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Holgateoldskool Posted on 09/07/2008 11:47
Southgate talking tosh

I'm afraid. He carries some on here who believe him that we'll progress this coming season.With a rookie keeper and a shocking back up - that'll do for our Gareth. With Taylor and his dodgy positional play-that'll do for Gareth.With a young, inexperienced midfield ( keep up the top form Stewy - we really need you too)-that'll do for Gareth.Getting rid of experienced players - that'll do for Gareth.Energy and enthusiasm-that'll do for Gareth

With a squad short on numbers-that'll do for Gareth.

So watch out top ten in the Prem - we're coming to get you - and above are the reasons why!!

Yes, everything is in place for us to

Pauluka Posted on 09/07/2008 11:48
Southgate talking tosh

Can't believe the transfer window has shut early

bernieisgod Posted on 09/07/2008 11:49
Southgate talking tosh

'Tis the season to get pessimistic - someone take away his tie, belt and shoe laces quickly!

laughingboroboy Posted on 09/07/2008 11:49
Southgate talking tosh

dont want to sound harsh but you clearly know Fook all about football!

hewielewie Posted on 09/07/2008 11:50
Southgate talking tosh

1st of September already?

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 11:51
Southgate talking tosh

"that'll do for Gareth" -- and if we do progress, even the slightest, will you fall on your sword? Literally please.

bernieisgod Posted on 09/07/2008 11:52
Southgate talking tosh

I think we need to burn him at the stake (HOS not Gareth) - if we can't be a little optimistic now when can we?

ccole Posted on 09/07/2008 11:53
Southgate talking tosh

Unlike you Mr Holgate, I like many others who go to the games wouldn't class Arca, O'Niel and Downing inexperienced.

Then again, if I was blinded by bitterness towards the manager, always looking to put him down, then I might forget about these three players and just think of the young players we have who cover those positions?

heaton_mersey_boro Posted on 09/07/2008 11:54
Southgate talking tosh

The same Southgate who denied we were in talks with Alves.....even when he was spotted on the pitch at the Riverside with him?

Southgate tells big fibs when talking about transfer dealings.

But don't let that stop you.

BobUpndown Posted on 09/07/2008 11:55
Southgate talking tosh

HOS.. have a read of Mr Maz post..

I see some of your points esp keeper.. but see positives in the way we're going under Gate..

Link: positive

bernieisgod Posted on 09/07/2008 11:55
Southgate talking tosh

HMB - exactly - just posted something similar on another similar thread - southgate has hos own reasons for what he says - we should not assume what he says is the gospel truth - especially in the transfer window!

joebonano Posted on 09/07/2008 11:56
Southgate talking tosh

You really could do with booking yourself a fortnight's holiday away from newspapers or the internet.

Big_Shot Posted on 09/07/2008 11:58
Southgate talking tosh

Last summer there was a thread by HOS. Anyway the jist of it was any Boro fans who were planning on booing Viduka were pathetic. I and others took exception to this and tried to reason with him but he was adamant that they were. But in his blinkered defensive of his opinion he inadvertantly said that he'd have booed Merson. So essentially what he was saying was that people who boo players are pathetic, but then included himself.

And the point of this. Well there isn't only really, just that I haven't taken a post of his seriously since.

laughingboroboy Posted on 09/07/2008 11:58
Southgate talking tosh

FAO Heaton mersy boro, would you prefer he let all our transfer targets to the media and stated how much we are willing to offer, this would only cause more intrest around the players we are after, and inturn start a bidding war and end up paying over the odds for a player? get a grip mate course he is going to play down transfer talk the only teams who dont are the top 4 who can afford not to!

downinman Posted on 09/07/2008 11:59
Southgate talking tosh

Southgate talked top 10 and champions league, but he covered his arse by not putting a time frame on it. He didn't say he wanted top half this season. WE have a young squad now but how much do you want to bet that come january after a poor result southgate praises the lads because it has been such a tough season for young and inexperienced players

bear66 Posted on 09/07/2008 11:59
Southgate talking tosh

"1st of September already?"

Bringing in players 2 months after the players get back for training is crazy - by the time the players have arrived, got fit, played a few games (sometimes badly), the season is already set and we're already chasing to get back to mid-table sometime in April

ccole Posted on 09/07/2008 12:01
Southgate talking tosh

Maybe thats we have brought in two players within 4 days of the windows opening, and talking to other players now.

