

"However, (and there's a big but coming) the last time I looked football was classified as a spectator sport and frankly this win at all costs attitude is wearing a bit thin. When I go to see the Boro I want two things to happen:"

Its not just happening at the boro. Its happening all over the premiership apart from a couple of teams.

aliasme Posted on 23/9 21:49
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Agree Briggsy; but I fail to see why we can't be the exception rather than the rule.

Briggsy_22 Posted on 23/9 21:50
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

If we keep on progressing then I'm more than happy to keep with the style we adopt.

I mean at the end of the day, its not as bad as people are making out.

chboro Posted on 23/9 21:51
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Although I agree with you Briggsy, I want to be entertained,

Football is now a Business - they cannot afford to lose premiership status. I think it sucks, but if you run a business that makes that much money, you do everything you can to keep it afloat. If the football club gets relegated or doesn't qualify for Europe where they NEED the extra cash, then could end up in serious trouble finance wise.


BUT if we can play like we know we CAN play then, the thought of the things above wouldn't enter their minds - e.g' Man U, Arse etc. They play well because they can without the thought of not qualifying or relegation.

sasboro Posted on 23/9 21:56
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

whyat next? people saying smac is good enough to be england manager?

ccole Posted on 23/9 21:57
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

If McClaren went for and all out attacking game, which we all dream about, how do you think the crowd would react when the likes of Charlton, Soton, etc come, shut up shop and pinch a win.

Would we be happy that we tried? We would stand less chance of beating the top 3 as we would be trying to beat them at what they do best.

Unless all teams choose to play that way, you musat accept a relagation battle.

--- Post edited by ccole on 23/9 21:58 ---

bandito Posted on 23/9 21:58
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

what a refreshing change. Over a hundred responses and nobody has spat their dummy yet.

aliasme Posted on 23/9 22:04
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

ccole:

are you seriously equating attacking football with a relegation battle?

somebody should tell Brazil - they obviously have no chance of winning the next world cup, or Barcelona La Liga, or Man U/Arsenal the Premiership ......

TeeSv Posted on 23/9 22:43
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

...apologies if it's already been said, what have I and the 14,000 others who went to the Xanthi home game done to deserve abuse ?

mowbrays_number_4 Posted on 23/9 23:52
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

IMO he never abused anyone who went to the game or not,he simply said that he was dissappointed with the attendance.

i'm happy with the progress made during macs reign.

Freedom_Bear Posted on 24/9 0:15
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

The bear seconds everything in aliasme's post. Very good.

scoea Posted on 24/9 9:26
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I disagree entirely aliasme.

I think that Boro try to play attractive football. Obviously this doesn't happen every week but in my view it is not for the want of trying. I McClaren was a coach that just sits back on a 1-0 lead then how do you explain the amount of goals we scored last season? How do you explain the fact that McClaren visibly loses his rag when the team sits back? How do you explain away the recent games against the Arse, Brum etc in which we continued to press for goals even when we were 2-0 up?

It is very easy to say that the likes of Barcelona, Manure and Arsenal go out and attack but there are two major flaws in that argument. Firstly, their players are much better than ours so to expect the same mentality from our players is expecting too much. Secondly, how many trophies did those teams win last season? The teams that wosn the league and Champs League did so on the basis of a solid defence.

In terms of the strikers he has bought, I will accept that Ricketts was a failure. He took a gamble on Maccarone that is yet to pay off but in terms of the type of team that he wants, if he was this negative coach determined to ruin the game as a spectacle then why would he buy/loan the likes of Geremi, Zenden, Mendieta, Rochemback, Yak, Viduka, JFH, Maccarone? Why would he give Downing, Morrison and Johnson their chances? As I've said, it may not always work, it may not always be champagne football but I believe that we are aiming for an attractive passing team that creates chances and scores goals. What we do not have is consistency but then only the top 3 can boast that anyway.

20_Briggsy Posted on 24/9 9:46
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Well said scoea.

JonSina Posted on 24/9 9:58
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

the one thing I really hate him for is me and 3500 others spending 300 odd quid to go to Villareal to watch our star players get rested. (Players who only joined the club 'cos we were in Europe)

Why rest players in Europe in order to qualify for Europe, might as well finish 8th then he won't have to rest them!

p.s. how come he rests all the big name players and then we don't win on the sunday anyway, yet he always claims he's resting them so we don't lose the premier league games - we may as well play them in both judging by our post Europe results

grantus Posted on 24/9 10:25
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Intersting thread. Let me have my shillings worth to it.

