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Marlon_D Posted on 14/7 13:54
This 12th Man thing.....

On a serious note I was going to go last night but something had come up.

I will hopefully get to the August meeting.

Do you feel that any headway is being made, i.e. Is the club/local media going to give you a gentle shove along the way?

captain5 Posted on 14/7 13:56
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Yes. It's still a bit slow as everyone is new and a lot of things are being repeated.

But we all know which direction we wnat to go in and there are a couple of things immediately being planned.

We've got the backing of everyone's favourite copy and paster at the Gazette and MN4 and Geoff have a good relationship with the club.

Rob will also give us good publicity.

bandito Posted on 14/7 13:57
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Give us an insight as to whats in the pipeline for those of us that live miles away.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 13:59
re: This 12th Man thing.....

There'll be a website up and running by the end of the weekend. Probably best for you to look at that next week.

Marlon_D Posted on 14/7 14:00
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Sounds like it's moving on.

I hope the club will embrace this idea as I think it's about time some sort of atmosphere was generated at the Riverside.

I went all over Europe last year and at times we were embarrassingly outsung and outshouted. This was even happening at the Riverside FFS. It would have never happened at Ayresome.

*clears throat ready for the season*

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:01
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Marlon what if it clashes with dominos night in club Hem?

Boro85 Posted on 14/7 14:02
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Certainly things are very positive at the moment. Obviously people will knock us because we havent achieved anything yet, and thats fair point. However things are moving in the right direction.

The 12th man as a group first needs to be sorted, so these first two meetings have been mainly about us establishing a brand, and working out what we're about. We'll then push that forward through the media, through the club and most importantly through 'events' and such like. For us to succeed we need people to recognize us as a group and know what we're trying to do. Once thats achieved we can up our aim and tackle bigger projects.

As for the events, our "members" (despite there not being a membership as such) have already done the Steaua card display and the surfer, so we've got people with a track record its just theyre under one banner now. Up and coming we've got the Gibson banner (due start of the season, maybe early September) and something for the Chelsea game. Both will be advertised as 12th man projects.

All we can do is keep plugging away, we'll brighten up the Riverside matchday experience with banners and 'events', and hopefully in time that will grow into a vocal atmosphere as well.

Club wise, theyve been very receptive to the idea, and we'll be inviting them to a meeting in the future and hopefully working with them. We'll share our ideas and projects and suggestions and see how we go.

Sorry for the wooly answer by the way.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:03
re: This 12th Man thing.....

So basically it's a step towards syncronised supporting?
Will there be 'cheer' and 'boo' prompts on the scoreboards?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 14:05
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Persumably the girlfriends had homework last night, so there was nothing better to do.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 14:06
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Come on lets be POSITIVE.
I am up for it.

MrEko Posted on 14/7 14:08
re: This 12th Man thing.....

How about face painters on the concourse, you could get that friend of little nibbler.

chboro Posted on 14/7 14:09
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Who mentioned syncronised? I call it positive support and less ofthe negative atmosphere of late

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 14:09
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Agenda for change:

1) Give every one foam hands.

2) More frequent Mark page inspired Riverside waves.

3) Crowd noise on the tannoy.

Have I missed anything?

Marlon_D Posted on 14/7 14:10
re: This 12th Man thing.....

bb75 - games night is on a Monday.

Sychronised supporting?? Isn't it synchronised when the North stand sing or when the Holgate used to. I saw "sychronised" support at Basle, Bucharest, Roma and Eindhoven and it pissed all over our usual 5-6 songs.

At Basle and Bucharest especially I think their home support definetly contributed to their team's performances.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:11
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Marlon, yeah right.
That bloke on the third row of block 15 was man of the match in both games.

chboro Posted on 14/7 14:12
re: This 12th Man thing.....

BOOOOOOOOOOOBOYS need not attend! But they are more than welcome as is anyone!

Marlon_D Posted on 14/7 14:14
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I'll ask the question bb75, were you at either of the games mentioned ?