Few steps ahead of many other premiership teams.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 12:01
Southgate talking tosh

I don't understand your thinking at all there, bear.

bernieisgod Posted on 09/07/2008 12:03
Southgate talking tosh

exactly captain - the point being made was that the window has only just opened and negotiations often take time. We have doen well to get 2 players in for the start of training but I'm sure we wil sign another couple of players in the next 7 weeks.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 12:06
Southgate talking tosh

It just makes it sound like we should panic buy at the start of the window.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 12:07
Southgate talking tosh

We didnt do very well last season, weve brought in a couple of 3/4 million pound players (Sunderland bought about a dozen of those last season!), lost a keeper, losing a captain. Im struggling to see how everyone is assuming we are going to do much better?
We might, but it would be by luck, ie no injuries.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 12:10
Southgate talking tosh

Pogatetz hasn't left.

I think people are expecting Alves and Mido to score the goals that Ali and Tuncay missed last season.

We were stronger in the sceond half of last season and people are hoping we can build from that.

Not saying we will, but there are some reasons for optimism.

NB. If he doesn't sign a keeper he deserves sacking anyway.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 12:12
Southgate talking tosh

George was the midfield captain, we dont have anyone like that now.
Alves is the hope,but what we might gain there we've lost in other areas.

heaton_mersey_boro Posted on 09/07/2008 12:42
Southgate talking tosh

laughingboroboy -

Thats exactly what I said......


Try to read a little bit harder next time.

laughingboroboy Posted on 09/07/2008 12:45
Southgate talking tosh

ah sorry mate haha! really annoys me when people say that about transfers!

kermit Posted on 09/07/2008 12:46
Southgate talking tosh

If we don't sign a keeper then i'd like to see us sign a quality left back.

I think this is a massive risk by Southgate if he decides not to sign a new keeper.

We've all seen Jones simply isn't good enough, he can't even be classed as a young player as isnt he about 26 or summet?!

Hopefully Turnbull will turn out like the Hart at City, but it's still such a big risk.

Losing Boateng isn't such a big deal for me, yes he's been a legend for Boro but we can't and shouldn't be gaurenteeing him first team football anymore, players like Catts, Digard, Shawky can all do his role.

We need to concentrate on bringing in an attacking midfielder, we can't keep relying on Stewy Downing to be our only creative outlet from midfield. I can imagine that all the other midfield players put together didn't score as many as him last season, which shows where we need to improve on.

boroboymike Posted on 09/07/2008 12:47
Southgate talking tosh

Southgate must have Alister Campbell on the payroll as the shyte he comes out with is pure spin.

Forever talking about the 'future' and 'potential' and his 'vision'. Never talking about the reality of the tripe he's dished up and the fact that more of his buys have been bad than good.

The way some gobble it up is incredible.

downinman Posted on 09/07/2008 12:47
Southgate talking tosh

"If we don't sign a keeper then i'd like to see us sign a quality left back."

Don't need to, we have pogi there and taylor as back up

heaton_mersey_boro Posted on 09/07/2008 12:49
Southgate talking tosh

"Forever talking about the 'future' and 'potential' and his 'vision'. Never talking about the reality of the tripe he's dished up and the fact that more of his buys have been bad than good."

[:D] [:D]

You are JohnAnderson/Blackandwhitedreams yeah?

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 12:50
Southgate talking tosh

At his peak, george was rightly considered to be one of the best holding midfielders in the country.
A good team needs a spine of quality. We lack a top class keeper and a top class central midfielder to give us that spine.

Holgateoldskool Posted on 09/07/2008 12:50
Southgate talking tosh

Big Shot - right about Viduka but the Merson and booing????Love to see that.I recall I started about forgive and forget about Merson and got very little support for that!

Frankly what this thread has proved is that folk can disagree with the sentiments but with the exception of Captain I see a load of huffing and puffing and little counter arguement based on fact - merely hope.

Ah well.......

wilkos_perm Posted on 09/07/2008 12:51
Southgate talking tosh

"weve brought in a couple of 3/4 million pound players (Sunderland bought about a dozen of those last season!)"

we've not bought the same players as them though have we??

HOS - as everybody else has pointed out, the clear problem with your argument is that its currently July 9th and not the 2nd week in August.

And as for getting rid of experienced players - you are suggesting we should have persisted with the midfield that hasnt been functioning for a couple of seasons?

bosshogg Posted on 09/07/2008 12:51
Southgate talking tosh

If Jones or Turnbull can't cut it, Gareth will have to wait until January to solve the problem.

That worries me..... as he's not going to decide in the first two weeks of the season that he 'may' have made a mistake!

Hoping one of them turns out to be a world beater, but I can't see that at the moment!