Im sick and tired of the opinion that because he won us a trophy, he automatically becomes god's gift. Thousands of managers ahve won trophies, are they all the best thing since sliced bread? No, of course not, a lot of things need to happen to produce a cup winning season, the managers decisions are one of them, not everything. When we lose people come on here defending Mac, saying its not his fault, yet when we win, its down to him and only him. Where's the consistency?

Also, to compare him to rioch, Todd and Lawrence is so absurd its, well, absurd. You can only compare him to Robson in Boro terms, because pre Robson, we were an entirely different club. Has he done better thamn Robbo? Yes, but he had a head start with the club. Robbo took us from the 1st division, Mac didn't have to make that step, Robbo did it for him.

Mac does have some very visable faults as a club manager, to ignore them is to ignore your football club. I dont need to mention them, Ive done it before and there are others who have done it already. yes, he's the boss, yes, we need to get behind him and his team. But no, we shouldn't stop telling each other how we think things are, if he screws up, let him know. If he does good, let him know. Just like that.

Just go out there tomorrow Steve, get at Sunderland like a lion gets after a wounded Zebra, give us something to shout about.

Thanks in advance.

TeeSv Posted on 24/9 10:37
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

'IMO he never abused anyone who went to the game or not,he simply said that he was dissappointed with the attendance.'

Wasn't saying that McClaren abused the fans. Boro fans in general came in for 'abuse' from sections of the media and other fans following the attendance of the Xanthi game. For the record and IMO, he and the fans do not deserve it. But, he did very publically criticise the attendance without first thanking those who did turn up. It was not until a couple days later that anyone from the club said as much. Like McClaren's dissapointment with the crowd, I was dissapointed with him for not first recognising those who did go.

bandito Posted on 24/9 10:44
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Grantus: in no way am I comparing mac with lennie, rioch etc. That would be foolish as I appreciate things are a lot different. However people perceptions and mentalities have changed a lot since then and the expectation level has increased.Just think back to how far away then we were from where we are now. Mac makes many mistakes. He's learning tho. Give him credit for that.

--- Post edited by bandito on 24/9 10:44 ---

grantus Posted on 24/9 10:58
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I give him credit for what he has achieved, no argument from me.

I dont give him credit for the style of football we play or the tactical decision he makes when we are in front. If we are chasing the game I usually agree with what he attempts to do. Its the defend a lead, take of the most effective players mentality that winds me up more than anything else.

Although I chastise him for being too cautious, it is intersting how many attacking players we have on the books. Its a conundrum alright. Overloaded with attackers then play the cautious game.

I appreciate that upsetting a few supporters is nothing compared to not qualifying for European football or god forbid relegation, so there is justification in this "revolution" of English football, that Mac is part of. this dont lose attitude instead of a lets go out there entertain and win, that i would prefere.

One thing though, I was telling some friends of mine the other day, "Middlesbrough is a town, not a city, 19 years ago we didn't even have a football club anymore. Look at us now, we are THE Cinderella story of British sports" Believe me, I am so very, very, proud.

--- Post edited by grantus on 24/9 10:59 ---

JimmyMFC1 Posted on 24/9 11:18
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I think some people, not all, base some of their hatred toward Steve or any manager for that matter on false information. I hear people like one at Wigan say "why the f'in hell did he take Morrison off?" which brings their whole slant on the game into doubt because it was obvious to most of the crowd that he was injured. The same goes for team selection with people not knowing before games when there are injuries and suspensions.

grantus Posted on 24/9 11:27
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

But Jimmy, the manager cant say "The supporters need to be educated" then dont tell them why things are done, can he?

grantus Posted on 24/9 11:28
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Well, he can, but he shouldn't. If the club dont offer answers and reasons for their actions, then it is fair to make up your mind yourself, isn't it?

JimmyMFC1 Posted on 24/9 11:36
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

If they couldn't see that Morrison was injured (the same goes for someone at Man City last game of the season) then I wonder what other glaringly obvious stuff that they are missing? Should that need to be explained? I think alcohol has a lot to do with peoples judgement, especially at away games.

grantus Posted on 24/9 11:39
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I wasn't being specific. Its ok, calm down.

bandito Posted on 24/9 11:40
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

at away games most people are so incoherent they couldnt even name the first goalscorer so it amazes me when they shout abuse at the manager who generally acts on substitutions rather than forces them.

ccole Posted on 24/9 11:44
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Jon,

As I think you will agree, to play domestic and European football you need a squad.