OhWell Posted on 14/7 14:14
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Boro85, you've got mail.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:15
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Yes I was at both games.

chboro Posted on 14/7 14:15
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Not that I don't believe you - but ANYONE can claim to have been there

Marlon_D Posted on 14/7 14:17
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Well if you were at both away games you can't deny that the atmosphere generated was spot on.

I'm not saying have loud speakers next to the pitch but anything's better than some games at the Riverside last season.
At times it was as quiet as the next 12th man meeting when you walk in and announce who you are.

Boro85 Posted on 14/7 14:17
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Cheers OhWell, your a top bloke (for both emails). Ill send you an email this evening, im waiting for the designs to be sent across to me.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:20
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I mis-read, Marlon, I didn't get to those away games.
The fact that Boro were poor in both games contributed to the scoreline more than the atmosphere.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 14:30
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Often the same people who whinge about the atmosphere who scoff when other people try to do something to try and improve it.

Now, there's a thing.

It's not a revolution, simply trying to make the Riverside a better place for us to go and watch the games and get behind the team. Should've realised that would be controversial.

--- Post edited by captain5 on 14/7 14:30 ---

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:31
re: This 12th Man thing.....

And they have a non-season ticket holder as preacher!

Marlon_D Posted on 14/7 14:34
re: This 12th Man thing.....

bb75 - you fooking tube.

If you were there you would have realised how much of a lift it was for the home teams.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 14:42
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Good atmospheres are generated by whats going on, on the pitch and no amount of gimmicks are going to make a difference, mark Page has tried them all.
No doubt your hearts are in the right place, but its all futile.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:43
re: This 12th Man thing.....

By Christmas, Dave Allan will be pulling the strings.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 14:44
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Why would he want to??

Boro85 Posted on 14/7 14:45
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Why? If we fook up its our fault. If the club get involved and we fook up, then the club will get the blame as well.

If we do a good job, it benefits the club with little effort on their part.

So its win-win for the club as it is. Why would they want to take over?

chboro Posted on 14/7 14:46
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"mark Page has tried them all"

EXACTLY!!!!!


We are not Mark Page - we are the fans in the stands - the ones that CAN make the difference!!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't put it down before you have tried it - give us the support to attempt it because if it works it will improve things for EVERYONE.

Revol_Tees Posted on 14/7 14:48
re: This 12th Man thing.....

rararasputin2 and boroboy75 - you guys should set up your own alternative website which debunks all the myths, ideas and aims of this new fans' organisation. You could call it "13th Man".

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:48
re: This 12th Man thing.....

How will it improve things for everyone?
Are you going to campaign for extra bar pumps, or shitters to reduce queuing?

chboro Posted on 14/7 14:51
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"Are you going to campaign for extra bar pumps, or shitters to reduce queuing?"

Sorry BUT I go to the matches to support my team and watch the football not to get pissed. If thats all you care about why don't you just stay in the pub?

The_Commisar Posted on 14/7 14:51
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Lads, just do what BooBoy75's wife does and ignore him.
He's on one of his wind up missions, again.
The best contribution he could make to the Boro is statying away.

grantus Posted on 14/7 14:52
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Good efforts, I hope it makes a difference and will keep an inerested eye on the 12th man.

BB75 and rara are just a couple of bitter reprobates who couldn't be positive about a beautiful steak dinner and a night of free loving from the girl of their dreams.

Dont expect them to be supportive of anything to do with the Boro. They're not capable of it, ignore them.

--- Post edited by grantus on 14/7 14:52 ---

neiltrodden Posted on 14/7 14:54
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Don't listen to the knockers, everyone loves to put people down before they've had a chance to fail. It just makes them feel better for doing fook all.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 14:56
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Come on then chboro.
What will it improve for everyone then?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 14:59
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I like the intentions, but it wont work, unless you feel the average Boro fan is a performing seal who will jump for a fish.

All you are doing is blaming the Boro fans for the Boro Atmosphere and letting the players off for crappy performances.

chboro Posted on 14/7 14:59
re: This 12th Man thing.....

