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Brick_Tamland Posted on 2/8 11:10
Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Will stimulate debate, I'm sure.

Link: We must win back the fans

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 11:17
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I don't think this fella should be allowed to speak..

The season ticket fall SHOULD concern him!

boyfromtheboro Posted on 2/8 11:22
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Its coments like these that demonstrate that the club just don't listen to the fans. Everything coming out of the club seems very flat at present.

captain5 Posted on 2/8 11:23
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Poor choice of words from Mr Lamb.

He probably thought that whatever he says the fans use it as a stick to beat the club with, he might as well just talk a load of crap to start with, cuts out the words twisting process for fans.

Brick_Tamland Posted on 2/8 11:23
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I;m sure those fans who are not renewing are also quite relaxed about the season ticket situation.

Guisboro Posted on 2/8 11:25
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

That picture is terrible

swordtrombonefish Posted on 2/8 11:25
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Imbecile - with PR like that, who needs the gutterpress?

dave_catching Posted on 2/8 11:27
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The usual arrogant, obstinate, alienating drivel from lamb.

Why don't they just define a 'big drop' in season tickets and give us a number. We'll all see anyway in 9 days.

The comment about non-season ticket holders walking to the match on match days creating more revenue than if they had season tickets is pure lunacy.

They're not coming Keith. Trust me on this one.

Brick_Tamland Posted on 2/8 11:27
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I'd never heard of a chief executive in a business who isn't concerned about the sales rate of his company's product until today.
He says his concern is winning football matches, but isn't that more Gareth Southgate's remit?

I'm a supporter of Keith Lamb, but I think this 'eveything's ok' is bravado at its best and is quite transparent.

cookiemonster159 Posted on 2/8 11:28
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Doesn't sound that bothered really does he? lets hope that the team get it right for him on the pitch so he can make plenty of money when people have to pay match by match!

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 11:28
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

It's a topic that should be publicly discussed by the club, but HE shouldn't be the one discussing it!

He does nothing for the clubs relationship with it's supporters..


alanramage Posted on 2/8 11:29
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Even were in the top 10 I still don't think the missing season ticket holders will turn up to see us play the likes of Wigan, Reading, West Ham, Portsmouth,Derby etc etc

Babe_Rhuth Posted on 2/8 11:30
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"The usual arrogant, obstinate, alienating drivel from lamb."

Have to agree with that, I'm afraid.

Towell Posted on 2/8 11:31
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I don't really see what is wrong with his comments.

What is he supposed to do, plead with the people of Teesside to please come back.

I think it's right whats he's saying it's up to the football club to bring the fans back by playing decent football

trodbitch Posted on 2/8 11:31
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

While you are all moaning about the relationship with supporters, any chance you can tell us what he "should" say? No? Well shutthefuckup then! Moaning, moaning tvvats!

sasboro Posted on 2/8 11:31
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

like these quotes..someone should tell lamb that those that dont renew dont come back for every game as they already think the prices are too high:-



“The season ticket situation doesn’t concern me at all,” said Lamb.

“The onus is on the club to produce a product that people want to come and watch.

“In actual fact we are better off filling the ground on a match day with non-season ticket holders.

“It is financially better for us because they don’t get the season ticket discount.

“Of course we want to satisfy the demand for season tickets and get the figure as high as we possibly can.

“But there is an upside to not having the place full of season ticket holders, that is you get new fans in every weekend.”

The_Commisar Posted on 2/8 11:32
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

FFS
thats NOT a gazette interview with lamb, it's a badly hashed re-print of an interview he did with sky a week or so ago.
The gazette has been reduced to printing reheated stuff.

ThePrisoner Posted on 2/8 11:41
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Well, well. They didn't cut ST prices and surprise, surprise sales have collapsed. It must be pretty bad if they won't even say how many have been sold. I said we'd sell about 15 000 and I suspect I won't be far off. Expecting thousands to turn up to pay on the day is a pipe dream. This season is already a disaster before a ball has even been kicked.

boroboymike Posted on 2/8 11:42
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

“The onus is on the club to produce a product that people want to come and watch."

Interesting line there. Wonder if that's him saying Gareth's honeymoon period is over and the responsibility for fan numbers lies with him.

No hint of contrition or a possible "err we probably should've knocked the prices down"

OverTheTopAussie Posted on 2/8 11:46
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

We're a funny lot on here aren't we.

We say that the club has to play decent football if they want to entice people back. When Lamb says it he gets slated.

We say the club should be more interested in the on field performances than making money. When Lamb says it he gets slated.

We say that the club has to entice back supporters it has lost. When Lamb says it he gets slated.

We say the club has to try and win new supporters to replace those that have been lost. When Lamb says it he gets slated.

Now Lamb certainly doesn't have the best turn of phrase thats for sure and some of his quotes are very poor, but some are a recognition of exactly what has been spouted on here ever since McClaren took over.

IMHO some people on this thread either:-
1) have an axe to grind and even if Lamb announced we had signed "Kaka" they'd just say he was talking shyte.
2) have an entrenched negative attitude towards the club that they can't or won't reconsider. Or,
3) are incapable of comprehending the written word.

sunset_over_ici Posted on 2/8 11:50
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The bit about not being concerned about sales is weird. But surely all that having an attractive product to entice fans back stuff is what people on here have been moaning about for years? Or is it all down to the prices now?

sitheman Posted on 2/8 11:54
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

the point is keith lamb is our cheif exec not our football manager. his job is to get concerned with these types of issues. ffs im concerned with this issue and im not even employed by the club let alone its chief exec.

and yes i would expect the club to be more or less beggin fans to get there season tickets. thats called marketing. we are a business, we therefore need to be going out and activly shoving our product down peoples throats. seems we are doing very little to market our club.

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 11:56
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"While you are all moaning about the relationship with supporters, any chance you can tell us what he "should" say? No? Well shutthefuckup then! Moaning, moaning tvvats!"

Trod, hows about a nice simple, "We're disappointed to have lost season ticket holders this season, but we'll do everything we can to address this problem both on and off the pitch"

There's no need to spout the rest of his drivel about how match-day sales are better than season tickets! Why even come out with such crap!?!

Boromart Posted on 2/8 11:59
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I'm sure he has his concerns, but he isn't going to publically admit that is he.

Last time he did admitted something like that was his infamous "The fans will get the club that the Teesside public can afford". Which has been repeatedly misquoted and used as a stick to bash both the club and Keith Lamb personally.

I guess he has learned to give banal and defensive answers to just about any question these days.

Archie_Stanton1 Posted on 2/8 12:01
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Some of those quotes are beyond belief

“But there is an upside to not having the place full of season ticket holders, that is you get new fans in every weekend.”

Did he really say that? Where does he think these thousands of new fans are going to come from?? I`m sorry but i`m starting to doubt the guys sanity.

Worse still, it`s starting to look like the stories of 15,000 ST sold are correct.

Still, thats not a problem, as we`ll just fill it with all the new fans.

Jesus.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 12:03
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

“It is financially better for us because they don’t get the season ticket discount."

i think that sums up how the premier league and mfc think these days.

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 12:04
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"you get new fans in every weekend.”