When the group was drawn with Lazio, Eagleo, Belgrade, Villareal, and Boro, I and most other would have been happy with a finsih of third, which would see us into the next stage.

As it happens, McClaren won the group, which when drawn looked the toughest. He acheived what he set out to do, perhaps exceeded it. I cant understand why people knock him for the Vilareal game. It wasnt about one game. It was about the team with the most points after four games.

JimmyMFC1 Posted on 24/9 11:49
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I am totally calm :)
Just offering a possible suggestion as to why people form some of the opinions they do. While I don't agree with some of his subs it's just annoying when sections of the crowd boo substitutions through injury when the person who comes on is the only fit suitable replacement.

sasboro Posted on 24/9 11:52
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

lets keep things in perspective.

has he achieve more than oleary(at leeds) and gregory(villa), oneil(leicester) or david pleat?

he's on par with big sam i reckon.

bandito Posted on 24/9 11:53
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

who the hell in the right mind would boo a substitution?

I gave up booing when I was 7 at the panto.

You only have to look at the people who boo and you soon realise why they are booing. They dont really have much clue about what is going on. Its an attention thing to make them look hard

JimmyMFC1 Posted on 24/9 12:00
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Although people say the manager has negative tactics on the pitch they don't look at his positive tactics off it. He doesn't slag his players off (like Souness) which I think leads to a better spirit. He hasn't developed into a serial moaner like big Sam or O'leary. He has changed the club from a drinking club to a professional forward thinking outfit. People mock some of his scientific approaches but it is surely better than some of the horror stories of the Robson era.

sasboro Posted on 24/9 12:03
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

who was manager of blackburn when i think they won the carling cup?

grantus Posted on 24/9 12:11
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Very good point Jimmy, one worth saying, beat me to it.

JonSina Posted on 24/9 13:49
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

ccole: don't agree at all, I believe that a team should always pick their best players if they are fit, which gives the team some consistency, lets partnerships develop, and pretty much stabilises everything, chopping and changing doesn't help anyone!

scoea Posted on 24/9 21:41
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Sas, you and your ilk really are amusing.

After his first season in charge you were demanding a Cup win. After the Cup win you were then saying that true progress can only be judged by league position. Now you're struggling and grasping for any critcism.

I'll tell you why he is better than O'Leary and Gregory - because he has done it in the Cup and in the league for Middlesbrough. Look at our history compared to that of Leeds and Villa.

I am sick of his achievements being belittled. OK it isn't perfect but to play down Boro's recent success is to betray our history.

boro74 Posted on 24/9 21:49
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Nothing. He deserves the highest praise.I haven't got time to read 133 posts. Suffice it to say...........his record speaks for itself.

Woodymfc Posted on 24/9 22:37
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Hey the protectors of Mclaren, most of your points are correct in what we have acheived with him, BUT i dont enjoy sitting thru the boring stuff of late - and that goes for the many who now stay away. I have no hatred for enyone, we just play boring crap most of the time.
The game is dying with likes of these tactics around - bolton are similar in aproach

borobuddah Posted on 25/9 0:01
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

The front cover of FMTTM is a bit strong though, eh Rob?

Big_Shot Posted on 25/9 10:18
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

'I think some people, not all, base some of their hatred toward Steve or any manager for that matter on false information'

I agree with you on that. Some people are having there opinions made up for them by others such as radio and tv commentators, phone ins, messageboards etc. Of course there are plenty of fans who don't like McClaren who have very valid reasons for that so I don't mean them. Its just there's been a couple of things recently that got me thinking about this.

Firstly I know a bloke who has an irrational hatred of McClaren. Its his opinion so its fair enough but he struggles to explain why he thinks what he does. I spoke to him on Friday and I mentioned I'd been to Wigan, I said I was disappointed with only a draw, we were poor 2nd half etc. Anyway he has a go at McClaren saying what the fck was he doing bringing on Doriva as everyone knows he should have brought Maccarone on. I pointed out that Maccarone isn't a midfielder (one of his previous rants was about McClaren playing strikers in midfield), I then said Maccarone was introduced when we were still 1-0 and we tried to play the same formation as we did against Arsenal but it didn't work. Neither of these things had even crossed his mind, but as an avid listener of Century Radio he'll have heard nuggets all week saying what he said. Giving him another reason to have a dig at the manager.

