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holgateoldskool Posted on 18/10 9:48
Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

After the great win against Everton isn't time the Teesside public turned out in force for the game ? Reasons - derby game, not on TV, support for Gibbo/Gareth, chance of a win. Sure there could be many other reasons....

captain5 Posted on 18/10 9:49
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Cheap tickets, erm, scratch that.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 10:03
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Very expensive tickets and it will be on in the pubs, also people arent keen on Sunday games, means no bumber turnout.

KENDAL Posted on 18/10 10:06
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Be lucky to break 30,000.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 10:07
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

we are playing a rubbish side, so it will no tbe a full house.

Spoff_MFC Posted on 18/10 10:08
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

One less empty seat, I've got a ticket for this one.

Ste_1986 Posted on 18/10 10:10
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

the attendance should be between 31,000 and 32,000 i would expect which isnt great anyway.

But if not then the fans not attending have to have a long look at themselves and think is supporting the boro in their heart or not !!!

its our biggest home game of the season...GET YOURSELVES THERE !!!!!!!!!!!

Boromart Posted on 18/10 10:11
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I will take a long look at myself and ask why I am not going on a 650 mile round trip on a sunday, leaving my wife and family for the whole day.

boropatch Posted on 18/10 10:12
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Will have to sell in the region of 6,000 to non-season ticket holders to make thirty thousand as their allocation has been reduced so there will be less away support than last Saturday,the question is, was Saturday's performance enough for people to pay at least 31? Otherwise could be the lowest crowd v Newcastle at the Riverside.

dischof Posted on 18/10 10:19
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Ste_1986 - "But if not then the fans not attending have to have a long look at themselves and think is supporting the boro in their heart or not !!!" Does that include the people who genuinely cannot afford to go? Less than 10 weeks to Christmas, many people cannot justify spending the money, especially people who have just lost their Christmas savings due to Farepak collapsing? I believe that families on a low income can be a true supporter whether or not they attend every game.

Ste_1986 Posted on 18/10 10:20
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Boromart...i dint mean those with exceptional circumstances !!!

i was really aiming it at those who would rather watch it in a pub in the boro rather than inside the stadium at the boro !

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 10:23
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I suspect most people in the pub would rather be there, but 30 odd quid to watch players getting 40k a week is a rip off in a lot of peoples eyes.
When the premier league stops ripping off people, people will once again leave the pubs and attend.

jam69 Posted on 18/10 10:25
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

reducing newcastles allocation is a joke,spoils the attmosphere but at 31 min and 17 for kids i dont blame anyone for watching in the pub

Ste_1986 Posted on 18/10 10:28
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

again i accept those that simply cannot afford it but again there is fans that would rather go to the pub have a few pints and watch it on the telly then have the cheek to complain when we lose games !!!

if we are going to move on as a football club we need the fans...not only to generate income but to generate an atmosphere evry home game and get behind the players !

however i also accept that 31 is alot of money for a football match !

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 10:33
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Me and the wife just gave up season tickets from Ayrseome days.
Having had an expensive year and xmas coming up, we have the choice of going to the pub and getting change from a tenner or going to the match paying 62 for tickets and another 25 for petrol, food and drink.
Sadly its a no brainer.

Ste_1986 Posted on 18/10 10:38
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

im looking bit of an idiot now...i accept all what everybody has said but agin there is people who can afford it but would rather spend the 31 on something else that could easily be given up !!!

anyway i still think its abit of a shocker if under 30,000 is there sunday !

dischof Posted on 18/10 10:39
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

To be honest I find away matches better value for money. Taking my 10 year old daughter to an away match, especially places like Blackburn which charged 5 for a childs ticket last season and even taking travel into account - we are getting a full day out for the same as a home match would cost.

KENDAL Posted on 18/10 10:43
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

You can't have a go at people for choosing how they wish to spend their hard earned cash. Even if they can afford 31, maybe they get more enjoyment from sitting in a warm pub with the bar just feet away and watching it on TV.
The Clubs all want the TV money so it works both ways. If no-one watched it on TV the club wouldn't get TV money.

mm40 Posted on 18/10 10:46
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

you are right it will be a bumper turnout BUT for the pubs and clubs, until they get their act together on the ticket prices people will just keep staying away.

Ste_1986 Posted on 18/10 10:59
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

mm40 totally agreed !!!

also the pubs and clubs should be limited to the amount of football they show through foreign channels !!!

Boromart Posted on 18/10 11:06
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Ste, I'm winding you up a bit. There are a lot of legit reasons, for not going. Its personal choice, but I do not understand sitting in the pub to watch it, rather than going to the game. I only watch in a pub when I can't get to the game.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 11:11
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

If people are watching games in pubs, football should be asking itself "how do we attract them back, what are we doing wrong?"
Not saying " lets ban football in pubs, so we can put the prices up again!"
Ste_1986 reminds me of Joe Stalin, wanting to ban free choice.

--- Post edited by rararasputin3 on 18/10 11:12 ---

KENDAL Posted on 18/10 11:12
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

If there are a lot of "legit" reasons for not going, what are the "non-legit" reasons?
Bearing in mind you've said it's down to personal choice.

bandito Posted on 18/10 11:12
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Isnt it a category A game or whatever so the floaters will think fook that.

mm40 Posted on 18/10 11:13
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

we all know its much better watching any sport live but when with bills like mortages, gas etc going up, money is tight. How then can clubs justify and expect fans to then pay 50 for one game ie. what it would cost for me and my son this sunday.