He should be concerned that the 'new fans' will generally be former season ticket holders, who've lost the faith and only return for a few games, not 'new' fans!

--- Post edited by BossHogg on 2/8 12:10 ---

borobuddah Posted on 2/8 12:06
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

What the hell is he grinning like that for?

Brick_Tamland Posted on 2/8 12:06
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

How dare the man smile!

Woodymfc Posted on 2/8 12:07
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

We are on the edge of a looming crisis in reality
falling ST sales
unable to attract the right players

BoroMod Posted on 2/8 12:09
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

“The onus is on the club to produce a product that people want to come and watch."

How can people slate Lamb for saying that? Everyone has been saying the same all summer, why when Lamb says it do people like Sas come out and have a go?

Some of the other comments are slightly worrying though, it seems the club are burying their heads in the sand over it. If they honestly think they are going to create more revenue from match-to-match fans then they really don't have a clue. They just won't come, it's as simple as that.

Get the games banned in the pubs, play some good football, reduce prices and try to facilitate some sort of atmosphere. Those are the things that will bring fans back, just trying to forget about it won't make the problem disappear.

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 12:11
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

“The onus is on the club to produce a product that people want to come and watch."

No-one is slating him for saying that!

As you then stated it's the part about season tickets and match day sales that has baffled people!

--- Post edited by BossHogg on 2/8 12:12 ---

sasboro Posted on 2/8 12:16
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

i stick up for lamb in the past over things but he is burying his head in the sand on this. Ignoring the reasons why people are not renewing. good football will not bring that many back. the prices and the generally feeling towards football in general is the problem. such as players on ridiculous amounts of money.

with regards to banning games in pubs, its the premier league clubs that are to blame because they are the ones selling the tv rights to anyone in the world.

Archie_Stanton1 Posted on 2/8 12:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The crunch will come V Blackburn when everyone can see just how many season tickets have been sold.

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 12:21
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I doubt it Archie, match day sales will be pretty good for the Blackburn match after 3 months of no football!

horse_head Posted on 2/8 12:24
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Lamb can't win with you lot can he?

If only Gibbo would show a modicum of common sense and appoint one of the loons from here as chief exec we would fill the stadium no problem. And be more media savvy to boot.

Boromart Posted on 2/8 12:24
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"i stick up for lamb in the past over things but he is burying his head in the sand on this."

Don't lie Sas, in fact you have used the the phrase "Are you Keith Lamb" as an insult to anyone that says positive things about the club. I have seen you do this to three different people. You do not have a well balanced opinion of the bloke, you are anti-Lamb.

I would hope the guy isn't burying his head in the sand. I think this is more a case of not washing your dirty linen in public. Football fans micro-analyse every single syllable uttered from players, media and execs and often manipulate them to slate the club or get into some mass panicked frenzy. See the fallout from Gibbos "we have a chance of one or two spectacular signings" for proof of this.

Yes gates will be down, there is currently a malaise about the place, maybe they will pick up if we do well. But I'm more concerned about the on pitch happenings. I couldn't care less if we don't fill the stadium as long as the team is successful.

Boromart Posted on 2/8 12:27
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"with regards to banning games in pubs, its the premier league clubs that are to blame because they are the ones selling the tv rights to anyone in the world."
By that logic if your burgled then it's your own fault for having nice possessions.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 12:47
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"By that logic if your burgled then it's your own fault for having nice possessions."

eh?

trewoboro Posted on 2/8 12:55
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

“In actual fact we are better off filling the ground on a match day with non-season ticket holders.


“It is financially better for us because they don’t get the season ticket discount.

The usual bullsh! t from Lamb. Im sure theyd rather have money in the bank than rely on people turning up match by match. Most people i iknow who have given up there season tickets over the last few years dont go back and dont miss it. Think were looking at 22,000 to 23,000 crowds this season.

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 12:55
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"with regards to banning games in pubs, its the premier league clubs that are to blame because they are the ones selling the tv rights to anyone in the world."

This will be the same premier league who turn a blind eye to Sky allowing every british owned cafe and bar in holiday resorts across Europe, showing the games against the law and stealing revenue from the host broadcaster in each country!

They have a problem with it when it suits them!!

Boromart Posted on 2/8 12:56
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Ok, explain how it is the prems fault!

Boromart Posted on 2/8 13:00
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

BossHogg, surely the prem cannot be expected to deal with illegalities in other countries, it is impossible for them to monitor this.

Their primary concern is making sure that English prem clubs do not lose out by having live televised games in English towns. They have a duty to the clubs first.

borobadge Posted on 2/8 13:03
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Lamb is giving answers to the questions posed to him...

and v. honestly and fairly in my opinion.



people such as myself and others have been saying for seasons that part of the atmosphere thats missing is because of this 'must have a ticket in advance' crap....i hope the next step is to take the bull by the horns and get the seasts out of the east stand lower and re-introduce to top flight english football a standing section, and one that you can 'pay @ the gate' to get into....

that plus of course a decent team winning football matches and playing decent exciting entertaining high tempo free flowing football..

for me the glass is still half full.

trewoboro Posted on 2/8 13:04
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Right lets ban horse racing off the tv because its stopping people going to race meetings ???

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 13:05
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Agreed Boromart, but it's double standards!

I strongly believe that people would ignore the pub if the product and the price were right at the Riverside!

billybalfour Posted on 2/8 13:06
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Ive never been a ST holder and never will be, and ill get to games i can afford/have time like i allways do.
Keith lambs right, i usually get to a handfull of games a season,some with the missus and it works out i could have bought a ST easily, i worked out last year i put over 500quid into the coffers. not bad for a part time supporter who got to 5-6 games

sasboro Posted on 2/8 13:15
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"Their primary concern is making sure that English prem clubs do not lose out by having live televised games in English towns. They have a duty to the clubs first."

but they arnt losing out as they are getting more and more money from tv revenue. that is where the priority is.as keith lamb is implying they arnt that fussed about getting more fans in the ground. as each new tv deal comes through the clubs get more money. the clubs are now more interested in getting money from tv than maximising the crowds. once the tv money peaks then they will focus back on getting the fans in. at the moment clubs maximising tv revenue is worth the price of losing fans in the stadium.

--- Post edited by sasboro on 2/8 13:17 ---

fatharrywhite Posted on 2/8 13:16
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

i'd also point out that if steve gibson had come out and said exactly the same thing he wouldnt have got half the stick that KL is getting.

for some reason fans see him as the anti-christ and it doesnt matter what he does or says he'll just get slagged off.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 13:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"i'd also point out that if steve gibson had come out and said exactly the same thing he wouldnt have got half the stick that KL is getting."

gibson probably gets lamb to handle the trick stuff in the press

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 13:24
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"i'd also point out that if steve gibson had come out and said exactly the same thing he wouldnt have got half the stick that KL is getting."

Yeah that's right, Gibbo hasn't taken any criticism for his "Specatular" statement has he? although he still has four weeks to be right about that one!

Plus, I'm not sure Gibbo would have come out with the same drivel as Lamb!