Another thing was a couple of threads yesterday about the League Cup game at Liverpool and the 'reserve' side we fielded. I remember back at the time I went to the game and we had a strong side out, were the better side throughout and were unlucky to get beat. But when I looked at this messageboard when I got home, there was thread after thread of people slating McClaren and us for team selection and performance. But as people who'd been to the game were getting home they were all posting saying exactly what I've just said. So all the people who didn't go to the game must have been told by the radio how awful we were but the 2000 or so Boro fans who were there didn't seen it that way.

Like I said earlier I don't mean all fans who are against McClaren but it certainly does seem that some will believe whatever they are told without actually thinking for themselves.

Back to the bloke I know. At beginning of the season he was slating McClaren for not playing Mendieta in the centre as apparently we all know he's much better in the centre. Strange that back when we signed him he'd never actually heard of 'Medeeta' so cannot have any idea of how good or bad Mendi once was and in what position.

--- Post edited by Big_Shot on 25/9 10:19 ---

grantus Posted on 25/9 10:31
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Name him!! Out with the jesters name!!

Big_Shot Posted on 25/9 10:44
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I'e mentioned him on here a few times. He's an okay enough bloke but he's now a bit of a figure of fun and a few of my mates won't even speak to him. But he's a good example of someone believing whatever you are told. Not really meaning to have a go at Century but it can be the only place he gets his opinons from as he listens to it every night.

Another classic was the Friday after Cardiff. He said the defeat at Birmingham on the Wednesday night was the final straw and McClaren must be sacked.

karmapolice Posted on 25/9 10:46
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

CBA'd reading all this thread.

Would say he does not deserve abuse; however he is not beyond criticism. Some people on here mistake criticism for abuse.

He's made lots of mistakes but on the other hand has made some correct decisions. His transfers have been less than impressive. Tactically - over-cautious and prefers to select superstars rather than homegrown talent regardless of form.

He is not irreplaceable and is not in the same league as Curbishly. Highly overrated imo.

sasboro Posted on 25/9 10:51
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

it interesting that people like to blame century for fans not being ra-ra and being critical of smac. but if you listen to tfm on saturday about midday then you will hear the likes of jeff winter and terry cochrane saying similar things to slaven saying. It's funny how all the exprofessionals opinions are dismissed so easily and bullsh it when they are better qualified to have an opinion than the fans.

I still stand by the opinion that smac is as good as big sam,oleary,john gregory and souness at their peaks.

Big_Shot Posted on 25/9 11:01
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Nobody is blaming anyone. I did point out that I was not meaning to have a go at Century. I was just on about people not making their own minds up about things and just repeating what they have heard. Personally I couldn't care less what any radio station has to say, good or bad, I prefer to make my own opinions from what I see.

Actuallt I have no idea what was said on the radio with regards to Wigan or any other match come to think of it, so were they saying that Maccarone should have played in a midfield 4 like that bloke was saying.

--- Post edited by Big_Shot on 25/9 11:10 ---

boroboymike Posted on 25/9 11:07
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

If I'd been told 4 years ago we'd have won the carling Cup and had 2 years in Europe I would've bitten your hand off. Can't deny it. But the reason we've achieved those things are because Steve Gibson has made us one of the top 6/7 spenders in English football.

The main reason I'll never be a big MaCLaren fan is the simple decisions i believe he gets wrong time after time;

-Playing one up front at home for an entire season 2 years back

-Taking months to realise Downing was clearly a better left winger than Zenden when the crowd could see it on day one.

-Picking Parlour/Mendi/Nemeth on the right wing over the only decent right winger at the club, Morrisson. (still something he hasn't realised).

-Picking Reiziger (who had been poor the season before) over Mcmahon first game of the season (as he'd sent McMahon to the reserves a few days earlier) and then backing up his preference for reiziger by giving him a free transfer two weeks later?!?!?!?

BASIC BASIC BASIC selection decisions he gets wrong time after time after time. Punishing youth at every turn.