Live premiership football is no longer value for money.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 11:14
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

the national leagues are no longer competitive in europe. The Champs league is the biggest problem. It is no longer possible for a team like Boro to compete for the title....before the chumps league, teams like Norwich, Watford and QPR could. Chumps league has ruined the game.

Secondly the over exposure of football by Sky. What is the point in making the effort to go to a midtable game when you can watch 60 mins of the game at 9pm?

Thirdly, the cost of a ticket has risen far more than the rate of inflation - although the removal of the first 2 problems will result in the third one being less of an issue.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 11:15 ---

KENDAL Posted on 18/10 11:17
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

The club are in a no win situation in a way.
Say they halved ticket prices but then said we can't afford top drawer signings because we don't have the income.
People would then say it's not worth going to watch second rate players.

BarnesBoro Posted on 18/10 11:18
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Rarasputin 25 for petrol, where u coming from?
I imagine u are local to cleveland or you wouldn't see it in a pub.

SO what u driving a tank?

I can get from manchester to middlesbrough an back on about 35

piggy_nichol Posted on 18/10 11:18
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Prices have to be cut. Every game being televised in pubs is here to stay.

10 a game admission, 5 for kids, maximum. It should be agreed between all the Premier League Chairmen.

If the clubs want to keep the revenue up then they will have to charge more for foreign tv rights.

If players have to earn less, so what. Let them go abroad if they want.

Archie_Stanton1 Posted on 18/10 11:19
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I`ve just been to buy 2 tickets, and there were still seats available in the North Stand, so i can`t see it being a sell out as thats normally the first stand to be full

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 11:22
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

If you cut the wages of the top 20 players in the squad by 5k a week, that would save 5.2million a year divide that by say 30000 season ticket holders that would knock 173 of the price of a season ticket, hence making 30000 season tickets a possibility.
The trouble is could some players get by on 35000 a week instead of 40000?

The 25 includes food and drink as well as petrol.

--- Post edited by rararasputin3 on 18/10 11:25 ---

KENDAL Posted on 18/10 11:26
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

How do you know what the top 20 salaries are?
Remember all footballers are mercenaries, none would accept a 5k hit in their salary.

boroboy75 Posted on 18/10 11:28
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

There'll be around 31,000 there on Sunday, as the maggotts who couldn't get tickets have been snapping up tickets for the Boro sections.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 11:30
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I know that a lot could get paid a lot less and still be made for life.
That fact that they are mercenaries though, means that a lot of people are sick of the premier league and when that loses money the players will have to take less anyway.
Its chicken and egg, doesnt matter which came first, you will end up with the same thing.

The_Bozza_Rogue Posted on 18/10 11:36
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I gave up my season ticket this year and I can't say I've missed it.
I'm still undecided whether or not to go on Sunday, but the thought of watching the game in the pub with my mates does appeal to me greatly.
I can go out have a bite to eat and few pints for the price of a ticket.
Football is pricing the person who gets an average wage out of the window.

KENDAL Posted on 18/10 11:36
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Market forces an all that.
Lets face it, the bottom line is footballers don't care less about the fans, they're only interested in grabbing what they can while they can.
Blame SKY TV for the problems.

Spoff_MFC Posted on 18/10 11:39
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Tickets for Sunday can only be bought by people on the Boro ticket database.

Unless Newcastle fans have bought from Boro before they won't be able to buy in the home end on Sunday.

bandito Posted on 18/10 11:41
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

we get poor crowds because in teesside there is a necessity for beer. Some people just cannot go more than a few hrs without a pint so therefore are willing to sacrifice a live game for "beer and mates" I think these sorts are pretty hopeless to be honest.

boroboy75 Posted on 18/10 11:42
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Spoff, I don't think that will stop them. All geordies seem to know, or work with a Boro fan.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 11:48
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"The trouble is could some players get by on 35000 a week instead of 40000?"
The trouble is would we survive in the prem league if we only offered a wage cap of 35K? The quality of player cming to us would drop and we would drop down the league. I think you are over-symplifying things RaRa. Real world life is far more complex than that.

The real reasons for fall in attendances is much deeper. Its not just us. The uncompetitive nature of the premiership, the media focus on the big 4, and the over-exposure of the game, has lead to widespread dissolutionment in many.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 11:49 ---

AtomicLoonybin Posted on 18/10 11:49
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Don't think there will be many Newcastle fans in the Boro ends - somebody posted the other day that the club are asking questions of everyone who buys a ticket.

Here's a situation. Shevchenko signs for Chelsea and immediately becomes the highest earner. As a consequence, Lampard and Terry - despite signing a contract - get their wages increased to match. Ashley Cole is 'insulted' because Arsenal 'only' offer him 55000 a week. A week.

A years 'work' - consisting of training for about ten hours a week, and maybe 190 minutes of football - for most would be enough to set them up for life. For even a mediocre PL player, probably three years would be enough.

Now I know that someone will say 'well, you only pay the going rate, and that's what it is'. It's still obscene.

Personally, ticket prices should be at about 15 given the rate of inflation and cost of living. If chairmen are stupid enough to offer those wages - and yes I do include Gibson - then THEY should pay it, not the fans. We don't have a choice, they do. If they asked us to vote on a wage rise for Mendieta in exchange for an extra fiver on the ticket, I know what we'd say.

AtomicLoonybin Posted on 18/10 11:51
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

And I agree with bandito. Apart from the ones in the pubs, it astounds me how many people HAVE to go for a drink at 3:40. You've paid 30 odd quid for this - watch the bloody game!

bandito Posted on 18/10 11:54
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

It would be interesting to see where teesside ranks in the alcohol dependency stakes.