RedWurzel Posted on 2/8 13:30
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I think most of us agree some sort of price reduction in STs would have been sensible for this season. The more STs who have the bigger your crowds over the season, as people go to the less fashionable games as STicket holder and may not go, if they haven't paid for it.

A price reduction may have made fans think twice, the club could have frozen matchday prices still making the season ticket discount cheaper.

I suppose this is with some hindsight, if we have only sold 15,000 that is well below what I would have guessed back in May. I still will be surprised if its that low. To lose 30% in one summer takes some doing.

If we get 23,000 for the Blackburn I would guess STs will be 15,000.

Maddren_Madman Posted on 2/8 13:41
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Crowds are down due to;

1)too much negative boring football - not just by the boro, loads of teams turn up playing 4-5-1 and kill the game. Even allowing for some brilliant games, mostly its a bit dull. Everton are the worst by far.

2) The money culture of football - a lot of people just hate footballers being on insane wages and everything that goes with it. people are sick of it. When I see john terry on 135k a week, although i fancy being rich, it just seems immoral for doing so little graft. loads of people think that, epsecially in poor areas of the country and want no part of it.

3) ticket prices as a % of typical wage earned in the area are too high.

4) people dont want to buy a season ticket because of the discount schemes later in the season(when crowds drop off) make it cost a similar amount and means you dont lose money on your season tix when you can't go due to working shifts/having the runs/chasing women

5)Struggling to finish 14th is just way less exciting than challanging for anything in any league - we'd get bigger crowds if we were fighting for promotion in the Championship.

6)No drinking, standing, smoking, swearing and stewards in hi viz jackets all put a damper on the fun

7)Even at 20,000 we're often double or 3 times what we used to get in the 70s/80s. So historically, we're doing ok.....which sort of invalidates points 1-6. oops.

aliasme Posted on 2/8 13:44
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

“But there is an upside to not having the place full of season ticket holders, that is you get new fans in every weekend.”

If you can't get the season ticket holders to attend what chance do you have of getting casual fans to come, Keith?

The_Commisar Posted on 2/8 13:45
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Hibs fans asked how much we were paying for our tickets...they were shocked
"Thats cheap considering the palyers you get to see, we pay £330 to see pish"

Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 2/8 13:47
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I don't know whether you fellas read the whole article or not. What he says is he hopes to see bigger gates. That's what's wanted surely. He also says that he wants the performances on the pitch to bring the fans back. That's also what the missing fans want.

You half wits are more concerned to hear bull coming out of the club, 'we'll be in the top 4' etc. Well he's told it like it should be. He wants a full house and doesn't mind if they're season ticket holders or not. Spot on. Too long in the same seat makes the fan a dull boy. As demonstrated above.

skiprat Posted on 2/8 13:47
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Looking at the prices for the Category A matches this season (minimum £31) then the discount for season tickets is a lot more than originally thought of.

I can see why the comment about him not caring has been picked up on, although I don't see too much wrong in everything else he's said.

I just want to season to start so the complainers can complain about the football as I'm a bit bored of the same arguments on here now.

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 13:57
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The club is losing out on Saturday afternoons when people go to the pub to watch the game on foreign satellite. It gets no financial recompense for this.

The rights to those games have NOT been sold by Sky in this country, because of the agreement with the clubs not to screen 3pm kickoffs on Saturdays.

This is not the clubs or Sky's fault, but the fault of dishonest publicans who want to increase trade in their pubs on a Saturday afternoon by showing the local team's game, thereby encouraging fans to go there instead of to watch the game at the stadium.

It would be interesting to know how many hundreds or thousands of people around Teesside who call themselves Boro fans are watching the game in this way, taking what the club provides without paying towards the cost of it.

kermit_the_smog Posted on 2/8 13:58
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I'd quite happily try scrape the cash together to go every week if it was gonna be bouncing. I used to go to the footy matches and really enjoy it, sing loud and have a good time. Whenever I go to the riverside now its quiet, you cant stand at all, people don't sing and instead sit there and moan, a very small block do sing but it hardly catches on.

All in all it's boring. Reading last year, they were doing really well in the league, we were winning the match. Atmosphere completely dead, litter blowing all over the pitch, not even reading fans singing and could just hear the players shouting to each other.

It's dull and boring. I don't wanna use what little spare cash I have to go and sit in that atmosphere. (to be fair I can't even afford anything at the moment)

Away games are fantastic, even if we lose we generally sing loud and stand, generally get drunk and forget about it on journey home and have a good party on coach.

Maybe it's McClarens fault making the game dull and boring at the riverside and subsequently the crowd being bored and frustrated.

The players have even said before, it can be really intimidating playing at the riverside for THEM and not the opposition.

Maybe ticket prices, stewards, smoking bans and TV on in pubs has driven away the fans who cause a bit of noise and get the crowd going.

I know performances on the pitch will get the crowd going, but the crowd can also get the players going, works both ways and a lot of the time it doesnt work either way!

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 13:59
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The club is losing out on Saturday afternoons when people go to the pub to watch the game on foreign satellite. It gets no financial recompense for this.

The rights to those games have NOT been sold by Sky in this country, because of the agreement with the clubs not to screen 3pm kickoffs on Saturdays.

This is not the clubs or Sky's fault, but the fault of dishonest publicans who want to increase trade in their pubs on a Saturday afternoon by showing the local team's game, thereby encouraging fans to go there instead of to watch the game at the stadium.

It would be interesting to know how many hundreds or thousands of people around Teesside who call themselves Boro fans are watching the game in this way, taking what the club provides without paying towards the cost of it.

Maddren_Madman Posted on 2/8 14:03
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

excellent points kermit.....this thing about it being so quiet you can hear the players and coaches shouting - that never used to happen, not even back when we had 10,000. As an old gadgee meself I find it shocking...sometimes the atmosphere is like a training game. Sometimes i feel like if I was to shout out "get yer fookin fingers out yers bunch of bassards" i'd be frowned upon and thrown out for being working class.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 14:04
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

i dont think dodgt tv in pubs makes that much of an impact. i think its jsut an excuse peopel are using to blame it on why crowds are dropping.

if ticket prices were a lot less then we wouldnt need dishonest publicans. if the clubs and premier leageu werent so greedy then there would be a full stadium but stil people watching in the pub. you cant blame the pubs when sky charge something like 500 per month for sky football.

skiprat Posted on 2/8 14:12
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Definitely nail on the head Kermit.

With price increases there is now an almost unachievable level of expectation of the crowd who sit there (mostly in silence) practically saying "entertain me".

When was the last time that the Boro crowd just got behind the team without it being in response to a near shot/corner etc? I don't remember a great deal from last season.

If the players don't come out all guns blazing then the crowd start to turn and lose patience, players become nervous and fluff chances. It's a vicious circle. The main one that annoys me from where I sit is if the team are holding onto the ball, maybe passing it around midfield and defence the crowd begin to bay for blood wanting it forward.

Impatient and unnecessary but sadly I think it will be exactly the same this season.

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 14:14
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I wonder sas. It would be interesting to know how many there are.