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 12:53
Southgate talking tosh

No wilko, but peoples blind hope assume they are better then Sunderlands based on very little evidence, neither have played much football and none of you have seen them play!
If they were that good, they'd be worth more, every player in Europe is scouted out by the top clubs.

the_hagbard_elite Posted on 09/07/2008 12:55
Southgate talking tosh

Holgateoldskool is now on list of posters i don't read along with onthemap.

my world is becoming filled with rational people who have intelligent and well measured opinions as a consequence of this culling policy.

i'd thoroughly recommend it as a method of restoring your faith in humanity.

wilkos_perm Posted on 09/07/2008 12:57
Southgate talking tosh

i think people are hoping we will be better and there is good foundation for that on paper - replacing a midfield that hasnt functioned with younger players. Of course we dont know until we see the new buys playing over the course of the first 10 games or so.

Also Mido how come Wenger picks up players for hardly anything, Adebayor for example, if all top clubs are after all the best players?

Big_Shot Posted on 09/07/2008 12:57
Southgate talking tosh

Yes, you were all for Merson getting booed, saying he'd have deserved it. But the daft thing was it was in a thread started by you calling people pathetic if they were going to boo Viduka. The reason I remember it is I was trying to reason with you about it so brought Merson into the equation. Which I found quite odd really. And since then I've noticed you get tied in knots just as quickly like you did that time.

wee_daft_boris Posted on 09/07/2008 12:57
Southgate talking tosh

It's amazing really, the type of players we buy are a gamble, but that is the way it has to be. We can't afford to spunk £18m on fringe internationals like Barry, Carrick etc. If you want top class signings and big money feck off and support Manure or someone like that. We've not seen any of the new signings play and we're already slating them, had people seen Fabregas play or Diarra or Patrick Vieria. I'm not claiming our scouting system is as good as the top 4's but give it a chance.

The keeper situation is different but do you thinkn a defender, and a very accomplished one, such as Southgate wouldn't be sh!tting himself at the prospect of Jones and Turnbull if he didn't see something in them. As a defender you know when a Keeper is a duffer as you would be scared playing in front of him.

Give it time fellow fans, the transfer market isn't exactly busy at the minute is it.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 12:59
Southgate talking tosh

"weve brought in a couple of 3/4 million pound players (Sunderland bought about a dozen of those last season!)" -- the differance is that we have no idea if the players we have brought in are high or low quality.....with Sunderland everyone KNEW they were low quality players.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:05
Southgate talking tosh

True re Sunderlands players! Also highlights the fact, that we aint got a clue about these new players, but these days theres no such thing as bargain buys. All players are well scouted.
Weve possibly got players for the future at those prices, hence I cant see much improvement next season. Its the wildly optimistic that make me laugh. They'll be the first to moan when its the same again next season and blame tactics or something.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:07
Southgate talking tosh

Who's being widlly optimistic though.

I haven't seen anyone predicting top 4 or 5 next season.

People seem to be suggesting breaking into the top ten, which is pretty much where our second half of last season's form was.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:10
Southgate talking tosh

Top 10's wildly optimistic, teams in the top are buying the finished article. About the same next season.
A top class midfielder and keeper, then maybe top ten.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:12
Southgate talking tosh

Which teams and which players??

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:13
Southgate talking tosh

They will.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:14
Southgate talking tosh

You should go on their boards and reassure their fans.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:17
Southgate talking tosh

Boro were mediocre last season as we didnt have enough quality in the team, 3 or 4 million for a player does not suggest a great increase in quality.
Shrawzer, Boat, southgate, Yak, Viduka were top quality when we finished top half of the table. We havent enough quality.

woodymfc Posted on 09/07/2008 13:19
Southgate talking tosh

were doomed again

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:20
Southgate talking tosh

If 12th to about 17th is doomed then yes.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:26
Southgate talking tosh

Well it isn't obviously.

I'll wait and see how good Digard and Emnes are before passing judgement.

You'd probably praise the signings if other clubs were getting under 21 internationals from France and Holland.

We definitely do need another midfielder and a keeper as a minimum but I think we'll sign them.

Why do you think we won't?? You're very sure about other clubs' signings, so why not ours??

br14 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:27
Southgate talking tosh

All last season as I watched us get beat by last minute goals and stupid mistakes I had the feeling that eventually we'd dismantle a team based on some of the football.

Just a shame it had to be the last game - even if we were a tad fortunate with the sending off of Dunne.

Still I think it shows what is possible.

We may lost a few players (Rochemback being the biggest lost - but he was too slow) but we have Mido back and apparently fit; Huth may last a few games; McMahon is also back and two players brought in with youth and pace.

Ok. It's not a recipe for guaranteed success, but the potential is there.