I'm still waiting for the fans to wake up and smell the coffee re:Rochemback. Too many have been duped by MaCLaren's drivel about Rocky coming in and replacing Zenden's goals. Won't happen and the fans will find out soon.

scoea Posted on 25/9 11:11
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Again Sas you show your naivity. These ex professionals are paid to comment on the radio and to attract listeners. Nothing attracts them more than negativity. To say that their views are not influenced by that would be very naive.


"His transfers have been less than impressive."

Really? This one always puzzles me. There are a handful of poor signings (much like every other manager) but for the most part he has signed good players. If he hadn't then we wouldn't have achieved the success we have in the last few years.

"Tactically - over-cautious"

Still waiting to hear how the team has scored so many goals and had so much success with this caution.

"Prefers to select superstars rather than homegrown talent regardless of form."

Like who? Downing, Morrison, McMahon, Johnso, Graham - they have all had a lot more football than they would at most clubs. In McClaren's latest Sky interview he said that he learned at United that the key to success was to have a core of homegrown talent which is why he fast tracks the youngsters into the first team.

boroboymike - despite all of that he still managed the team to a Cup win and to a highest ever finish. He must be a genius!!

--- Post edited by scoea on 25/9 11:13 ---

boroboymike Posted on 25/9 11:18
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Scoea - MacLaren is not a genius. he is a man with the 6th/7th biggest kitty in the Premier League to spend.

He is also a man who has wasted at least a year in the careers of Downing, Morrison and McMahon who should've been regulars long before they became/will become.

Ferguson is a class manager, but had a lot of luck in the youth at Man Utd all coming good at the right time with Beckham, Neville, Butt, Giggs, Scholes etc. MaCLaren has enjoyed the same luck at Boro, but he only uses it as a last resort.

scoea Posted on 25/9 11:24
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

That is absolute rubbish Mike. The best managers in the game will not over expose their young players. You raise Ferguson as an example - look at the way he treat his youngsters and continues to treat Rooney. Morrison, McMahon and Downing are doing so well because of McClaren and the way he looks after them.

boroboymike Posted on 25/9 11:28
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

'over expose'?!?!?!? Putting a player on a pitch is exposing them?!?!?!?!?!!? The overexposure lark refers to protecting them from TV interviewers. Will poor old wittle James Morrison get scared if he gets put on a pitch too many times?

That kind of drivel is the reason you and I could never have a discussion mate. I'll knock it on the head.

sasboro Posted on 25/9 11:28
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

"Again Sas you show your naivity. These ex professionals are paid to comment on the radio and to attract listeners. Nothing attracts them more than negativity. To say that their views are not influenced by that would be very naive."

surely if they say its negative then it will stop people from listening?
And likewise, people within the game wont admit it's negative (football in general) as it will keep fans away. But i am sure expros are better qualified that sky ssupporters to understand football

back the the original topic, smac is doing a decent job. not outstanding and not poor. i would say average when you think how much money he has spent. if he was doing a superb job we would be up in the top 4 for a few seasons. even keegan managed that with newcastle and he's not classed as a top class manager.
all this talk of smac being the next manager is rubbish, he hasnt done enough to preove he is good enough for the england job. i would prefer morinihio as his CV has a lot more on it. It's only because there are not many english managers around in the top flight that he gets linked with the england job. but like under bryan robson the chance wont come along anyway. also how often have the FA promoted a number two into the england manager?

--- Post edited by sasboro on 25/9 11:32 ---

scoea Posted on 25/9 11:34
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

If people within the game won't say it's negative then why the hullabaloo this week? Did you not hear what Wenger said? Very naive Sas, very naive.

Mike - your lack of understanding is amazing. I will accept the view of Ferguson over yours. Beckham wasn't a regluar (and indeed went to Preston on loan) until his twenties, same as all the others. There is a very good reason for that. Playing an 18 year old kid for a full season is dangerous both physically and mentally. Just ask Stewart Downing whose form dipped dramatically as a result of too many games leading to his abuse at the Charlton game. Such things can hamper the development of a young player.

Sas - how can his tenure be seen as average given the unrivalled success he has achieved here? As for this myth about him spending so much money - it's about 7- 10m a season. Not more than any of the other mid-table clubs!!