As for your other point "if ticket prices were a lot less then we wouldnt need dishonest publicans" - that's like saying if laptops were cheaper, we wouldn't need burglars to steal them and sell them at knockoff prices. As for the poor publicans having to pay £500 a month , if they don't make more back on sales than the £500 cost, then don't have it. There is no excuse for stealing it.

trodbitch Posted on 2/8 14:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"This is not the clubs or Sky's fault, but the fault of dishonest publicans who want to increase trade in their pubs on a Saturday afternoon"

It's the premiership's fault for selling the same rights for such a cheap price abroad that those broadcasters can screen them free to air on a signal that can be picked up in the uk.

burydweller Posted on 2/8 14:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Lamb is fantastic, he moved quickly to get the likes of Tuncay, and dumped shallow clowns like Zendon and Viduka, who compromise the wage structure. Zendon is finished, and fat boy will play 15 games this season and become fatter. Its the moaning fcukwits like yourselves who let the club down, get behind him, Gibson, Southgate, and the club, if not, we dont want you at the riverside.

burydweller Posted on 2/8 14:21
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The atmosphere is flat, because one of the few mistakes gibbo made, was filling the corners in, we are a smallish town with big ambition, population you see chaps, not a huge town.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 14:22
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

its no different than people buying knock off gear cos the real stuff is over priced. or buying copies or fake stuff.

the general feeling whether its the pub or football fans is that we are all being ripped off by the premier league and sky tv. The discontent is gathering pace and people are just getting fed up with being ripped off and taken for a mug. Until fans start turning away from games they will continue to rip us off. just think how much it costs to have atleast 1 or 2 season tickets, sky sports and setanta over a year. people are starting to feel the pinch and cutting back.

if the price of a match ticket was down to a respectable price then they wont have this problem. CLubs like boro have the choice to reduce prices to fill the stadium. its in their hands. do clubs really have the fans at heart or too busy creaming in the tv money to care?

skiprat Posted on 2/8 14:25
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

£20.50 a game or £390 over a season IS a respectable price to pay for Premiership football though.

tacker Posted on 2/8 14:26
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Keith Lamb is nothing but bad news for this Club.

I hate his lazy attitude towards things, self-conciously trying to make us fans feel calmer about the ever-creasing decline we're slowly having. It doesn't help that he tries to hinder players out of the Club aswell, but thats a different story.

I think he thinks in his little dreamland, that MFC are going to make up the few odd thousand ST's they've lost with pay as you go supporters, as stated above, it's just not going to happen. I didn't renew my Season tickets, partially because of the football I'm watching, and also because I couldn't quite afford to renew, but I certainly won't be attending every home game this Season, I'll go when I can afford to, whether we're playing Man Utd or Derby.

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 14:27
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"It's the premiership's fault for selling the same rights for such a cheap price abroad that those broadcasters can screen them free to air on a signal that can be picked up in the uk."

True, it doesn't help, but it is common media practice to sell a product at the value it commands in a particular marketplace. For example in the UK we get high quality US TV products for less than the yanks have to pay for them, because their market value is lower over here.

Regardless of landlords being able to screen the games, the fact is that it is illegal for them to do so.

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 14:30
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"its no different than people buying knock off gear cos the real stuff is over priced. or buying copies or fake stuff."

Correct - the difference is that I am a Boro fan, so I care about when Boro are being stolen from. If I was a Gucci fan, then I'm sure I'd be pissed off about seeing knock-off Gucci gear being flashed around.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 14:32
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"£20.50 a game or £390 over a season IS a respectable price to pay for Premiership football though."

it is to you but probably not to another 10,000 people who dont go. the hardcore will go what ever the price.

then some people cant commit to a season ticket so want to go match to match, but then change their mind when they see some ticket prices ranging from £24-40. how many seaosn ticket holders would pay £40 for a ticket at boro about 6 times a season?

even if they managed to ban premier league games in pubs it wont bring them back. sadly the premier leageu has sold out to the tv companies. they just cant have it both ways by wanting loads of money from tv but not expect people to make teh choice and watch it on tv. billions coming in from tv revenue but high ticekt prices. tickets should be a max of a tenner(4 pints of beer). lamb said in the past he sees the future that tv revenue subsidising ticket prices..so whens it going to happen

we all knew that the continued increase in number of live tv games would start to hit attendances.

--- Post edited by sasboro on 2/8 14:38 ---

trodbitch Posted on 2/8 14:32
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I understand about the marketing aspect but it's the fact the same product is then available in OUR marketplace. What exactly is illegal about a landlord using a legitimate viewing card in this country? It might be against the terms and conditions of the foreign broadcaster for them to publicly show the games in the uk but that is surely not actually a criminal offence?

Boromart Posted on 2/8 14:44
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

there are some truly ignorant statements on here "you cant blame the pubs when sky charge something like 500 per month for sky football.".

Of course you can blame the pubs. The pubs don't have some god given write to screen football. If they are using it to entice people into their pub then it is entertainment and they should pay towards it. If a band plays in a pub they get paid, if football is on in a pub they have to put money into the clubs via sky.

Showing illegal foreign TV is breaking the law, it isn't sky's fault, it isn't the clubs fault, it is the pubs trying to get free entertainment to swell there own coffers. They arn't doing some public service, or trying to write the wrongs of the commercialsation of sport. They are ultimately stealing from the coffers of the clubs.

It's fair to say some people do use it as an excuse, but some genuinely chose the pub because its cheaper and they can get pished.

Ultimately these pubs need closing down.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 14:44
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

i suppose a landlord pays his money to the tv channel who then use some of that money to pay the premier league with. so they ae still gettting their money. but not the shedloads they charge in the uk

"They are ultimately stealing from the coffers of the clubs."

no they are not! the money the pub pays goes to the tv company not to the premier league. and it wont make any difference to attendances if the club down the road doesnt show the game live. football is just too expensive. how about the clubs ripping of the fans and wasting millions

"It's fair to say some people do use it as an excuse, but some genuinely chose the pub because its cheaper and they can get pished."

exactly, the pub is cheaper that goign to the game! reduce prices!sigh!


--- Post edited by sasboro on 2/8 14:47 ---

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 14:44
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

According to this article, it seems it is, punishable by a £5000 fine.

Link: Article

Boromart Posted on 2/8 14:58
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"i suppose a landlord pays his money to the tv channel who then use some of that money to pay the premier league with. so they ae still gettting their money. but not the shedloads they charge in the uk"
But because of many factors in the global market differant territories rightly are charged differant amounts. Ultimately it's sky's product and they can set whatever rules tehy wish as long as they are within the law....and they are.


"the money the pub pays goes to the tv company not to the premier league.
Yes and the TV companies have contracts with the prem league, which ultimately means that a % of the money goes back to the clubs. If this situation expands then it will cost sky money and eventually when the next TV contract happens they will reduce the amount of money they pay for TV rights.

"and it wont make any difference to attendances if the club down the road doesnt show the game live."
Of course it will, neither of us can say what differance it would make, but some people would go to the game if their were no pubs showing it.

" football is just too expensive."
If you can't afford something then go do something else, go bowling and spend £25 in 2 hours their. Go to the cinema for 2 hours, with your popcorn and sweets and drinks theirs another 15 quid.