Dare to dream maybe?

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:27
Southgate talking tosh

Show me where Ive said we wont sign any more? Ive said we need to sign them to do any better then we did last time.

fatharrywhite Posted on 09/07/2008 13:28
Southgate talking tosh

"were doomed again"

we've been doomed for the last 5 seasons according to certain posters on here. They've been wrong everytime and i fully expect them to be wrong again for this season as well

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:29
Southgate talking tosh

And I wouldnt be impressed at other teams signing under 21 internationals. 75% of an under 21 international team arent anywhere near top class.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:29
Southgate talking tosh

So we will be signing more players??

br14 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:30
Southgate talking tosh

"And I wouldnt be impressed at other teams signing under 21 internationals. 75% of an under 21 international team arent anywhere near top class."

Other teams? Or us? Or was that the point?

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:30
Southgate talking tosh

How the fook am I supposed to know! Youre the oracle you tell me!
Im saying what we have now, isnt enough. How hard is that for you to grasp capt?

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:31
Southgate talking tosh

Any teams!

The_same_as_before Posted on 09/07/2008 13:34
Southgate talking tosh

Far better if Southgate simply talks down any chance of being in the top half and keep Mappy happy and say we are a bottom 4 side.

br14 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:39
Southgate talking tosh

Thing is OTM can't lose really.

If we do crap he posts how he was right all along and noone believed him; and if we do ok then like all of us he appreciates the club doing well and promises to eat his words (or similar).

Unfortunately the team generally proves him right.

Underdog Posted on 09/07/2008 13:40
Southgate talking tosh

Why do people on here continually assume that southgate is telling porkys in order to throw people off the scent that he is in fact after a new keeper?? I think it's plainly clear that southgate IS going to give jones and turnbull a chance and WON'T be buying a new keeper.

This is a quite unbelievable decision in my view, one that that not only makes me worry about next season but also calls into serious question the judgement of our manager. It is a decision that I think will mean yet another fight against relegation of us next season.

br14 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:43
Southgate talking tosh

At this time of the season I'm not sure you can believe anything Southgate says. The O'Neill situation is a case in point.

However, if he does bring in a goalie he must think very little of the two we have after all this hype.

Hercules Posted on 09/07/2008 13:44
Southgate talking tosh

What onthemap does is twist peoples words in a bid to make it seem that his opponent is a 'rara' or 'gushing' over Southgate when in reality they recognise the good and the bad, giving a balanced opinion.

There is no grey area with him.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:45
Southgate talking tosh

I'm not agreeing with your statement of where we are necessarily; it's the fact you're making negative assumptions that we won't sign other players up to the task, while other teams we are competing with will.

How many of the teams around us have spent 12 million on a Brazilian striker in the last year??

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:47
Southgate talking tosh

Im saying we have to, if we want to have a chance of top 10, not that we wont!
If we do or not I dont know.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:49
Southgate talking tosh

And other teams will??

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:50
Southgate talking tosh

They are in the top 10 already, with the quality needed to be in it. We cant break into it, sigining below top ten quality players.

captain5 Posted on 09/07/2008 13:53
Southgate talking tosh

Nice of you to give the two players we've signed a chance.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:55
Southgate talking tosh

You get what you pay for, weve bought players potentially for the future. If they were that good they would be worth more.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 13:56
Southgate talking tosh

"And I wouldnt be impressed at other teams signing under 21 internationals. 75% of an under 21 international team arent anywhere near top class." - Midosparmo , have you got any proof to back this up? I think that is an outdated view.

England 17 man squad from 4 years ago:-

Still playing in the prem -
Carson (Leeds), Hunt (Bolton), Ferdinand (West Ham), Pennant (Arsenal), O’Neil (Portsmouth), Milner (Newcastle), Downing (Middlesbrough); Cole (on loan Aston Villa), Hoyte (Arsenal), Ashton (Crewe), Bent(Ipswich), Reo-Coker (West Ham)

Other than Hunt, and maybe Carlton Cole I would have all of those in my squad.

Others - Kilgallon (Leeds), Richards (Ipswich) , Stead(Blackburn), Whittingham (Aston Villa), Harding (Brighton)

I would have two of those as well.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 13:58
Southgate talking tosh

Here comes Statto!