Spoff_MFC Posted on 18/10 11:57
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"Don't think there will be many Newcastle fans in the Boro ends - somebody posted the other day that the club are asking questions of everyone who buys a ticket"


I've not been to the Riverside since the season before last and have a Wakefield post code.

The only thing I was asked is have I bought Boro tickets before.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 11:58
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

My Wage cap example should apply to every premier league team thats losing fans and thats nearly all of them, including Newcastle!
Why bother trying to compete with the Chelseas and Man Us? We NEVER will be able to so why price out the fans in the process?
Every middling team, needs to sort out the wages.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 11:59
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I beleive they were checking against there customer database before giving tix out.

If you bought tix a couple of years ago you will probably be on it.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 12:00
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

RaRa, so the best players will all go abroad or to Man Utd. so our league becomes of a lower standard and even less competitive at the top.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 12:00 ---

captain5 Posted on 18/10 12:02
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Spoff - yeah, you have to be on their database.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 12:04
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Theres not many leagues abroad who could match the premier league, even with wage caps.
The Man Us get the best players anyway, they still have budgets to maintain, they arent suddenly going to pay the wages of everbodys elses best players!
If Man U or Chelsea wanted our best players now, they would have them anyway.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 12:04
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"Why bother trying to compete with the Chelseas and Man Us? We NEVER will be able to"

Norwich, Watford, QPR and other small teams (smaller than us in fact), HAVE challanged for the title in the past. The diff now is the champs league money. The fundamental problem in football is the allocation of moneys, it has screwed everything up. All the leagues in europe now have a small number of 'super-teams', and a bunch of 2nd rate teams. THAT is the problem that needs to be addressed, and is something UEFA will have to face up to sooner or later.

Personally I would be quite happy for G14 to booger off and play in there own little european soooper league. I wouldn't watch it out of protest, but it would make the prem a damn site more interesting and would raise ticket sales for the majority of teams in this country.

boropatch Posted on 18/10 12:05
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Obviously clubs would love to have every seat sold but they don't really care from a financial point of view because the reciepts are going to be far greater with prices remaining high rarther than dropping prices significantly.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 12:08
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"Theres not many leagues abroad who could match the premier league, even with wage caps."
RaRa, Fenerbahce offered better wages than we could for that Juve midfielder whose name escapes me. Lyon, Bordeux, Marseille can out bid us. Half of La Liga can outbid us, half of the bundesliga would be able to outbid us with these restrictions. etc. etc. It just isn't that simple.

mm40 Posted on 18/10 12:10
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I blame chelsea for a lot of the problems in football, just before Ambrovich got involved clubs were starting to reduce wages. I remember we turned down dwight york because he wanted 60k a week. All of a sudden a rich man from Russia offers players everything and anything to sign for chelsea and so others like man utd, liverpool and aresenal have to follow suit.

130, 000 a week!!! is it any wonder few of us can afford to go to what was once a game the working class loved to follow, not any more.

boropatch Posted on 18/10 12:11
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

The Champs League is a self perpetuating money machine at the moment and just continues to fill the coffers of the better teams who then get more money and continue dominating their leagues and the whole process just starts again leaving the rest in their wake.
It seems the same teams qualify year in year out for the CL.That is the way UEFA like it with the global brands of the big teams appealing to the advertisers and TV that is broadcast worldwide and ultimately funding the whole ongoing imbalance of the modern game.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 12:14
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

French teams cannot out bid us, teams that outbid us already dont want our players.
Im not talking a massive pay cut overall, average of 5k per week for 20 players, that would make very little difference in the potential clubs a player could get better at.
If we lose one or two big deal, weve got a marvelous accadamy havent we?

Derby_Red Posted on 18/10 12:29
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I just don't think anyone in their right mind is going to pay 31 to watch a footy match, even moreso when you consider they could find a pub in their local town to watch it in. Just because it's against so-called local rivals doesn't make it feasible, it's f ckin 31 we're on about here!

Boromart Posted on 18/10 12:30
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

At last someone has finally realised that Chumps leagu eis the big issue, well done Boropatch.

Chumps league is not about sporting excellance, it is a medium for marketing. There is absoluelty no need for group stages....other than to line the coffers of a select few.

RaRa if you think that none of the french clubs could outbid us then your a very silly boy. chumps league qualification means 15mill in your coffers without trying. Lyon get a massive financial injection every single year.

Derby_Red Posted on 18/10 12:39
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Is CL a big crowd and TV audience draw still? Boring as f ck till the knockout stages, does anybody still watch it?

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 12:45
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

French clubs dont get anywhere like the tv money, sponsership or gate reciepts that English clubs get.
If they do there must hvae been dozens of top players leaving England to go to France surely? Tell me who.

If any of our players were good enough for a top team in the champs league, what they doing here?

holgateoldskool Posted on 18/10 12:50
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

If I were Steve Gibson I would depress myself beyond belief at some of the reasoning within this thread.It would indicate to me that unless I could slash admission prices by 50% or over then I am flogging a dead horse.The business module would not make this possible- and how would the season ticket holder be recompensed ? It is a thorny subject that hasn't a easy solution.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 12:54
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

double post.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 13:00 ---

Boromart Posted on 18/10 12:54
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

RaRa Lyon and other top french sides have top players like Juninho, Kallstrom, Malouda, Govou, Diarra, Micoud, Gygax, Ribbery, Pauleta, Kalou, Rothen. These players are on big wages, comparible and in excess to many midprem sides.