It isn't the job of Lamb and Gibson to make sure that ickets are as accesable as possible.

Lets take it further. You say the club don't care about gates anymore, it's all about TV money. OK so would do you say to the concept of free STs to the first 32,000 fans? Of course the coffers will suffer, but you will get your wish of affordable football and a full stadium.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 2/8 15:03 ---

BossHogg Posted on 2/8 15:01
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"This is not the clubs or Sky's fault, but the fault of dishonest publicans who want to increase trade in their pubs on a Saturday afternoon by showing the local team's game, thereby encouraging fans to go there instead of to watch the game at the stadium."

As I said earlier Sky can't have it both ways! They allow cafes/bars in Spain and elsewhere in Europe to illegally show/subscribe to a UK satellite service and show premier league football to the detriment of the national broadcaster!

Boromart Posted on 2/8 15:04
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

But surely that depends on the deals agreed with Prem League. If the deal says that Sky CAN sell the product in other territories to bars/cafes etc. then they are perfectly within their rights to do so.

from a moral perspective they are actually catering to brits abroad, here we get arabic stuff being watched on TV in pubs by brits. The pubs on Teesside are not providing a service to the large number Saudi tourists in the area

--- Post edited by Boromart on 2/8 15:07 ---

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 15:08
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Who cares about Sky though? It isn't Sky who are being stolen from when games are screened on a Saturday afternoon - they are banned from screening games then anyway. It is the clubs that the pubs are taking revenue from.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 15:11
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

i aint going over old grounbd with you again cos i know you are the sort of fan who woul dpay what ever the club offer. drop the prices down to a £10 or £15. 10,000 odd fans cant all be wrong on how it is over priced. and dont believe the bull that there are 10,000 fans who used to go hidden away in pubs watch the game.

the clubs and premier league are the ones who can decide on where they want teh game to go. the couple of million lost in gate reciepts would easily be absorbed by the extra tv money coming through. as if an extra £2 million would suddenly make us a lot better team. the club just cant have it both ways...billions from tv but then dont want fans to watch the games on tv. who do they expect to watch the games and pay for the tv rights?

20 years ago before tv money it would cost £4 to watch boro or manutd which was about equivalent to 4 pints. so now a ticket should only cost £10, probably less when you think how much extra tv money is now infootball.

cinema or bowling for about 2 hours costs £10 max, for a family it might cost £25. for a family to go to a match it can cost £70-£150(plus spends) depending on the match. do the maths. how much are people paying on top for sky sports,sententa, plus other stuff like internet connections, mobile phones..etc it soon adds up and makes spending £100 on a foobtall match too expensive

Kilburn Posted on 2/8 15:19
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I agree with you on tickets being overpriced sas.

If the price was just about maximising revenue, then they probably have set it right, on the basis that you set the price at the limit of what the market will take.

However, the current pricing seems to ignore the non-financial benefits of having a fuller stadium, on the atmosphere and resulting team performance (although you may not agree with this, as you have previously argued at great length that atmosphere doesn't affect team perfomance).

Boromart Posted on 2/8 15:26
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

you never answer the question put to you do you sas? There is a lack of debate, just preaching.


"20 years ago before tv money it would cost £4 to watch boro or manutd which was about equivalent to 4 pints. so now a ticket should only cost £10, probably less when you think how much extra tv money is now infootball."
Of course beer has got worse in quality over the last 20 years, and football has got better in quality, if this Boro squad played in the 1986 Division One it would finish top 3.

£10 for 2 hours bowling where do you go?

--- Post edited by Boromart on 2/8 15:39 ---

sasboro Posted on 2/8 15:43
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

what question?

glad to see you answer about comparing the prices with a pint of beer with a daft response. has anything else gone up by similar ratio to football prices in last 20 years? when we move to the riverside prices went up from £8 to £12 that was a big jump. each season the club have tried their luck by keep putting prices up. now they realise they cant put them up anymore but are reluctant to bring them down. everytime a club moves stadium they bung the prices up claimign they need to pay for the stadium. then once that excuse is used up then its something else.

Boromart Posted on 2/8 15:46
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

what question? I'm sick of repeating them to you, go look for it.

is it a daft response? because you say? The ingrediants that go into a prem club (players) now are far better than those that went in 20 years ago. The ingrediants that go into beer these days are cheaper.

I'm not saying it's not over priced but I am putting it into perspective. We all wanted to have the best players in the world and the best league in the world. Well unfortuantely there are side effects to that.

--- Post edited by Boromart on 2/8 15:47 ---

sasboro Posted on 2/8 15:57
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"what question? I'm sick of repeating them to you, go look for it."

sounds like you dont even know the question yourself

do you believe all the hype about best league int eh world? thats sky tv for you. you must realise that all the greed from clubs with the tv money and lack of respect for the fans through the turnstile is turning people away. sometime to benfit the long term you have to take a hit to attract new customers. look at it as like an advertising campaign where the company is spending money to bring in new customers. its not looking good with crowds continuing to drop until they bring the prices down or force sky to show only 1 or 2 games a week and not sell tv rights abroad for 3pm kick offs

billybalfour Posted on 2/8 16:13
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

in 1987 tickets were £4, where i worked the welders and platers were on £7 ph approx, thats £273 pw gross 39hrs,
they could afford 68.25 tickets out of a weelky wage.
average wage round area now for a welder is £10 ph thats 390 gross pw, the average ticket price is £28 , the same welder can now only afford 13.9 tickets today.
thats a big difference

--- Post edited by billybalfour on 2/8 16:14 ---

Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 2/8 16:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Boromart, you add on extra costs for the cinema etc. but don't add on the extras at the Riverside. Why's that? You don't have to buy either, but you do when you get there, and I know where the higher additional costs are.

Football sold out in the early 90's to appease the big four. Now that it's a mickey mouse league the fans of clubs like ours are moaning about the drifting crowds. Have a look at Scotland, that's the role model we're following.

CheshireBoro Posted on 2/8 16:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Previously I thought KL was fundamentally OK - seemd to speak sense genrally - but i have to admit i dont get the gazette and only read it online when sometrhing major has occured.

That said - He couldnt be more wrong about this. How can he not be worried about the lack of season tickt sales?? I predict (pretty confidently too) that we will sell out once this season (Man U) or maybe not at all. Off hand i can't remember if we had any sell outs last year (perhaps the quarter final).

For sure, we can point to the fact that generally speaking crowds were a lot lower in years gone by, but we were sold out every week for about 3 years not so long ago. We were getting 34500 for the likes of QPR etc.

It can only be two things (and that is the thing in any business) - It has to be either quality or price or both. To my mind , it is price and here is why.

During the last 3 and a half years, we have won a cup, qualified for Europe and done all right, qualified for Europe through the league, got to A European final and during that time we were not selling out (probably 5 sell outs in 3 years) - SURELY it wasn't the quality then....

Whoever made the point about pints and matches is spot on for me. In the late eighties it was £4 to stand on the Holgate, I seem to remember it went up to £6 in 1989, but even if you use that figure, what has happened to the cost of living in the last 18 years?? It certainly hasnt quadrupled!! If prices and wages go up on average by between 2 and 4 % per year (compounded) - that £6 should now be worth £10.21.