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:00
Southgate talking tosh

Mainly average quality.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 14:01
Southgate talking tosh

"You get what you pay for, weve bought players potentially for the future. If they were that good they would be worth more. " - midsparmo that is a very simplistic view. Tuncay was free so Aliadiere must be better, I know everyone would come round to my thinking.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:02
Southgate talking tosh

Any point can be made, picking out one fact, that suits you from one point in time.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:02
Southgate talking tosh

Youre missing out the free transfer rule there, thats been in operation for many years Mart.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 14:06
Southgate talking tosh

Midosparmo, they are not stats just a list of names. Back your 75% stat up! Put up or shut up [:P]

Another way of looking at it is that 95%+ of regular internationals played U21 football. If you want to buy a player that will in hte future be high enough quality to be a regular international, then a good place to look is the U21 squads.

Did you know Digard has already been picked for the full french squad but hasn't played, much like Wheater but for a better international team.

Free transfer in other words fees are not just dictated by quality but length left on contract. If you think hard enough you can find plenty of other factors that influence a transfer fee.

But in the world where transfer fees are an absolute sign of quality then Boat has been replaced by a player around 8 times better, and schwarzer has been replaed by an exactly equal quality player. Mendi has been replaced by an infinitely better player in Emnes.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:09
Southgate talking tosh

Out of the team you chose above, theres only one England regular. And none of the others likely to get more then a handful of caps.
So 25% quality looks optimistic!

downinman Posted on 09/07/2008 14:09
Southgate talking tosh

I think it is safe to say that most U21 players never make the step up to full international level these days. i think that list of players backs it up. Most miss out the U21s. Out of that list they are just average premier league players. But nothing special

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 14:11
Southgate talking tosh

mido they are all still young and around 5 or 6 of them have represented England at full level. Our best player is currently an england squad player, so signing more england squad players wouldn't harm us.

"Any point can be made, picking out one fact, that suits you from one point in time." -- any point can be made picking a statistic out of the air with no grounding in fact - 75%?

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 14:12
Southgate talking tosh

"Most miss out the U21s. "
Which current England internationals do not have U21 caps?

downinman Posted on 09/07/2008 14:13
Southgate talking tosh

How many of that list above are now full England players?

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:16
Southgate talking tosh

Gut feeling 75%. Going on your team id say Downing and fredinand and ill push it to Ashton (if he stays fit) are the only players Id count as quality.
so 3 out 16 18.75% quality. Ok I was wrong, its worse then I thought!

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 14:17
Southgate talking tosh

so the conclusion is that a) almost ALL international players MUST have played at U21 level. and b) Only some U21s go on to play for their country regularly.

So signing U21s is a good place to start, but no guarentee....although it seems a fairly good guarentee that they can at least hold there own in the prem.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:21
Southgate talking tosh

Yeah, if they get picked from playing in the premier in the first place. More of a gamble with players from weaker leagues.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 14:21
Southgate talking tosh

1. Carson OK kepper would get in our first team.
2. Hunt rubbish
3. Ferdinand would get in our squad
4. Pennant would get in our team
5. O’Neil is in our team
6. Milner would get i our team
7. Downing is in our team
8. Cole - tricky but never scores....except against us. Rubbish
9. Hoyte - decent would get in our team
10. Ashton - if 100% fit, would get in our team
11. Bent - certainly last season he would get in our team. A good player who chose the wrong transfer
12. Reo-Coker - Good player would get in our team.

13. Kilgallon - would make a good squad player
14. Richards - ?
15. Stead - rubbish
16. Whittingham - would make a good squad player
17. Harding - ?

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 14:23
Southgate talking tosh

"weaker leagues." - surely the weakness of Ligue 1 and Eridivisie is irrelivent. They both are U21s for countries that are much stronger than England. So it could be argued that it is less of a gamble.

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:25
Southgate talking tosh

Not saying the rest are all bad players, but few of them would be first choices on a team sheet in a top ten team.

downinman Posted on 09/07/2008 14:25
Southgate talking tosh

God, southgate must have signed some crap players if them lot can get in our team!

easycomeeasygo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:32
Southgate talking tosh

mido posted "if they were that good they'd be worth more, every player in europe is scouted out by the top clubs"

lol, we've got no chance of ever signing a good player again then do we mido?

what a load of sh1te

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:38
Southgate talking tosh

Not unless we spend 12 million plus. Thats the facts, it aint Football manager 97/98 anymore Easycum (try thinking about Mart to delay).

fatharrywhite Posted on 09/07/2008 14:43
Southgate talking tosh

"Not unless we spend 12 million plus."

that Tim Cahill bloke who plays for Everton must be S***e then...

otto62 Posted on 09/07/2008 14:44
Southgate talking tosh

midosparmo may as well go of and support one of the top 4 now (if he doesn't already)

personally, I'd rather support a real (non-plastic) team even if we only have one (or maybe 2) 'good' players. I'd rather cheer them on and encourage them to beat their more fancied rivals, rather than carry on about how cr@p they are. but thats just me. carry on.