The whole matchday experience - if we get enough people onside we'll rid the negative atmosphere surrounding games lately.

I like it when the crowd is singing and the atmos is jumping - not when all you can hear is the booboys like yourself having a moan.

It may take a bit of time, but it would be good if it happens!

The negativity has been contagious(sp) all it took was a few and it spread - we're gonna try the reverse and get people enjoying the atmosphere again and joining in!

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 15:01
re: This 12th Man thing.....

What, like cheering every misplaced pass or missed sitter rather than groaning?

neiltrodden Posted on 14/7 15:01
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"I like the intentions, but it wont work, unless you feel the average Boro fan is a performing seal"

Like when they all clap when pigbag comes on? They can work together, just not doing the crp that they do now.

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:02
re: This 12th Man thing.....

We used to sing even when the players were crap on the pitch - trying to give them a swift kick up the arse but nowadays it is just Booo this and Boo that - even kids are doing it and they are the future fanbase, we need to change it round and soon or it will stick into the next generation!

red_rebel2 Posted on 14/7 15:02
re: This 12th Man thing.....

If you want to do anything with this group you should forget broad aims like 'trying to improve it for everyone' and concentrate on small, achievable targets once in a while.

Big games, crucial cup games, derby matches. Set piece events where you can pull something off and leave everyone saying "that was brilliant". Gradually build up credibility with a string of success that people know are your work and not the clubs.

The big cards thing was excellent. Maybe the chelsea match you can do it again with 'Since 1986' as the theme.

Ignore the knockers. Throughout history whenever people who are creative and dynamic try to change anything there will always be the cynics and the inert telling you "nothing can be done." They are always been wrong.

--- Post edited by red_rebel2 on 14/7 15:02 ---

Boro85 Posted on 14/7 15:03
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Red Rebel, that is actually whats planned for the chelsea game. Cards with "86-06 Reborn" on them (or something similiar).

The big events will get us noticed, and we'll work from there.

grantus Posted on 14/7 15:03
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Ok, have a question though.

Last season...

Charlton at home, Villa at home, Sunderland at home, how would the 12th man impove the matchday experience?

Come on, I'm all for this but dont get ahead of your station.

This is a way for people to feel more invloved in the matchday experience and open another avenue of communication between the supporters and the club.

It's not for everybody.

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:04
re: This 12th Man thing.....

red_rebel2 - thats exactly what we are gonna do, target specific games and not try at every game because it just isn't possible at first.

If it works and people join in more it would probably become more frequent.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:05
re: This 12th Man thing.....

So a few banners will stop people booing?

Good football will stop people booing.

People go to watch footy, not join in with little party tricks.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 15:07
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Commissar, I knew you be giving it your backing.
Another publicity drive for your business in the pipeline?

captain5 Posted on 14/7 15:07
re: This 12th Man thing.....

They used to.

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:08
re: This 12th Man thing.....

No one is getting ahead of their stations grantus.

We all know it is impossible not to be pissed off with games like them, but as you saw and heard at the villa game after the fan threw the ticket - the passion in the fans is still there when they sang you are my Boro(I think it was that song) - that made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up.

The atmos at most games - even when winning has been piss poor and we are just gonna try a few things to improve it.

towz Posted on 14/7 15:09
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Ignore all the usual whingeing tools and their criticicsms. It's a great idea and I hope it starts to generate a better matchday atmosphere. Good luck.

The_Commisar Posted on 14/7 15:09
re: This 12th Man thing.....

BB75, keep going , your showing that despite your "oh so clever" veneer, you really know nothing.

grantus Posted on 14/7 15:10
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I'm all behind you, but try not to force things on folk or it wont work, you know?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:13
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Usual suspects trying to prove they are super supporters and by doing so inferring every one else is inferior in their support of the Boro.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 15:13
re: This 12th Man thing.....

You reckon, sabco?

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:15
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"Usual suspects trying to prove they are super supporters and by doing so inferring every one else is inferior in their support of the Boro."