Players like Tiago, Smicar and Wiltord could have moved to other prem clubs but they get more dosh at french chumps league sides than middle prem sides.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 12:56 ---

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 12:59
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Players too lightweight for the premier league hence, no ones that bothered about paying them what they want.

Anyway so which Boro players going to play for Lyon in the champs league then and why isnt he?

--- Post edited by rararasputin3 on 18/10 12:59 ---

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 13:02
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Weve seen Schrawzer and George try for bigger clubs recently, no body wanted them.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 13:04
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

RaRa this discussion is not about suitability of players to leagues, and I would doubt any team in the prem would turn down the chance of signing Juninho. You really know nothing about footy, if that is what you are claiming.

It is also not about which current players would gte a game at Lyon. It is about the effect that would be felt if all non-profit making prem sides could not offer more than 35K a week.

The fact remians that there are many european sides that we CAN currently compete with, and if your proposal were adopted there are many which we COULDN'T compete with. Its common sense, unfortunately life has tought me that common sense isn't very common.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 13:05
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Get a grip RaRa, alledgedly Schwartzer had personal issues, nothing to do with wanting a move to a bigger club. George always maintained he wanted to stay, he just wanted bigger wages....that we wouldn't have been able to offer under your scheme. RaRa how old are you? Less than 20?



--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 13:07 ---

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 13:13
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

So that makes you happy that players are just here for the money? That they dont want to play in the champs league as long as there pockets are full?
It would explain the sh11te performances every other week I suppose.
You argument is that players will go to play for french champs league clubs if they dont get enough money at the boro.
Im asking you which players do they want and isnt it sad that obscene amounts of money is their motivation?

They cant go to these other clubs if they dont want them!!!

CeithKool Posted on 18/10 13:26
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Every player at boro if not the country is trying to move to a bigger club, if they werent I would question their motives.

Boromart Posted on 18/10 13:50
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Jeesus christ, RaRa, you loose the discussion, so you then look for a negative slant on my statement to slag off instead. Your as bad as most of the girlfriends I've had.

"So that makes you happy that players are just here for the money?"
I didn't say anything about my happiness or otherwise. I don't really care what motivates the player, as long as he puts the effort in. Most of ours do.

"You argument is that players will go to play for french champs league clubs if they dont get enough money at the boro."
Right its quite simple, I didn't say any of that. What I said was if we only offer 35K a max in this country then we will loose out to some other clubs from some other countries. The allusion you are making is that teams like Lyon, Bremen, Sporting, Bordeux, Galatasary, PSV, Celtic, Benfica, CSKA, and Lille are so far behind Boro in wages that they will not be able to outbid us, even if we limit ourselves to 35K. What do you think they play there players? 5K a week? Get real.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 14:09
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"as long as he puts the effort in. Most of ours do."
Not seen many games in the last year then? For every good game theres been two bad ones.
You are the one who needs to get real, you might be happy to watch mediocre players getting 40k a week and the premier league loves a mug like that.
But crowds are dropping and sooner or later those wages will drop anyway.
So you might as well drop them now and at least get some people through the gates.

boropatch Posted on 18/10 14:11
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

The clubs you mention may pay big wages to so called superstars but they don't pay average players silly wages that the Prem clubs seem to do,Distin,Savage,Dickov,Quederue the list is endless.
The French teams recieve huge sums from Canal I'm sure it is near what the Prem teams get,the French clubs need the money from tv as ticket prices are in most cases half the price than the Prem abd it is very difficult to attract players from overseas as the tax is 60 per cent their on big earners.

j_orourke Posted on 18/10 14:19
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

There some crap on this thread!

"I gave my season ticket up this season and watching it in the pub with some mates appeals to me, some grub and pints of beer for the price of a ticket"...sod off to the pub then I hope the food and booze chokes ya! Plonker!

If we let people in for nowt we still wouldn't fill the ground, fickle gets!

--- Post edited by j_orourke on 18/10 14:20 ---

Boromart Posted on 18/10 14:28
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"You are the one who needs to get real, you might be happy to watch mediocre players getting 40k a week"
again you totally misinterpret (possibly on purpose) what I say to suit your own argument. I said put the effort in, I didn't say anything about having the correct ability levels. I cannot blame a player for picking up more money than he is worth if he is giving 100%. I don't blame Maccarrone for picking up 25K a week, he is rubbish but at least he gives it his all. I am happy he gives it his all, but am aware that he isn't good enough at this level. Conversly, Boksic is a nobber, he didn't give 100%, even though he had the ability to perform at this level.

"But crowds are dropping and sooner or later those wages will drop anyway."
Yes they probably will, but its a completely irrelevant discussion to your proposal that we should cap all prem teams to a max of 35K wages on a single player. Which would do more harm than good. Now you are trying to climb out of the hole you dug with that suggestion by digging laterally, just climb out the hole....admit that your idea is unworkable.

boropatch, you are spot on off corse, about average players earning some big wages (althoguh I'm sure that will go on in other countries), however a cap on 35K per player per week will have ZERO effect on that. On;y an overall salary cap would work.....and clubs in the prem will not go for that.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 14:28 ---

--- Post edited by Boromart on 18/10 14:29 ---

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 14:36
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

My proposal was 5000 a week on average fall for 20 players, you made up the 35K figure.See 11.22 post.For the mid table teams only.
If a player is worth more then it might be justified.