--- Post edited by scoea on 25/9 11:35 ---

borodavey Posted on 25/9 13:15
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Im goona have to say something on protecting young players, yes if they are not quite ready dont play them week in week out, however in morrisons case he has shown he has not been affected. You mention fergie, was Giggs and Sharpe not playing regularly at 17 and 19 respectively. I seem to remmber they where, Owen replaced rush and collymore in the starting line up at 17 at liverpool. If thy are goo enough play them. Downing was ready, his form dipped but if you remember the team was not even trying to attack at te time and we where awful, teams stuck 2-3 players on his all the time cos we had no other threat.

scoea Posted on 25/9 13:21
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Look what happened to Owen's and Giggs' hamstrings. And what was Sharpe doing at 26, 27?

Morrison has shown no ill effects because he hasn't been overexposed. Downing is just getting over the effects.

tees_dan Posted on 25/9 18:12
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

DISPLAYS LIKE THAT PROBABLY SUM IT UP?

tees_dan Posted on 25/9 19:11
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

did we tempt fate with this poxy post?

darmok Posted on 25/9 19:24
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

After today, this threads got a quarter of a century written all over it.

Well done Bandy.

tees_dan Posted on 25/9 20:47
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Get a grip you pathetic people?????

bandito Posted on 25/9 20:49
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

whats your problem. You seem so keen to keep hoofing it so I'll oblige.

tees_dan Posted on 25/9 20:58
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

my problem is you think I'm pathetic? yet you talk out of your arsse.

karmapolice Posted on 25/9 21:07
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Scoea: over cautious (Liverpool game)

Tansfers: Missmimo, parlour, Riziger, Rickets, Wilson.

Only decent signing has been Quedrue: he was on loan for 6 months before he realised he was good enough.

There is a ptent problem with our management and scouting system.

jimmyrav Posted on 25/9 21:13
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

In response to Bandito and your argument about Oldham 6 pointer and failure to beat Notts County,

yeah those days were bad, but at least the blokes on the pitch gave you plenty of effort if they lacked ability, they werent on wages per week that surpass the average fan in the grounds yearly income and they appeared to care.

The current crop, including the manager, take the support for granted!

In actual fact, in all likelihood, who will be here in the current squad and management in 5 years? None I'd say

The only way fans can voice their opinion is to boo or vote with their feet!

It looks and sounds to me like eople are voting!

McClaren OUT!!!!!

red_ruth Posted on 25/9 21:15
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I watched the game away from any negative influences in a sports bar in camborne, the sound was down and although the bar was full i was the only person watching the game.
No one else cares what happened, who was winning or losing. On a national stage this is all very small beer indeed.
For me, it was just one of those days, it was going to happen.we were by far the better team without the breaks. Sunderland scored twice, they beat us, get over it. There are far more important things going on in the world.You have a choice wether or not you want to see the game live and how you spend your money, no one points a gun to your head and orders you to watch football. Some times we lose, fact.

wooly Posted on 25/9 21:18
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Steve Mclaren has taken us to a level not seen by Boro fans before. European football and a trophy, each year he has improved us more points and a higher position in the league.

Previously Bryan Robson took us to a new level with the cup finals and highest point finish beaten last season. It went stale and te fans started getting on his back but Gibson stood by him when it was clear his time was up. I sense the same scenario.

I would like the guy to prove me wrong but i think he has taken us as far as he possibly can and i fear that with an ageing squad and his negativity it is time for a new man in the hotseat.

Supernovaheights Posted on 25/9 21:42
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

watched boro for 25 years now can't remember being this furstrated. Mac should be playing alot better football with the squad and money available, he has losted the crowd, first step to his P45

Woodymfc Posted on 25/9 22:04
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

defend todays performance on behalf of mclaren bandito.................................... we were pure shoite

Gazbot Posted on 25/9 22:39
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

This manager took the pi$$ out of our beloved Juninho....get shot now

Buggerlugs Posted on 25/9 22:41
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Can't be bothered reading this thread but wold like to point out that Bandito used to to give Mclaren absolute pelters in his first season or two. Had his life you did.

bandito Posted on 25/9 23:30
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I've always backed McClaren buggerlugs. I will continue to do so amidst all this overreaction. There wasnt a lot he could have done today to prevent us losing. He reacted when he had to. We gave a shyte goal away because of shyte defending and jones made an complete arse of the freekick. Get over it. We lost. People are so fickle its untrue. Half of you need to get out there and find a shag

Doctor_Octagon Posted on 25/9 23:34
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

.