EVERYONE IS WELCOME TO THE MEETINGS AND EVERYONE IS WELCOME TO JOIN IN WITH THE EVENTS.

p.s. - I'm new at this so who are the usual suspects?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:17
re: This 12th Man thing.....

You are saying to 20000 Boro fans your support isnt good enough, cheeky pumped up tw4ts!

Our self appointed heros coming to save us.

--- Post edited by rararasputin2 on 14/7 15:17 ---

--- Post edited by rararasputin2 on 14/7 15:18 ---

bandito Posted on 14/7 15:20
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Just a thought but how about contacting the club to get some flags printed up to commemorate the clubs 20th anni like Sevilla did for the final to commemorate their 100 yr in existence. The kids will love em and can wear them as wrap arounds

captain5 Posted on 14/7 15:20
re: This 12th Man thing.....

You're missing the point by so much I'm not surprised that you can't see it.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:26
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I know what the point is, but you are being patronising to those 20000 fans who are booing too much, by saying "heres a few flags to cheer you up".

captain5 Posted on 14/7 15:27
re: This 12th Man thing.....

And if that was what we were doing you might be right.

--- Post edited by captain5 on 14/7 15:27 ---

The_Commisar Posted on 14/7 15:27
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Yes, I reckon.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 15:28
re: This 12th Man thing.....

A clear case of the minority thinking that they know what is best for the majority.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 15:28
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Ra ra
Are you on a wind up ?
If not you a prize tit.
Ra Ra = Boo Boy

--- Post edited by BroughtonLad on 14/7 15:29 ---

captain5 Posted on 14/7 15:29
re: This 12th Man thing.....

So, the vast majority would not like a better atmosphere??

Mr_Incident Posted on 14/7 15:30
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"A clear case of the minority thinking that they know what is best for the majority."

A clear case of lazy cynics needlessly picking holes in what sounds like an excellent example of proactivism, more like.

--- Post edited by Mr_Incident on 14/7 15:30 ---

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:31
re: This 12th Man thing.....

How many people keep saying they don't enjoy the matchday any more like they used to, it doesn't have the same feeling???

We have been more succesful in recent years than we EVER have been - they should be really enjoying it but they aren't.

Can you honestly say that you think the atmosphere is good enough? I think it is piss poor at the moment and in need of VAST improvements.

ccole Posted on 14/7 15:31
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I wont be wearing any issued foam hands, getting my face painted, or getting in early to put out cards and banners.

But the fact that a few lads have got off there backsides to try and increase the level of support that we have is fair play to them.

It may work, it may fall on its face and achieve nothing, but these lads are having a go, therefore unless someone has a better solution to increase vocal/visual support, donít knock them.

Good luck lads.

--- Post edited by ccole on 14/7 15:40 ---

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 15:31
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I think most people care more about what happens on the pitch more than whether the people around them are singing or waving a foam hand.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 15:33
re: This 12th Man thing.....

If the crowd are up for it from the kick off this will have a positive effect on the team.

That is why it is called The 12th Man.

--- Post edited by BroughtonLad on 14/7 15:36 ---

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:34
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Never booed the Boro on the pitch in 16 years of missing 0 games at the riverside and ayrseome.

So Im a bit insulted about little tw4ts telling me how to support the Boro, as 20000 others may be.

The_Commisar Posted on 14/7 15:36
re: This 12th Man thing.....

A clear case of the minority thinking that they know what is best for the majority.


Ok then lets see you make a contribution....
in the mean time I'll go boil the kettle and build a half scale model of the vatican using my own ear wax.

grantus Posted on 14/7 15:37
re: This 12th Man thing.....

The thing is, this totally goes against boroboy and rara's own action group, The Red card.

It's not as publicised as the 12th man, but has been making steady progress over the last few years.

They count as their successes...

banning people from standing up during the game and reducing the banter and singing from the terraces that used to give them and their members a headache, to the occassional chant. They hope to get this banned this season too.

The increase in booing and drop in attendances.

Its all about politics you see.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 15:38
re: This 12th Man thing.....