easycomeeasygo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:45
Southgate talking tosh

*falls off chair laughing*

so now you have to spend 12 million quid to get a player that's any good.

okay mido, whatever you say....................................................................muppett

Midosparmo Posted on 09/07/2008 14:47
Southgate talking tosh

How long ago was that fatharry? Thanks for proving how hard it is.
All im saying is you wont get in the top ten without spending top ten money, we did last time we got in the top ten. Doesnt bother me, ive seen a lot worse for the Boro.

fatharrywhite Posted on 09/07/2008 14:52
Southgate talking tosh

roque santa cruz and benni mccarthy for blackburn were S***e as well werent they..arsenal paid 7 million for adebayore, berbatov cost 10 million, again, below the 'can only be good if cost more than 12 million threshold.....i could go on if i wasnt at work but most can see you're talking bollox so wont waste my time..

bernieisgod Posted on 09/07/2008 14:55
Southgate talking tosh

spot on fatharry - the fact is that there are players who are just starting to build reputations who may be great players in the future. Top 4 have not got room or time or risk - they need to be top players immediately. For us, this is a great and refreshing change of tack IMHO.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 15:43
Southgate talking tosh

"it aint Football manager 97/98 anymore " -- erm, it never was, FM97/98 is a game, we are talking about the REAL world.

downinman Posted on 09/07/2008 15:46
Southgate talking tosh

We can compare our new signings to the likes berbatov and adebayore but highly unlikely our new signings will be as good. Maybe they will struggle like many other similar foreigners. At the moment we just don't know if they will inmprove the team or do any better than arca or the now departed rockembach

fatharrywhite Posted on 09/07/2008 16:12
Southgate talking tosh

" At the moment we just don't know if they will inmprove"

true, but it seems we have far to many fans who instantly write them off because 'the only cost X million' and before they've even seen them play

bernieisgod Posted on 09/07/2008 16:14
Southgate talking tosh

exactly - smmes some people are only happy when we pay £12M for a player - oh, hang on, plenty slammed Alves last season when he came too!

downinman Posted on 09/07/2008 16:17
Southgate talking tosh

Don't think anyone is writing them off. Just players with potential and unproven at this level. Plenty players come to England and never fullfill that potential. We will just have to see what happens.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 16:27
Southgate talking tosh

"Alves last season when he came too!" -- yeah Sasboro wrote him off after about two sub appearances.

Anyway no one knows if these two will do well. They have a good pedigree but are still raw talents in their own country let alone here. I have more hope for Digard to make it straight away as he has a bit more experience and looks like he may have the strength required for this league.

Bandy Posted on 09/07/2008 16:28
Southgate talking tosh

Some doyles even said Alves was the new Brian Deane

Oh dear

BoroAl Posted on 09/07/2008 17:05
Southgate talking tosh

Some people on here are getting GEORDIE TRANSFER SYNDROME.
Symptoms,If they dont cost £800 gazillion,and demand £100 gazillion wages they're crap.

grantus Posted on 09/07/2008 17:16
Southgate talking tosh

I opened this as it was 100+, so thought it might be interesting. I hoped that it wouldn't be completely and utterly predicatable, negative, nonsense.

I'm afriad that it is.

I wish I'd never bothered.

Other than that, no comment.

Boromart Posted on 09/07/2008 17:24
Southgate talking tosh

Bandy, wasn't that Sas as well?

BoroInLondon Posted on 09/07/2008 18:10
Southgate talking tosh

Agreed Grantus, it's a truly ridiculous thread. I don't think Midoparmo has made a comment that is worth reading yet.

How much did that Bentley cost Blackburn? Was it £12 million? How much did Arsenal pay for Diarra, Flamini, Rosicky, Adebayor or Clichy?

Didn't Van Persie come from Holland for about the same as Emnes? He's rubbish that kid, isn't he. No technique, just a journeyman striker.

I despair for some of the clowns on here. Give the new kids a chance before you write them off.

Old_Gregg Posted on 09/07/2008 18:33
Southgate talking tosh

People seem to have missed the huge flaw in Midosparmo's argument

"All im saying is you wont get in the top ten without spending top ten money, we did last time we got in the top ten."

Hmmm, I seem to remember the last time we got top ten, 7th in 04/05 season our team consisted of the likes of Schwarzer (1.5m), Reiziger(free), Zenden(loan), Parlour(free), Hasselbaink (free), Doriva (free).

Indeed the only players we had at that time that cost a great deal of money were Gareth and Ugo, the rest of the team had been assembled at very low cost.