Facilities? Superstars? Seats?

They are not worth a carrot if you can't afford to get through the turnstiles in the first place.

skiprat Posted on 2/8 16:23
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Perhaps he's not arsed because he knows the season ticket money 'loss' won't matter once he gets the 30 million at the end of this season?

I've always thought that the ST money made up a decent wedge of the 'budget' but I don't think that's the case now.

If I don't see a season ticket decrease NEXT season (although I think ST's are reasonably priced in comparison to other Premier League clubs) then I will be surprised.

West_Stand_Skunkie Posted on 2/8 16:29
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

10,000 season tickets at an average of about £375

(mix between full payers like me, phookings kids, phooking sponging students, phooking OAP's who have phook all else to do, phooking cheapskates in phooking cheap seats)

brings in about £3.75m

So 5,000 seaon tickets here or there is only an loss of £1.875m (phookall really)

THATS WHY HE DONT GIVE A TOSS

Boromart Posted on 2/8 16:35
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Nope sas, I'm just bored with having to repeat question s to you 2 or 3 times before you actually address htem. Like I said you don't debate, you preach.

"do you believe all the hype about best league int eh world?"
I didn't say it is the best league in the world, I said before the prem was born that people wanted the best league in the world. What we have is the league with most of the best players, but as a sporting spectacle it is quite poor.

Yes there is greed, yes the league is screwed, but the quality of player now is undeniably far far better than it was before the prem existed.

The biggest problem with the league for me is the financial dominance of the big 4. It is no surprise to me that our gates are falling because we have recently had unparelleled success, but have also over the past 10 years come to realise that we can never compete any higher than we have. UEFA cup finals, league cup finals thats it. Because of the financial imbalance. The fans subconsciecly realise that we can't get any higher and are turning off, cost is part of it, but it is also an excuse. It's the lack of hope that is the real killer.

skiprat, of course the ST money is a smaller % of our total revenue these days, but if you drop revenue you drop profits/increase debt thats a fact regardless of where the revenue came from. I accept that the game has had the soul sucked out of it, and that ticket prices are part of that, but to reduce ticket prices 'may' solve one issue, but could also create others - relegation.

Serious question - Would people prefer to have full houses in Div One, or 8K empty seats in the prem?

The money from the TV contracts will and already is making it's way into players pockets because that is the natural order. It's not right but to say ST and gate money is now irrelevant is blatently incorrect.



--- Post edited by Boromart on 2/8 16:38 ---

sasboro Posted on 2/8 16:49
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

West_Stand_Skunkie, like you say if the arent that bothered about the drop in season ticket sales then they obviously arent fussed about the £2m or so they have lost in recent years with drop in season ticket sales. so really they wont be bothered by another drop if it brings more fans in with cheaper tickets. obviously keith lamb looks at gate receipts as just paying the bills but the tv money is what he is more interested in.

"Serious question - Would people prefer to have full houses in Div One, or 8K empty seats in the prem?"

sigh! an extra 2m quid does not guarantee staying up or promotion. if that was the case then reading would have been relegated,newcastle would have finished 5th,bolton finished 14th, blackburn finished 16th and so on. ther is no reason why we cant have cheap tickets,top flight football and fuller stadium.. for £2m quid that has a minimin impact these days. barely pays mendietas wages, huth wages,rigotts wages, and so on

holgateoldskool Posted on 2/8 16:59
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Frankly the comments are crass and stupid - but hey who is really surprised ?If he were a chief executive of any PLC company he would be dismissed for incompetenece.

It really shows the club haven't a clue. Dare they share with their "fans" the number we had coming to the matches last year on a "walk up" basis? Not a chance.

Sadly he is doing a great impression of a clueless baffoon !

Boromart Posted on 2/8 17:23
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

sigh! sas, fookin sigh! I am not saying that the extra couple of million multiplied by however many years (lets say 5 years = 10 mill less investment!) you want the club to loose this money is going to guarentee staying up. But money is undoubtedly, long term a part of it.

Manure and Chelsea will never be relegated, because there income is huge. It is inevitable that Reading, Bolton, Fulham, Sunderland and yes Boro will get relegated because of lack of finance.

By reducing our finances as a good will gesture to the fans you are increasing the possibility of relegation. Not guarenteeing it, but making our situation a little harder. So my question still stands, would you prefer full houses in the Championship or empty seats in the prem? A straight answer would be nice, but I won't hold my breath.

TMG501 Posted on 2/8 17:33
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Dont know if this has been highlighted before but I think it might be pertinent to the the debate.
Blackburn Rovers reduced their ST prices and revenue has increased £1.5m.
As far as Keith Lamb is concerned "In actual fact we are better off filling the ground on a match day with non season ticket holders". Tell you what Keith, how about 17-18000 dont renew our ST's next season, it's for the good of the club you know.
Wonder what'll happen then.
Just a thought.

sasboro Posted on 2/8 17:42
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

thats an impossible question to answer really, option you giving is low crowds or relegation. surely they both go hand in hand to a certain extend. and since when does a £2m drop in gate receipts mean relegation. with prices frozen and season ticket sales down , will this mean by your reasoning we will be relegated?

you cant really compare the likes manutd and chelsea cos we can never compete even with that £2m extra. for the rest of us if league went on how much money you generate then newcastle would be 5th and reading, bolton,blackburn near the bottom. fact is £2m would have minimal impact. a bigger impact is the manager you have. or resting players for cup games. will all that extra money from the fa cup run and uefa cup run the other season why didnt we suddenly zoom up the league last season?

Boro_Gadgie Posted on 2/8 17:58
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Not had chance to read every thread on here, but I think to be fair to Lamb, he's in a back-handed way sticking up for the fans, saying that it's up to MFC to deliver on the pitch.

I do think however, that the way he's said it is a bit of a PR own goal. Hope it doesn't have the same effect as Gerald Ratner criticising his company's product. I don't think it means that Lamb and Southgate are at cross-purposes. I think deep down, Lamb would love the Riverside full every week. It would be common sense for him to want this.

TeessideCleveland Posted on 2/8 18:12
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Shame not to give it the ton

MyBoro Posted on 2/8 18:16
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

By reducing our finances as a good will gesture to the fans you are increasing the possibility of relegation.

BUT BoroMart, by reducing prices you will get more fans and may actually increase the amount of money coming into the club.

Bizarre that you and MFC have such a simple view on revenue.

--- Post edited by MyBoro on 2/8 18:18 ---

Lurkalot Posted on 2/8 18:36
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

How does Lamb keep his job?

I've not heard such a pile of shytte in a long time. The guy obviously does not have a clue.

boropatch Posted on 2/8 18:56
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The only people benefiting are the average players at the average clubs where the custodians are fearful of falling behind their immediate rivals and continuing to pay grotesque wages.

bblf Posted on 2/8 19:09
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The one thing that stands out is that Sky reported only us as having a reduction in season tickets.
For all those wittering its too expensive why did you renew last season and the one before because it was the same price then. Unless you are a slave Im assuming your wages have gone up in that time so in real terms they are actually less of your budget.
I know some will have more resposibility or lost their jobs etc however for the majority its cheaper or the same price.