You have it wrong Ra Ra
Nobody is trying to tell you to do anything.
Give them a chance.
You are starting to sound like a spoilt kid.

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:38
re: This 12th Man thing.....

A clear case of the minority thinking that they know what is best for the majority.


Have you actually thought about the the fact that YOU MAY BE THE MINORITY??? and the MAJORITY of fans would actually back us?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:38
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Ive made about a £10,000 in todays money contribution.

A lot of players have just taken, but its the fans who are criticised.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:40
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Rich from Grantus us done nowt but whinge on other threads.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 15:40
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Ok Ra Ra lets just Boo The team then.
Happy?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:41
re: This 12th Man thing.....

If the atmosphere is bad then that must be down to the majority of fans.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 15:42
re: This 12th Man thing.....


What a knob

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:44
re: This 12th Man thing.....

It is down to the majority of fans - you are correct.

BUT how do you know the majority do not want it improved?

How do you know the majority don't want to join in with us?

How do you know that it won't work?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:47
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"What a knob"

My point exactly re the people who think they know how to support the Boro better.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 15:48
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Will you be running courses, or publishing a manual on how to be a better fan?

The_Commisar Posted on 14/7 15:48
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I fail to see how bitching constantly and mocking those making an effort to support the team is "support".

captain5 Posted on 14/7 15:48
re: This 12th Man thing.....

You mean like the 'little tw4ts'??

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 15:49
re: This 12th Man thing.....

What's worse, bitching or patronising?

chboro Posted on 14/7 15:49
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"My point exactly re the people who think they know how to support the Boro better."

From your aruments that refers to you too - you are saying that just because you don't want to sing and get behind the team as much as possible that we shouldn't bother even trying.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 15:49
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Come on then Rara.
Show them how it's done then.

ParmoMan17 Posted on 14/7 15:49
re: This 12th Man thing.....

The long term goal of the '12th Man' is to change the mindset of the fans, not brainwashing though.

To make the fans really look foward to games and look forward to being a part of the atmosphere @ the Riverside.

To make our fans known as a group of supporters who make a massive noise and turn the riverside into an intimidating place for oppostion teams and supporters to come too.

We are not saying we can do it overnight - far from it - but by god - give us a chance to at least try!!

I can understand scepticism - it always happens in situations where people try to make a positive change.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:50
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"mocking those making an effort to support the team is "support"

Is not saying to 20000 fans the atmos isnt good enough, having a go at them?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:52
re: This 12th Man thing.....

'little tw4ts'?? sorry if Ive tarred everyone with Cpat5 s brush.

ParmoMan17 Posted on 14/7 15:55
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Not at all Ras - just together - we can make it even better - thats the idea - not to slate the fans already there!

The_Commisar Posted on 14/7 15:55
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Who is having a "go" at the fans who go ?
Please show where someone has had a go ?
You have taken a lot of flack for your negative stance, don't assume that because you get stick, everyone gets stick.

Whats worse BB75 ?
Perhaps making little jibes and sneering is worst of all.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 15:57
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I think it's just beyond Craig's ken to be honest.

He doesn't even seem to acknowledge that the fans can get behind the team and inspire them on.

He probably thought the Bucharest match was 'a bit noisy'.

--- Post edited by captain5 on 14/7 15:57 ---

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 15:58
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Yes the atmos has been poor, what you all wish to ignore is whatmade the atmos poor.

Thats poor football, If that is sorted the atmos will improve.

Dont tell me waving some flags will improve the football, the atmos improved in the Euro games once the 1st comeback goal was scored.

The football on the pitch always has and always will determine the atmos at a match.

Im afraid thats beyond the ken of capt.

--- Post edited by rararasputin2 on 14/7 15:59 ---

captain5 Posted on 14/7 15:59
re: This 12th Man thing.....

If you don't think it's a two way thing then you're missing the point again.

And it's not just about what is happening on the pitch for fans. If that was the case why do fans seem to enjoy themselves more, make more noise etc at away games??

ParmoMan17 Posted on 14/7 16:00
re: This 12th Man thing.....