But its laughable to think that will cause a max exodus of top players to france, France have enough top players as do the other leagues.
If the foriegn teams with money wanted our players they would have them anyway.
George and schrawzer put themselves up for a move, you think they wouldnt have gone if a big team came in for them? They didnt so they stayed here.

Archie_Stanton1 Posted on 18/10 14:37
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I must admit that having just handed over 62 for x2 tickets, to come out and see one of the players convertable Ferraris parked there really annoyed me. It`s mugs like you and me that are paying for their cars and millionaire lifestyles. The ticket prices really are unjustifiable. Don`t think i`ll be going much more at these prices.
What were all the players doing at the ground this morning anyway?

I don`t think many Jawdees will be in the Boro end. Bloke in front of me was refused tickets as his address was not on the database, so they are checking.
Strange though that his name was not on when he claimed to have season tickets for 5 years running, only giving them up this summer

Boromart Posted on 18/10 14:56
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"If a player is worth more then it might be justified."
and how exactly do you define worth and justified?

"But its laughable to think that will cause a max exodus of top players to france,"
again I didn't say 'mass exodus', but to allude that it will have zero, or negligable effect is rediculous.

" France have enough top players as do the other leagues."
But if a quality player becomes avail, you think teams like Lyon will say 'nah we won't bother we have enough quality players'? I'm incredulous to your thinking.

"George and schrawzer put themselves up for a move, you think they wouldnt have gone if a big team came in for them? "
.....that isn't what I said, and it isn't what you said.

"Weve seen Schrawzer and George try for bigger clubs recently, no body wanted them."....so you a) alluded to there motivation for a move, which you are making up to suit your agenda, and
b) slagging them off as not good enolugh, also to suit your agenda.

uptheboro79 Posted on 18/10 15:40
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I gave up my season ticket last season due to financial reasons after having one since the Ayresome Park days. I've just bought 4 adult tickets in the north for the jawdee match and the total came to 126. 126 for 90 minutes of entertainment is ridiculous and these where the cheapest seats available, so much for the working class game. I have to work 22 hours to earn 126. I can honestly say that this could very well be the last MFC game that I will attend after 25 years of supporting my club. Not because I don't want to go but because I can't.

KENDAL Posted on 18/10 15:43
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

But it's not 90 minutes of entertainment, the ball is only in play for less than an hour on average.

holgateoldskool Posted on 18/10 15:51
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

It is more than apparent that a lot of fans would go, finances permitting.That is understandable. But surely if Teesside was up for one league match of the year it would be this one - and if you could afford to go surely you'd WANT to go ?

Flint_Stone Posted on 18/10 16:19
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

based on attendances so far we have 21,000 s/t holders, 3,000 floating voters = 24,000. Add 1500 barcodes = 25,500. As its a sunday take off 500 floaters but add 3,000 extra ones as its a 'derby' = 28,000.

That is what I reckon the crowd will be based on my mathematical formulae.

rararasputin3 Posted on 18/10 16:22
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Is Mart trying to say that George and Schrawzers agents did not try to fix them up with Man U (which they both were linked with) or other clubs.
Is not the point of agents to do such things, shouldnt the agents be sacked if they didnt try? Or have the players no ambitions?

They had every right to try to better themselves Im not slagging them off for that and Im not slagging them off for not being deemed good enough for the big clubs.

I know Boros level in the scheme of things and its a lot lower then marts little fantasy level.

--- Post edited by rararasputin3 on 18/10 16:24 ---

rob_fmttm Posted on 18/10 16:28
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

The players were training at the ground today Archie - that's why they were there. Interesting they trained there and then ate there afterwards. Then most of them trained again this afternoon. Not sure whether that was at Riverside or Hurworth.

boropatch Posted on 18/10 16:30
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

If George could pass the ball he would'nt be playing for us.

RedWurzel Posted on 18/10 18:01
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Like Flintstone I would say 28,000 possibly 29,000 as 1,000 may come on feel good factor after Everton display. Also all season ticket holders will turn up while they don't for some games.

The 31 tickets will just sell, but not the higher priced ones.

As said previously the price of category A games is plainly too high.

Against Chelsea we had 29,000 I can't see us bettering that.

15 for an adult ticket is too cheap for a league match. It has to be compared with going to a good theatre or good meal out 20 to 24 mark.

sw2boro Posted on 18/10 18:23
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Don't forget, our tickets are cheap. Relatively.

Our problem, along with Blackburn and Bolton, is that we're a town. There's only so many people who are ever likely to go. As football becomes too expensive for many working class people, which after all was always one of the reasons for having a Premier League, this hits us worse than bigger city clubs, who have a bigger pool of people in absolute terms, and more people who have middle class income levels, but like going to the match. Our area, mainly working class, doesn't.

uptheboro79 Posted on 18/10 18:34
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

In my opinion for the size and financial status of Middlesbrough, we should be extremely proud of our attendances. At 31 for the cheapest ticket, our club should be greatful that the Middlesbrough public turn up in such numbers. There are much bigger towns and cities around the UK where people earn more that don't get the attendances that we do. Middlesbrough is a footballing town where a huge percentage of it's people support their home town club.

jam69 Posted on 18/10 18:38
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

just how is 31-39 cheap??

sw2boro Posted on 18/10 18:58
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Just what don't you understand about "relatively"?

jam69 Posted on 18/10 19:02
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

well if you state relative to what? other sports? entertainment? price of a pint? or should i guess?

uptheboro79 Posted on 18/10 19:07
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

At 31 to 39 football tickets at the riverside are'nt relatively cheap, they're fooking expensive. They've increased at a rate well above inflation over the last 10/15 years.

sw2boro Posted on 18/10 19:15
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Sorry, thought it was implicit, relative to other Premier Leagur clubs.

Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 18/10 19:18
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

The pubs will be bouncing with Boro fans this weekend. That's how relatively cheap it is. The empty seats are a bit of a giveaway, don't you think?

jam69 Posted on 18/10 19:21
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

point is they are too expensive,btw newcastle tickets start at 22,less than boros.iam not blaming boro they have to compete with the rest,but people are geting sick of being ripped off and are turning their backs on football.
because of boros small catchment area its more noticable as we dont have anyone to take there places

boropatch Posted on 18/10 19:22
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Many people can afford it but I bet if any research was done the average age of the crowds has increased and pro-rata there are less 15-18 year olds going on their own and I'm sure this will have a long term effect on future support.

jam69 Posted on 18/10 19:25
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

iam not saying some of the people who stay away cant afford it,they just see it as poor value.
when i buy a pint of beer i pay 1.80- 2.50,i could afford to pay 4 for a pint but wont because it would be a rip off,its called market forces

sw2boro Posted on 18/10 19:26
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

CtC - that just backs up my argument, ta.

jam69 - that's my point, ta.

bp - oh yes, seeds of football's own destruction yada yada yada...

jam69 Posted on 18/10 19:31
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

its a catch 22 isnt it sw2,but i think all clubs will have to drop the prices in future

sasboro Posted on 18/10 20:25
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Crowd will be about 39,000.

40 pounds for the east stand upper are far too expensive. they are the ones that remain empty. I bet even the 12thman gang wouldnt even pay that.

If you go back to 1989 then the price of a pint was about 1 pound and the holgate was 4 pounds and the seats about 6 pounds. so if a pint is now about 2.50 pounds then a ticket behind the goal should be only 10 pounds.

Gone are the days when he club could milk the money in from a high profile game.

the club is trying to balance 2 agendas. first one is to maximise the season ticket sales to generate as much money as possible and the 2nd one is to attract more floating fans. Now if you reduce mach day prices too much then it undermines the point in having a season ticket. no point having one if its not cheaper than paying on the day.

Middlesbrough has one of the lowest average wages in the country so you cant expect people to pay 31-40 pounds. we can compete wih cities where their income is higher

Being on in the pubs isnt helping but its footballs fault for selling its soul to tv companies.

Whats the solution? none really apar from marke forces such as suplly and demand, lower wages and lower ticket prices. Perhaps the loyal fans need to show their love for the club and buy the expensive seats so that the floating fans can go to the games on a cheap ticket.

Also the fans cant relate to the players, few players step anywhere near middlesbrough apart from a matchday. Seeing he expensive cars in the carpark after a poor result when someone has spent hard earned money on a ticket doesnt help.

On thing that drives me mad is the high ticket prices but the club waste plenty of millions on players (16M on massimo overall) currently massimo,parlour,ugo and mendieta cost about 100k per week. thats 10 pounds knocked off 10,000 tickets

i can only see the big 4 getting stronger while the rest lose crowds. i blame sky games for making kids follow the big teams

--- Post edited by sasboro on 18/10 20:58 ---

holgateoldskool Posted on 19/10 9:01
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Some good points, SAS but there surely is always a way if the will exists ? How about the club doing something for those who wish to go but can't go ? Let me explain.

For fans on low wages we could have a system where these people could purchase tickets for say 5 home matches in a season at a discounted rate. Perhaps some sponsorship money could be allocated to finance/subsidise the scheme.This would show a commitment by the club and if this type of scheme failed it would show that the stomach to support the Boro is not that great.

Of course this initiative isn't flawless-what is ?

Boro_2006 Posted on 19/10 9:02
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Have a ton

ste_north_stand Posted on 19/10 9:11
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I can't be arsed reading all of this thread but i picked up on someone saying they would prefer to spend their 30 quid watching it in the pub. Now to me if you can't make the match for whatever reason: distance, work, family commitments etc then fair enough but if you spend your 30 quid in a pub a few miles away from the ground when you COULD be at the game then i fail to see how you can call yourself a supporter.

Ste_1986 Posted on 19/10 9:47
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

ste_north_stand is spot on !!!

OverTheTopAussie Posted on 19/10 9:53
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Agree. If you're going to spend the $31 anyway, then a supporter would see the match live rather than in a pub.

Totally agree that some can't afford the prices. But if they then go off and spend the same money in the pub .... well, they're just pulling our leg aren't they.

Rararasputin you should go support Darlo or Sunderland or some one else in a lower league. They have all the things you want - lower prices, lower paid players, fewer Rollers in the yard. Hopefully Steve Gibson doesn't follow your financial advice or thats where the Boro will end up as well.

I really believe Rararasputin would prefer to wind back the clock to the old Ayresome days. Passion on the field and in the crowd, cr@p players, a full house (but well less than current numbers), no women, standing areas where your right to stand somewhere is based on how big you are, never seeing Boro games on TV and last but not least - toilets optional. Sorry mate, that time is thankfully long gone.

number_10 Posted on 19/10 9:53
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I'll be there, first game of the season. It's going to be a real one off though unless they start doing some cheaper seats, 31 quid cheapest is obscene and I just can't afford it. I reckon the crowd will be 32k or so.