--- Post edited by Doctor_Octagon on 25/9 23:35 ---

Buggerlugs Posted on 25/9 23:36
You are telling fibs now

Load of rubbish lad. You had his life in his first seasons here. By the way I've bucked more birds than you've had hot dinners.

bandito Posted on 25/9 23:37
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

constructive criticism matey, thats what they call it. You're just jumping on the buggerlugs bandwagon and he's talked the most amount of ballacks on here in all my time Ive been on the board. Come back when youve got something interesting to say. It's late and you are boring me to tears. Go and get your horlicks

bandito Posted on 25/9 23:37
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

nice edit octagon!

--- Post edited by bandito on 25/9 23:38 ---

outmac Posted on 25/9 23:52
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

well for starters he is the manager of my favourite team,
the team i love and he is spoiling my love affair.
mclaren for england-keep it up lads and lasses.

Bulldog1954 Posted on 26/9 0:31
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Fair enough those who want him sacked, but he doesn't deserve abuse. In my opinion you just don't abuse people from your own team who are trying their best

Chutney Posted on 26/9 8:27
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

We're used to being underdogs. That's how Boro have always been - best performances against the big sides, struggling against the strugglers, and the underdog scenario is what gets the fans noisy and that pushes the team on.

The problem we've got now is that we're not the underdogs anything like as often, but at the same time we don't quite have the class to brush supposedly inferior opposition aside. Even Sunderland.

In fact very few teams do, because regardless of being the supposed "better" team, only the likes of Chelsea can run the game their own way no matter how much the inferior opposition hassle them. The vast majority of the Premiership is pretty much on a par with each other, and unless we approach these games with our peers as though we were the underdog, results like yesterday will continue.

In many ways, it's not McClaren's fault - it's ours. Don't approach these games with nerves, ready to jump on the team's back if 10 minutes have been allowed to pass without at least a 2 goal lead - think of every match as a chance for a really big result if we work at it, and lift the team towards that. And whining about the current management is just pathetic - the current management don't even matter, most fans we're there before they arrived and they'll still be there after they've gone - forget about the management and concentrate on the team and the part the fans have to play.

And I'm not a ra-ra - I stopped handing my money over a few years back because I didn't like the way the club or the league regarded its paying customers, but I can still tell the difference between debate and petulant tantrums.

bandito Posted on 26/9 8:41
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

nicely put chutney

blotonthelandscape Posted on 26/9 8:43
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I thought we were going to win by 5, I was wrong.

Woodymfc Posted on 26/9 8:46
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I cant see any point why people argue about McLaren. We all have our right to state our views, and the anti mac brigade is growing rapidly. If I managed my team as he does his, then my head would be on the block and i would run the risk of being fired.
Losing faith and losing profit are two points of many.
Sunderland fans sang yesterday, can we play you every week - so we sang at the end Mclaren for England, and thats gonna let louder and louder as the rot sets in. Its time for change and we wont win the world cup with that fella in charge, i will take as many bets as you like. Now are there any good managers around who would take this post and form a stable love affair with the fans MR Mogga

Buggerlugs Posted on 26/9 8:54
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Fookin ell! Have I just been called boring by the board's most one dimensional poster?

bandito Posted on 26/9 8:56
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

tell me your ranking in the popularity stakes and get back to me

Buggerlugs Posted on 26/9 8:57
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Oh no I misread that, he said I talk a load of ballacks. That's fair comment.

Rondo_1 Posted on 26/9 9:02
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

He deserves everything he gets

Buggerlugs Posted on 26/9 9:03
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Ah but Bandy you know there is no correlation between quality and popularity.

wooly Posted on 26/9 9:11
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Would Tony Mowbray be the answer?

Big difference between Scottish and English Premiership.

captain5 Posted on 26/9 9:12
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

That's why we love you, Ted.

Woodymfc Posted on 26/9 11:06
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

I dont know if tony mowbray is the answer, maybe its all pie in the sky and he is not quite up to premiership standard ? I think for sure mac isnt the answer. Lets see what the attendance is on our next home game and a part answer is there.

Boateng_7 Posted on 16/1 15:49
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?


Lucky_Alf Posted on 16/1 15:51
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Wow what a sad tw at you are!!

thesonofgod Posted on 16/1 15:57
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

Yep we could not beat notts county then and we cannot beat nuneaton now

reidy86 Posted on 17/2 11:43
re: What's McClaren done to deserve abuse?

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