It's a interlinked thing Ras - i totally see your point

But if the players ran out to a superb atmos then wouldnt they be inspired to perform better??

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:04
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"If that was the case why do fans seem to enjoy themselves more, make more noise etc at away games?? "

Thats 500 not the 20000 you are preaching too.

grantus Posted on 14/7 16:08
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I make observation true, but Im not a whinger, I usually back up my criticisms with ideas, constructive ideas.

I'm not a snake in the grass like yourself.

I'll tell you what has ruined the atmosphere more than anything, more than poor football.

The lose of the standing terraces, the inability to watch the match standing next to your mates. As time has gone by and people have moved around the ground, friends dont even sit together as much either.

That is the number one reason for poor atmospheres all over the country.

One more time, good luck to the 12th man. I do believe that there is a pro standing on the terraces lobby, I think you should lend it your support.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 16:10
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I still don't see who is preaching.

Having a card display at the ground for a big game, coming up with more songs, helping people get banners around the ground. How is this preaching or mocking??

You never know we may help make it so that even those who have decided not to go any more, want to come back.

janplanner Posted on 14/7 16:10
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"The football on the pitch always has and always will determine the atmos at a match."

so does that explain the difference in atmosphere between the riverside and ayresome park? the quality of football on display

loads of things can affect the atmosphere at a game, so the 12th man thing can only be good. if you don't want to be involved no one is forcing you.

i think this thread is more to do with a couple of people who just enjoy a good whinge and a moan, rather than the atmosphere at the match.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:12
re: This 12th Man thing.....

How am I a snake in the grass?

So you are saying you might go If there was a few flags?

Thats a snake in the grass.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 16:12
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Nicely put Jan

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:14
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Ayresome atmos a myth, I was there when there was 6000 whinging at the team.

Football alway has and always will determine the atmos.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 16:15
re: This 12th Man thing.....

So why have you only just given up now??

grantus Posted on 14/7 16:15
re: This 12th Man thing.....

No you are a snake in the grass as is boroboy75 for your cynical sniping at what is only a bunch of supporters trying to give something back, trying to do something, do something good for the club, the supporters all of us.

That is why you are a snake in the grass.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 16:16
re: This 12th Man thing.....

What is wrong with flags and banners?
Remember the Liverpool semi a while back.
The Riverside was a mass of flags.
Probably one of the best atmosphere ever (from the kick off)

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:17
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Im telling them I dont think it will work, like you tell people that fans arent fickle If they dont go, its all opnion.

Ive given up a season ticket so I can be like capt5.

janplanner Posted on 14/7 16:18
re: This 12th Man thing.....

there was definitely a difference in atmosphere between the 2 grounds. there's even a different atmosphere between the north and east stands! night matches are different to saturday afternoons. cup games feel different to league games.

alot of it is down to sense of occasion, and if the 12th man can create that, then it will change the atmosphere, and it will be picked up by the players. imho.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:19
re: This 12th Man thing.....

There was good atmospheres to start with in the euro games, it didnt matter the oppostions scored 1st, then it went dead, until we got back into it.

ParmoMan17 Posted on 14/7 16:20
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Here Here Jan!!!

(in my front way of the commons tone!)

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:21
re: This 12th Man thing.....

The atmos was generated by the occasion not gimicks.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 16:21
re: This 12th Man thing.....

It didn't go dead.
The fans were behind the team all the way.
That is why we did well.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:26
re: This 12th Man thing.....

When we were needed 4 goals in both games it was dead.

When we got within 2 goals, the crowd believed again and it came alive.

yeah_man Posted on 14/7 16:27
re: This 12th Man thing.....

The whole idea seems silly to me. If I find a piece of coloured card on my seat, it's getting ripped up.

ParmoMan17 Posted on 14/7 16:29
re: This 12th Man thing.....

we could argue all day about differing opinions on the atmosphere at the ground, however that is pointless.