Holgateoldskool Posted on 10/07/2008 07:42
Southgate talking tosh

A lot of posters have disagreed with the subject matter - fair enough. But very few have come up with a counter arguement.Southgate has said he is happy with the squad as it is - or is that another lie?

Ask yourself this - if Steve Bruce said Europe and Champions League were the ultimate target he would get absolutely ridiculed on here.The bottom line is we are about on par with Wigan - although we manage a few thousand more through the turnstiles at the moment.

We are where we are - the lip service to where we want to be cannot be backed up as we are nowhere near the position to splash the cash to get in the quality - not potential- to achieve these goals.

Boromart Posted on 10/07/2008 09:22
Southgate talking tosh

southgate is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't with you. If says our aim is chumps league you ridecule. If he says midtable you ridecule his ambition. If he says avoid relegation you would have an anuerysm through rage.

grantus Posted on 10/07/2008 09:25
Southgate talking tosh

It's the same debate we've all been having on here for the last year or two. If you can't remember any of the counter arguments to your repetitive voice, then so be it.

At the moment I can't be bothered to repeat my self for the umpteenth time, particularly when there are 7 weeks of the transfer window left and the squad is only three days into pre season training.

Yeah, Boro always get all of their summer transfers out of the way with in July, don't they?

On teh one hand managers are being shrewd, astute and media savvy, by say certain things. Our manager obviously could never be any of those things to certain people. He's obviously a moron, nomatter what he says.


onthemap Posted on 10/07/2008 09:28
Southgate talking tosh

The reality is that we've battled relegation for the past two seasons.
What has changed so significantly that we are now Champions League contenders?
We've replaced George and lost our keeper - that's it.

Wake the F*** up.

hewielewie Posted on 10/07/2008 09:29
Southgate talking tosh

Good morning OTM, you just seen this thread? I was suprised you didn't post earlier

Libbins Posted on 10/07/2008 09:47
Southgate talking tosh

It's as if we were world beaters before Southgate took over.

onthemap Posted on 10/07/2008 09:49
Southgate talking tosh

Seen it when it was first posted hewie.

My views are well documented, I don't rate the management and nothing this summer has changed my opinion on that.

We've replaced George (which indicates that Catt isn't the saviour - as I was slated for pointing out two seasons back)and lost our keeper.

Now apparently we've signed a striker who's the answer to our midfield problems.

Top 8 - yeah right.

Buddy Posted on 10/07/2008 09:53
Southgate talking tosh

Alves and Deane would have worked well as a partnership.

onthemap Posted on 10/07/2008 09:55
Southgate talking tosh


According to most on here we were Top 10 before Gareth came without spending any money, you can't have it both ways.

Actually before Gareth took over we were European finalists, not just making up the numbers - finalists, oh and we won a cup.

Thanks Gareth, here's to another exciting season being on a par with Fulham, Wigan and now Hull.

grantus Posted on 10/07/2008 10:15
Southgate talking tosh

"The reality is that we've battled relegation for the past two seasons."

The reality is we've been mid table for the last two season. Very similar to the majority of seasons under McClaren and so far only the drama queens have been screaming relegation, so nowhere near the drama that we had under Robson.

Some people need to wake up, we are performing as well as can be expected. Club size, crowd size, income, turnover, etc.

If you want miracles, go join the Christians.

downinman Posted on 10/07/2008 10:16
Southgate talking tosh

These players bought on potential might come good, but are they really any better than what we had last season. We need to sign some proven quality with experience behind them

fatharrywhite Posted on 10/07/2008 10:18
Southgate talking tosh

it's taken a while but i've finally managed to track down a photo of holgate and onthemap...

Link: link

onthemap Posted on 10/07/2008 10:19
Southgate talking tosh

When we dropped into the relegation zone, which part of mid table was that?

The miracle is that even after two seasons of utter and absolute dross, there are still posters deluded into this fast, attacking. free flowing revolution guff.

You'll understand this one day.

skiprat Posted on 10/07/2008 10:21
Southgate talking tosh

Grantus -

I opened this as it was 100+, so thought it might be interesting. I hoped that it wouldn't be completely and utterly predicatable, negative, nonsense.

I'm afraid that it is.

I wish I'd never bothered.


I see OTM has joined in with his usual bollox about being European finalists. OTM, can you answer a question for once...

What league position did we finish in at the end of that season? How did we do in the league in the same season?

You seem to have a massive chip on your shoulder about Southgate because he's took us from being a mid-table team that flirted with relegation to erm, a mid-table team that flirted with relegation.