I've made this point before, but if anyone can spend 31 quid in the pub in the duration of a football match, they should be going to their nearest AA meeting, not a live game. Chances are most will spend a tenner or so (4-5 pints maybe), which is significantly less.

--- Post edited by number_10 on 19/10 9:55 ---

jam69 Posted on 19/10 10:21
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

some people dont go because they cant afford it,and some dont because though they can afford it its a rip off,31 MIN and 17 to watch a game of football is a joke

dibs72 Posted on 19/10 10:26
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

In reply to Boromart...

I am working in Satvanger, Norway and am flying in to Newcastle on Sunday morning and flying back on monday just so I can get to this one.

750 miles, 12 hour round trip.

Ticket for the game: 30 odd quid
Flight to UK: 240
Watching Boro stuff the Scum: Priceless

Boromart Posted on 19/10 10:33
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"Is Mart trying to say that George and Schrawzers agents did not try to fix them up with Man U"
I don't know, but I do know that said Shcwartzer and Boateng tried to get moves to bigger clubs, not that there agents..."Weve seen Schrawzer and George try for bigger clubs recently". Again you dig your hole for yourself even deeper.

"I know Boros level in the scheme of things and its a lot lower then marts little fantasy level."
You really are a stupid little boy aren't you, at what point have I stated our 'level', please don't try and second guess my opinions because you are very bad at it.

rararasputin3 Posted on 19/10 10:35
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

You are about right there Aussie, I did prefer football when it was more genuine and less about how many millions people could get out of the pocket of the ordinary fans!

Which is why Ive seen more Guisborough town games then Boro this season.

Sometimes the old ways are better.

You say those days are long gone, well the bubbles bursting and sooner or later players will have to be paid realistic wages, Id prefer sooner myself, so we still have a boro to watch rather then just a euro super league.

ste_north_stand Posted on 19/10 10:36
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

But saying you can't afford it then going down the pub and spending 30 odd quid there just makes you look a bit daft really.

rararasputin3 Posted on 19/10 10:41
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Dont call me a stupid little boy, geek.

I know having a go at the premier league which Boro is a part of is upsetting to you.

You take it as a personal attack, due to having nothing else to live for in your sad little life.

Personally, now Im married, got a mortgage Im finding football to be not all important and theres better ways to spend money then being ripped off, watching mediocre players on obscene wages play crappy football.

jam69 Posted on 19/10 10:46
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

even at todays beer prices 31 relates to about 12 pints,i dont tthink most people are drinking that.i think people look at say
match ticke 31
food and or drink 6
geting there and back 5
total 42 with the cheapest ticket
trip to pub,watch the game in comfort with 4 pints 10,and are voting with there feet

ste_north_stand Posted on 19/10 10:47
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

And you'll be back if the team start doing well again?

Wilkosperm Posted on 19/10 10:51
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

People who stay in the pub and watch the games are fans of the pub, not of the boro.

jam69 Posted on 19/10 11:02
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

iam going to the match,just stating why alot of people dont,and i dont blame them at them prices

Ste_1986 Posted on 19/10 11:24
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

rararasputin3 your an absolute muppet !!!

Boromart Posted on 19/10 11:30
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"750 miles, 12 hour round trip.

Ticket for the game: 30 odd quid
Flight to UK: 240
Watching Boro stuff the Scum: Priceless"

Good on yer mate. I do it several times a year, but with 2 kids I have to pick and choose.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 19/10 11:36 ---

MontTeettyBlanc Posted on 19/10 11:36
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Last time I travelled back to watch Boro they put in one of their most spineless displays for years, against Blackburn last month.

With a 300 mile round trip to fork out for, a pees poor salary and a new house to straighten out, I'm gonna have to give it a miss.

Never claim to be Boro's biggest fan but until the team start consistently playing decent football and the club make the tickets cheaper, I can't see the Riverside being filled even by fans living closer than I do.

A half-empty stadium is a sad sight but the club and particularly the mega-bucks players need to realise its up to them to get the fans back in on merit rather than appeal to the crowd to be a 12th man and all that emotional black-mailing ballox.

Boromart Posted on 19/10 11:40
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"Dont call me a stupid little boy, geek."
Well don't act like one. I am proud of the slight geeky nature to my persona, comes from years of working in the computer industry. The girls love the slight vulnerability side that comes with being a geek.

"You take it as a personal attack, due to having nothing else to live for in your sad little life."
again further assumptions about me, I have a lot in my life, 2 beautiful children to start with. So again you make yourself look really stupid. You were called stupid, because you acted stupidly, making stupid assumptions. By continuing with your off the wall assumptions, you have proven that you have an inability to learn from your previous mistakes. Proving conclusively that you are indeed cerebrally challanged.

"Im finding football to be not all important and theres better ways to spend money then being ripped off, watching mediocre players on obscene wages play crappy football."
Well go waste your time elsewhere then.

uptheboro79 Posted on 19/10 11:50
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I agree with you montTeettyBlanc on this one. I really struggle financially to get to the games now. I have to sacrifice a family holiday each year to take my kid to see 5 games a season. Theres no nothing worse than when you get the feeling that we lost the game through lack of effort, knowing that you have made such sacrifices. Then you walk outside the ground to see a car park full of exotic cars like Ferrari's, Aston Marin's and huge 4X4's. It's a complete kick in the teeth.
Footballers deserve a decent living from the game but it's now getting out of control. They have to appreciate where their massive salaries are coming from and the personal sacrifices that some fans make to finance such huge wages.

rararasputin3 Posted on 19/10 11:51
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

The way you are getting worked up is all the proof I need you are a sad loser.
I gave up going to watch the Boro, its not important in the scheme of things, its way to important for you.
I come on here during the day and have a bit of an argument, to get a loser worked up thats a bonus.