All were trying to say is that there is a group of fans who are trying to improve it, if you want to help then great - if you dont then that's fine.

janplanner Posted on 14/7 16:30
re: This 12th Man thing.....

well it might not work. who knows.

but i don't understand why people feel the need to bring it down before anything has happened. i guess it's the kind of people they are. negative, bitchy and contumacious.

janplanner Posted on 14/7 16:31
re: This 12th Man thing.....

why rip it up? why not just ignore it?

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:31
re: This 12th Man thing.....

All Im saying is dont think it will work and that you are patronising people, who dont make a good enough atmos in your opnions, about 20000 of them.

ParmoMan17 Posted on 14/7 16:33
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I think we got that point loud and clear Ras - thanks for sharing it - it has been noted

janplanner Posted on 14/7 16:33
re: This 12th Man thing.....

no one's patronising anyone, if you feel patronised by a group of people organising card displays, banners and the like, i think that's more your problem.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 16:34
re: This 12th Man thing.....

This 20,000 figure. Where does it come from, Craig??

Nobody else has mentioned it.

I do hope you're not suggesting that there are 20,000 people who aren't contributing to a good atmosphere.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:40
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Its a Guess, you keep telling us the atmos is bad.

There was at least 20000 booing against Villa, didnt here any of you lot cheering the team that day.

boroboy75 Posted on 14/7 16:40
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"The whole idea seems silly to me. If I find a piece of coloured card on my seat, it's getting ripped up."



captain5 Posted on 14/7 16:40
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Why weren't you booing that day??

I was.

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:43
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Now you are saying you have to get behind the team, two faced or what?

Specially as you think its clever to call me a boo boy.

captain5 Posted on 14/7 16:46
re: This 12th Man thing.....

No, I'm not at all. We're just trying to make a better atmosphere.

You can sit there in silence all game if you like (or turn the volume on your TV up, it's up to you).

We're just trying to encourage those who might be interested in helping with the atmosphere.

You'd think we were trying to lead a conga through the West Stand Upper.

Hang on..............

--- Post edited by captain5 on 14/7 16:46 ---

captain5 Posted on 14/7 16:48
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Anyway, it's all good this.

Hopefully, as other fans see that there are still some negative people out there, they'll join with us and try and let the positive vibes take over.

We shall overcome some day.

Boro85 Posted on 14/7 16:48
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Meanwhile Bandy actually had a half decent idea up there somewhere. And grantus RE the standing point, its something i know a few of us would like to look at. I spoke briefly to Relfy about demo'ing a singing section for an early round Carling Cup game as well.

Sorry, for interrupting.

Seconds out Round 97 *ding*

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 16:49
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Im just saying it will fail, you overestimate the number of people who will be affected by a few flags.
Every gimick mark Page has tried has failed and even been booed, Im thinking tannoy crowd noise and band there.

damit1968 Posted on 14/7 16:50
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Award for most impressive use of a word today - Janplanner with Contumacious, I would concur with her and further say that fans that don't back the team are otiose

captain5 Posted on 14/7 16:51
re: This 12th Man thing.....

How do you explain the 'success' of Pig Bag then??

holgateoldskool Posted on 14/7 17:03
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Rara and Boroboy you can't beat a healthy dose of cynicism and boy have you two got such a dose in abundance.At least these guys are trying to do something positive - for fellow fans and the club. Mock if you may , by the way what great ideas do you have ?

yeah_man Posted on 14/7 17:27
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"How do you explain the 'success' of Pig Bag then??"

If a tune is catchy, any idiot will chant and clap along to it.

crisboro Posted on 14/7 17:33
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I think some valid points are made through out this thread. I dont think the 12th man is asking anybody to change or telling them what to do or how to support the team. Its a bunch of people who are trying to organise a few things for those supporters who WANT to join in. If yeah man wants to rip up his card or even wipe his arse with it then fine because experience shows from the previous display that there are thousands of others who will hold them up.

yeah_man Posted on 14/7 17:38
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Will The 12th Man be recording more of those rubbish chants to play over the PA system?