The real reason is we have around 10,000 fickle supporters who wil come and go dependant on how we are doing or who we are signing. They just like to have another excuse for not coming eg prices, sky, players wages etc.

indestructible Posted on 2/8 23:00
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Haven't read the whole post but for me it's quite simple. Boro as a club has gone a bit stale. "The Riverside Revolution" of the mid-90s is long gone and most people have come to expect Boro to be in the Premiership every season now, as we have for the last 10 years.

The only way to get the fans back in was to give them a genuine bit of goodwill and knock a token £60 off the season ticket prices, like some other clubs have done. Fulham's prices are £300 now and there is a lot more money floating around in South West London than in Teesside, trust me on this.

The club have missed a trick, and they won't admit the mistake because they never do.

As I've said on another thread, and it seems to come as news to some posters, Steve Gibson is human. He makes mistakes sometimes.

borobabe2007 Posted on 2/8 23:24
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Keith Lamb should have been sacked in 97 he fo**ed up against Blackburn and Steve Gibson just hid it FACT

BroughtonLad Posted on 2/8 23:27
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Tit

Sparkymctastic Posted on 3/8 2:38
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I love it, some of the comments on here are hillarious!

"Lamb is nothing but bad news for the club."

Brilliant!

The club would not even exist in its current form without him. Gibson puts in the cash, thats a given, but an Aston Martin driven by Mrs Miggins is still just another old lady on the road! It has been Lamb putting in the work every single day for the last 21 YEARS that has got us where we are today!

I can garauntee there is not a bigger Boro fan on here than him, not one who has been to more matches, not one who knows the game so intimately and not one who has felt as much joy and pain at our successes and failures as him. I know that because his generation are not t'internet literate and very few of the old and truly bold are on here to defend him. Luckily there are still those who see through the bullsht and media fug but many of you need to read your Boro history. We owe a debt of gratitude to Keith Lamb that I sincerely fear will only be expressed when the poor man has gone.

joseph99 Posted on 3/8 2:42
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Seems like Lamb is having a pop at those fans willing to shell out a ST before a endless dealine date, insinuating that they're getting too much of a bargain. It also suggests that he'd be even more relaxed if we didn't sell any ST's as more fans would have to pay more. If this is the case then why doesn't Lamb stop the sale of ST's to those bargain hunters.

What patronising bollox! It actually appears that Gareth is doing his job (evidenced from last season) but Lamb simply cannot. What utter tosh from Lamb, utterly embarrassing drivel. The townsfolk of Middlesbrough deserve much much better than these utterly schtye statements.

zaphod Posted on 3/8 3:12
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

We can't be the only club to have sold fewer season tickets, because ManU haven't sold all theirs for the first time in donkeys' years.

KL is in a no-win situation. He can't admit at this stage that the club got its season ticket pricing policy wrong, because it would cause more problems with people demanding refunds etc. I just hope that, internally, they know they got it wrong. The statement is fairly poor PR as it doesn't even seem to admit that affordability is an issue.

Bukowski_MFC Posted on 3/8 4:01
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Gibson is too loyal to those around him. Too many people are at the club as a result of their relationship with Gibbo rather than as a result of their ability.

I don't doubt that Gibson is a great businessman for Bulkhaul but he doesn't run appear to run the Boro like a business at all.

If he did, he would have been far more ruthless towards the deadwood at the club who are frankly not up to the task of promoting, marketing, efficiently running a Premier League club in the modern era. Messieurs Lamb, Fordy and Allan are dinosaurs from Ayresome Park. The same people are doing the same jobs to the same standard as they were around twenty years ago. And it isn't good enough anymore.

Remember Adrian Bevington who used to work under Dave Allan within the club's PR and Press team? He is now Director of Communications for the FA where his talent has been fully recognised. If MFC had been run efficiently like a business, based on ability, he would have been promoted within the club to head our PR and Press team and wouldn't have been allowed to leave the club. However I suspect that if he had stayed at MFC, he would still be working under Dave Allan, a man who he is far far more talented than.

trodbitch Posted on 3/8 8:36
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

The FA is hardly a model organisation though.

Archie_Stanton1 Posted on 3/8 8:58
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Keith Lamb.

20 Years in the job, and the biggest impression he`s left on people is that he doesn`t know how to work a fax machine.

Says it all really.

trodbitch Posted on 3/8 9:01
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

It does, it says the vast majority of boro fans are mindless sheep who can't have an original thought of their own except jump on the usual boro-scapegoat bandwagon. All he's done in that statement is be pragmatic. When they don't tell us their thoughts, they get bitched at, when they do they get bitched at.

BelleVueRoundabout Posted on 3/8 9:01
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"I can garauntee there is not a bigger Boro fan on here than him, not one who has been to more matches"

When was the last time Keith Lamb paid to get in?

sasboro Posted on 3/8 9:07
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

i still dont get how lamb gets all the blame and gibson gets none. Does no one realise that gibson tells lamb to say these things in the media.

The_Commisar Posted on 3/8 9:11
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

he would still be working under Dave Allan, a man who he is far far more talented than

I'd just like to see Mr Allan display some talent, any talent frankly.

sasboro Posted on 3/8 9:14
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

then there wiill be gibson who have the final say on ticket prices or at least agree to what they will be set at.

skiprat Posted on 3/8 9:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"When they don't tell us their thoughts, they get bitched at, when they do they get bitched at."

Hurrah for Trodbitch!

Too true mate. Too true.

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 9:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Agree what you're saying about Dave Allen Mr Commisar. Was my misfortune to have to deal with him after the club screwed up my Villa Park semi final ticket a couple of years ago and he was so useless that I came to the conclusion that he doesn't know which end of a pen you're supposed to write with.

trodbitch Posted on 3/8 9:19
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I know all about 'bitchin'

ElvisRamone Posted on 3/8 9:22
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Ah Dave Allen. I remember him from his time as a trainee at ICI.

simon1586 Posted on 3/8 9:27
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I agree that Lamb had to try to put a positive spin on it and couldn't say much else really.I think the club have suffered from so many previous PR own goals that many now criticise them whatever they say.Not a healthy situation.

Boromart Posted on 3/8 9:32
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"thats an impossible question to answer really, option you giving is low crowds or relegation."
Not really, like I said I won't hold my breath for a straight answer to a simple straight question.

"and since when does a £2m drop in gate receipts mean relegation."
Let me put it another way then, in some fairly realistic terms. Lets say the clubs income this year is 50 mill (a not unreasonable figure), resulting in an operating profit of about 8 mill (again not an unreasonable figure). That 2 mill you want to pish away is actually about 25% of our operating profit - is it really an irrelevant figure?

"you cant really compare the likes manutd and chelsea cos we can never compete even with that £2m extra."
err if you read my post properly I'm saying that we can't compare with those teams because there income is so big, instead we should be compared with Wigan, Blackburn, Portsmouth, Bolton etc.