You say you have two daughters, got a wife that puts up with you?

Boromart Posted on 19/10 11:59
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

I do slightly agree with the odd thing you say though RaRa,

I think the heart and soul of the game is being ruined by money. This is really a sky and champs league induced problem.

"Sometimes the old ways are better."
The old days were pants though, dangerous grounds, pitches like a farmers fields, players that weren't even fit enough to run 10K, and very poor technique.

You say players should be paid "realistic wages". I don't know how you define that, and personally I have no problem with them earing what they can. Yes the money at the top end is obscene, but that is only really for chumps league sides. There are plenty of people in the financial sector in london who pocket more than Viduka, or Boateng.

The "euro super league" you mention is something that may happen and I for one will see it as a good thing for the rest of us. We would suddenly have a competitive league and by all the little clubs accross europe working together we could destroy the Man Utd, AC Milan and Barcalonas of this world. Greed will do them in eventually.

Boromart Posted on 19/10 12:04
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"The way you are getting worked up is all the proof I need you are a sad loser."
So all you are capable of is cynicism, insults and sarcasm. You must be the life and soul of the party. I'm not worked up at all, I'm just a stubborn booger.

"I gave up going to watch the Boro, its not important in the scheme of things, its way to important for you."
Well why waste your time on here? and don't tell me a person you have never met that something is "to(sic) important in my life". Its as important as I want it to be, and you are just showing what a prat you are by dictating my life to me.

"I come on here during the day and have a bit of an argument, to get a loser worked up thats a bonus. "
ah so YOUR life is so devoud of any interest that you spend your time on a messageboard starting arguments? I think that it is painfully obvious who the loser is.

"You say you have two daughters, got a wife that puts up with you?"
Now your starting to tread over a line, if you wanna meet up and discuss this it will be my pleasure. Actually whats the point your just an arse and not worth the trouble. For a second I was actually annoyed rather than just laughing at you. But your such a pleb your not actually worth getting annoyed at.


I guess your user name (mocking anyone who wears a scarf or goes on the organised coaches) and your opinion on me as a 'geek' and 'football being too important' to people like me, shows the kind of person you are. You think your better than me and thousands of others fans don't you? Your a complete tool.

PS I have a daughter and a son, which goes to show you can't read proper like either.


--- Post edited by Boromart on 19/10 12:15 ---

holgateoldskool Posted on 19/10 12:30
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

It appears the initial thread has been hijacked by some who have no idea about the economics of life. If certain people feel they don't wish to support the club, can't afford to support the club then fine nothing can be done about it.

Referring to the make and model of cars been driven by the players - are these the opinions of the jealous ? We all know they are vastly overpaid but it is a problem the whole of football has. If I were Steve Gibson I could become heartily disillusioned with the Teesside public as it appears fewer and fewer are prepared to continue to back his dream.

He has put his money where his mouth is - food for thought or what ?

uptheboro79 Posted on 19/10 12:36
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

You could say my opinions are motivated through jealousy but that was not my point. My point is that certain players and agents have no intrest in the clubs they play for other than money which is coming out of the pockets of the fans who dont have much money to spare.

holgateoldskool Posted on 19/10 12:49
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

Some guys I know work where they do simply for the money. They don't have any real love for the company they work for.Surely this is just the same as footballers.

boropatch Posted on 19/10 13:19
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

There must be fans who pro-rata of their income put more into the club than Mr Gibson.
You simply can'nt force someone to go to a football match,market forces will dictate what happens in that aspect.
It's not as if people are meeting in town halls and organising boycotts.It simply individuals making their own minds up wether to go or not.The problem is once people get used to not going it proves very difficult to get them back.

uptheboro79 Posted on 19/10 14:04
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

The difference is that the company who are employing the guys that you know are making money by employing them. The people who pay footballers wages are the supporters.
There is very little loyalty in football. Generally footballers are'nt loyal to the clubs, the clubs are'nt loyal to the footballers. The only loyalty comes from the working class fans who have supported their clubs from generation to generation. These people are justifiably or unjustifiably being priced out of football now. There are only so many people who can afford to go and watch the boro week in week out, whilst the prices stay high.

sasboro Posted on 19/10 22:43
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

"People who stay in the pub and watch the games are fans of the pub, not of the boro."

as the tickets are 31-40 ponds i hope you are doing your bit for loyalty and offering to pay the full 40 pounds for your ticket?

WHy are some saying its 30 quid spent in the pub instead of going to the game. a ticket for the game costs 31-40 pounds and lasts abou 90 minues. 4 hours in the pub to watch the game will only cost about 12-16 quid at the most in beer money. then if you go to the game you have to spend money on top of any pre match drinks. then add travel costs. probably 90 minutes of football is equivalent to a full day out in the pub including football on tv. now who gets value for money? and thats no includiing travel costs. ask yourself is 40 pounds a fair price for 90 minutes of football and would you pay that yourself?

redz69 Posted on 19/10 22:46
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

redz is 31 pound ok to pay for a football match?


no its not, give my head a shake it's full of cartoons, shut up me!

--- Post edited by redz69 on 19/10 22:47 ---

the_righteous_one Posted on 19/10 23:08
re: Bumper turnout on Sunday ?

28,500, its not as if its a derby game