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 17:43
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Yeah man
I would say that the MAJORITY of people join in with PIGBAG.
I suppose it does not have the same appeal sat in a pub

--- Post edited by BroughtonLad on 14/7 17:43 ---

chboro Posted on 14/7 17:51
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Well I for one agree that the chants over the tannoy should NEVER be played again - that was Mr Page and NOT the 12th man group as it has only just been formed!!!!!

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 18:03
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I aint got no ideas, because no ideas will work.

The atmos comes from the occasion and the team performance.


A poor atmos last season occured in the league due to the league been treated as unimportant, therefore the atmos was poor, how and why should anybody get worked up If the players dont and the game is deemed unimportant?

relfyoftheboro Posted on 14/7 18:05
re: This 12th Man thing.....

bb75 is clearly on another of his wind ups. I will never understand why anyone even replies to him.

rara - ye of little faith. Can we not even have a little credit for at least trying to make an impact? Whether you think the way we are doing it is right or wrong or even if you think its not possible, you could at least give the 12th Man some credit for wanting to try? How you can feel we are being condescending toward anyone is beyond me. Why do you think like that? Do you honestly think we all believe that we are better fans than this 20,000 you refer to? Everyone can see the atmosphere isnt great, we just want to try some things to make it more enjoyable and memorable. Simple as that.

COME ON BORO

bandito Posted on 14/7 18:09
re: This 12th Man thing.....

air horns and drums are a way forward. Would the club allow this and I designnate that bloke with the ginger beard to bang the drum at the front all game to wake a few people up and stir them into action

bandito Posted on 14/7 18:12
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Relocating the away fans would improve atmospere. That is guaranteed. However the club wouldnt even entertain it so it's a non starter. There's not enough banter at the game anymore

rararasputin2 Posted on 14/7 18:13
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Read back I have said your intentions are good.

But to say the atmos is bad, infers that the fans who are going are lacking in something.

I say the team has been lacking in something.

A good team next year, will see a good atmos.

chboro Posted on 14/7 18:15
re: This 12th Man thing.....

It's a good idea about the fans and you are right about the banter but I think for high profile games where we would have a high crowd(hopefully) the segregation may take up too much space.

20_Briggsy Posted on 14/7 18:23
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I think we made great progress last night and some good discussion on here.

There will be doubters along the way, but lets not let them stop us. A healthy discussion is good.

Side to all the other projects going on I think we should push the retirement of pig bag. Some good alternatives were brought up last night.

relfyoftheboro Posted on 14/7 18:24
re: This 12th Man thing.....

What is wrong in inferring that there is something lacking with the fans? Are we beyond criticism? Football supporters love encouraging their team in a big atmosphere. We just want to try to inspire it to happen more frequently.

I, and many others in the 12th Man, believe that fans can make the difference. Its seems that you do not. You are of the opinion that fans can have no effect on the atmosphere and that its purely down to the team and how they perform. If this is so, then you are never going to be able to understand where we, as a group, are coming from.

Just give us a chance.

COME ON BORO

20_Briggsy Posted on 14/7 18:33
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Well said Relf.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 18:39
re: This 12th Man thing.....

I will 2nd that.

onthemap Posted on 14/7 19:02
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Cant really see how anyone who was not at the meeting can even comment.
If you cant be bothered to attend to find out what its all about then offering a negative opinion is worthless.

rozi Posted on 14/7 19:04
re: This 12th Man thing.....

One lad who was there was just talking about it on Legends show, called him Simon I think.

yeah_man Posted on 14/7 21:18
re: This 12th Man thing.....

"Yeah man
I would say that the MAJORITY of people join in with PIGBAG.
I suppose it does not have the same appeal sat in a pub"

Well the MAJORITY are idiots then.

I don't leave the pub till 5 or 10 mins before kick off, so luckily, I miss Pigbag.

BroughtonLad Posted on 14/7 23:34
re: This 12th Man thing.....

Speaks for itself.
5 minutes before kick off you leave the pub.
Have you ever been there to see the team running out?
How can you rip your card up if you are never there before kick off?

--- Post edited by BroughtonLad on 14/7 23:36 ---