Holgate - Historically when have Boro signed most of our players when the transfer window has been in place? July? Nope. End of August mainly.

Hold onto your knickers for a few weeks at least.

grantus Posted on 10/07/2008 10:23
Southgate talking tosh

For all of one week in November?

An unmitigated disaster eh?

Judge a team at the end of the season, remember that? Hardly the relegation fodder or surviving by the skin of our teeth that you predicted, although you'll argue you were right anyway, as you are incapable of recognising the truth when it's not inline with your opinion (most of the time).

You change things to suit your predictable ranting and raving, you're not to be taken seriously, even you should recognise that by now.

Anyway, carry on my friend, a month until the start of the season, you have plenty of time to complain and whinge and spew your negative bile before a football is even kicked.

Boromart Posted on 10/07/2008 10:33
Southgate talking tosh

if you sort the teams by average attendance- we work out at about 13th.

By net spend we are about 13th, by total squad cost - we are about 13th. Income we are about 15th.

So tell me why we have a right to be doing better than we are. That would indicate that actually southgate isn't mismanaging the side, with zero experience he is doing as expected.

Of course some people are so absolutely entrenched in their positions that they will never address those FACTS head on.

Jonny_Ingbar Posted on 10/07/2008 10:35
Southgate talking tosh

Not only has Southgate achived a basic consistency in his time as manager, he has completely overhauled and ageing and over the hill squad.

superstu Posted on 10/07/2008 10:36
Southgate talking tosh

Energy and enthusiasm-that'll do for Gareth

I love that line at the end. I can see the goalkeeper problem and maybe we could do with an experienced left back. Even agree that we need Downing to play well. But whats your problem with enthusiasm? Get a life.

skiprat Posted on 10/07/2008 11:37
Southgate talking tosh

Still no answer to my questions then.

What a surprise.

skiprat Posted on 10/07/2008 19:31
Southgate talking tosh


Still no answer.

Holgateoldskool Posted on 11/07/2008 07:46
Southgate talking tosh

Skiprat, no one responded to answer your question as you appeared to answer it yourself! Surely you have the nouse to see the comments are made about matters as they stand - something our manager appears to be comfortable with if no further signings happen - that's if of course he is telling the truth

Nobody,but nobody has explained how we will advance into the top ten, go for Europe, build for the Champions League - and you know why? They would struggle with a credible case.

For the others? I don't know weather it is a belief that what is spouted or merely hope.

skiprat Posted on 11/07/2008 09:01
Southgate talking tosh

I was talking about OTM and his "European finalists" tirade, despite us being woeful in the league that season.

I'll speak with you in August. No point going on about where we'll finish or won't finish when I don't know what our squad list is going to be for the upcoming season.

Boromart Posted on 11/07/2008 09:21
Southgate talking tosh

"Nobody,but nobody has explained how we will advance into the top ten, go for Europe, build for the Champions League - and you know why? They would struggle with a credible case." -- your asking people to prove what is going to happen in the future, it's impossible to come up with a credible case.

Just like you tried to prove the future for each of the last 2 or 3 seasons by saying how we would get relegated. Your arguments didn't hold any water, still don't hold any water, were rightly ridiculed at the time, and were proven ridiculous in hindsight.

Unfortunately for you you don't seem capable of learning from your own mistakes.

grantus Posted on 11/07/2008 09:50
Southgate talking tosh

Well said Boromart. You do talk a bit of sense now and then. You should probably call for a nurse though, just to be safe.

Holgateoldskool Posted on 11/07/2008 13:11
Southgate talking tosh

Just to pee on your chips a little, Mart -

I haven't been around for three seasons - still don't let facts get in the way.

My primary concern last pre season - being amongst the lowest scorers for the majority of the season was a fact - still don't let it get in your way.

The ones who slag me off - fair enough-but get your facts right.

As for the clown prince Grantus - this is the man is it not who was chief supporter of Stuart Parnaby - you know the guy who went to Birmingham and couldn't get a game for the club with one of the worst defensive records.

Yeah, right!

grantus Posted on 11/07/2008 13:23
Southgate talking tosh

Parnaby was a good squad player for us who had a run in the team in his last season with us, when he was one of our better players for a couple of months.

Zenden was one of our best players, done jack S*** at Liverpool.
Zeige did nothing of note after he left us.
Quedrue has been rubbish since he left us.

It's not unusual.

neilg Posted on 15/07/2008 01:27
Southgate talking tosh

hes a good guy. we need a gaffa like him.

gibosgimp Posted on 15/07/2008 01:30
Southgate talking tosh

i think we`ll make the top 17 but then i`m on prozac..