"for the rest of us if league went on how much money you generate then..."
of course there are other factors, but money is a factor you have admitted that. It is just a matter of conjector how money money can make a differance. If Bolton are able to invest 2mill a year more than us because they haven't dropped there ticket prices then 5 years down the road they have invested 10 mill more than us and that isn't an insiginificant amount. Lets face it Sas, you are not talking about reducing the ST prices for ONE season are you?



--- Post edited by Boromart on 3/8 9:42 ---

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 9:35
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Ah for the good old days when Mr Gibson would appear on the Legends phone in to help put out some positive club PR.

Agree that the club has shot itself in the foot a lot recently which has resulted in a cynical element within the fan base.

A major gesture such as reducing ticket prices in light of the tv money bonanza (and the lead taken by some other clubs) may have subdued the unrest in certain factions within the supporters but the club decided against it.

TRANSITARMY Posted on 3/8 9:36
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

A lot of good points, another reason why fans are p'd off is that you could play Man u or Chelsea off the pitch but sooner or later they'll get a dodgy pen/decision and the pundits on the tele will justify it. You just can't win.

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 9:39
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Especially Jamie bloody Big Club Redknapp

Boromart Posted on 3/8 9:41
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

FF, to be honest I think that if we had reduced ticket prices that would create only a small amount of good will towards the club and a stream of negative comments - "they should have done it years ago", "they only reduced prices because of the TV windfall and don't actually care about the fans", "they should have reduced it more", and in 12 months time - "the prices are still too high".

If there is one thing Boro fans like to do it is moan.

fatharrywhite Posted on 3/8 9:48
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

"A major gesture such as reducing ticket prices in light of the tv money bonanza"

another one who doesnt realise that the 'TV bonanaza' doesnt appear till NEXT season.

KL in the radio cleveland forum said thatST prices have reached their peak and he expects them to fall over the coming seasons. They were kept at current prices to cover operating this season.

i fully expect there to be a drop in prices from next season.

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 9:53
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I agree Boromart Boro fans are particularly good at having a good moan.

Any kind of ticket reduction may have only had limited impact but it would have been an indicator that the club is trying to show that it is not taking its fans for granted.

Last season was one of our lowest average attendance levels during our time in the Premiership. Other clubs with large sections of empty seats decided to try to stimulate interest in season tickets by reducing prices. By not following this lead, the club has left itself open to criticism of trying to squeeze every penny it can out of its loyal fans.

I appreciate that it is a fine balancing act trying to have sufficient funds to attract quality players to the club and keeping the fan base onside with the clubs ambitions. I'll happily pay my season ticket money to see good quality players attracted to the club I support.

Just think that an opportunity to attract some of the wavering fans or fans who struggle to afford current season ticket prices has been missed.

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 9:57
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I hadn't read that the tv bonanza starts next year Fatarrywhite so apologies for that. Will wait to see if your prediction for future years holds true.

Boromart Posted on 3/8 9:59
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

It certainly is a fine balancing act and they will never manage to please more than 60% of the fans with their ticketing policy.

The problem I see with a reduced ticket price policy is that it is expected to be repeated year on year. If you look at when we first did cheap kids tickets at cup games, after doing it once the fans expected it to be the norm, and whined when it wasn't.

fatharrywhite Posted on 3/8 10:00
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

i think prices would have gone down anyway due to the fall in sales this season but i'll be amazed if they dont given the added tv revenue from the end of the season which will be minimum £50 million (i think).

holgateoldskool Posted on 3/8 10:03
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Even though Keith Lamb has his supporters surely they must have been a tad disappointed with his latest comments. For a chief executive to admit there isn't a strategy to get back fans apart from the lame explination that fans would come back to support a winning team playing attractive football is quite frankly useless.

He should have said we have initiatives, plans, incentives we are putting into place - he didn't. Why ? Because there arn't any.As a chief executive he should be driving such policies with Fordy.

It demonstrates they have lost touch with their fan base, don't care, or haven't the faintest idea how and what to do.

Whatever the scenario does this instill confidence that the right people are there making the right decisions ?

Boromart Posted on 3/8 10:07
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I agree they don't know how to combat the issue, they don't really have anything in place.

However the only argument anyone on here has come out with is large reductions in ST prices, and that might get more people through the door but will actually reduce revenue. Since the chief execs job is to increase revenue then that isn't really an acceptable answer to the problem to him.

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 10:10
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I think some of the cynacism is generic throughout football and not Boro specific and is based on the ever spiralling out of control wages that players now earn. (Won't go into that argument cos I'm sure its been done to death).

Means that fans have started to become more critical of clubs and players when they put in half-arsed performances for their mega bucks

Boromart Posted on 3/8 10:16
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

That is certainly true FF. I would go so far as to say that the public have been robbed by the prem league. We were given this 'product' as a new dawn in English football, we were promised the greatest league in the world, with the best players, it will improve the england team, the clubs will be far richer etc.

15 years later what we actually have are super-rich players, agents, and media companies, 4 uber-clubs and 16 non-competitive clubs 10 of which are fighting relegation, a load of foreign investment companies here to cream of the TV revenue, a load of average foreigners, a lack of depth to the English national team, and a lot of unhappy fans. The game is FUBARed

captain5 Posted on 3/8 10:22
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I think people need to understand how much Gibson does control things at the club.

From speaking to the plagiarist in chief (morning Anthony ), a lot of what the key people do is all on the basis that they please Gibbo.

A lot of what we as fans would like to be seen done, would be happily implemented by the likes of Allan, Fordy and Lamb, but if it doesn't meet with the big man's approval then it doesn't happen.

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 10:23
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

I think a lot can be read into the current state of Prem footy by the goings on at Man City.

Ex England manager comes in and buys about 7 players in a fortnight - not 1 of them english. probably the only english player anywhere near their 1st team now is Micah Richards.

Is this a case of

a) Sven getting his revenge on England by trying to ensure that as few english players as possible are getting premier league experience
b) Sven saying that english players are rubbish and thats why I failed at every major international tournament, or
c) average english players (eg. Kieron Dyer - £6m; Kieron Richardson £5m; Michael Chopra £5m etc) costing ridiculous amounts of money and therefore not worth buying.

captain5 Posted on 3/8 10:35
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

c) - the others wouldn't concern him. At all. He's a professional. He doesn't consider he failed and he got well paid for doing his job.

Funtime_Franckie Posted on 3/8 10:37
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

My mates a City fan and used to constantly moan about too many foreigners in the english game.

all of a sudden he's excited about the season for the 1st time in years and couldn't give a stuff about foreign players

hendrieswondergoal Posted on 3/8 10:38
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

brilliant photo.

BossHogg Posted on 3/8 11:17
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

What a great thread this has been!

Divided opinions discussed without name calling and general derogatory comments! Very rare on this site recently..


Archie_Stanton1 Posted on 3/8 11:18
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Bosshog - Pipe down daft cuunt

BossHogg Posted on 3/8 11:32
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette


kermit_the_smog Posted on 3/8 11:50
re: Keith Lamb in the Gazette

Wasn't it funny when Jamie Redknapp tried to claim it wasn't a penalty at OT.

Mr. Keys just sat there with his jaw open looking at him then a moments silence and he went riiiiight coming up on skysports.