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ThePrisoner Posted on 11/08/2011 21:59
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Ouch. that's got to hurt.


Link: Lidl water thief

inoffthepost Posted on 11/08/2011 22:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Deserved...great british justice.

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:02
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Silly sod should'nt have broken the law.... end of story...... Hope there is more judges like this dealing with the rioters

degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 22:03
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Good [^]

Voltaire Posted on 11/08/2011 22:04
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Did he actually take the water out of the shop?

mikeyyyy Posted on 11/08/2011 22:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

that is pretty funny
he felt the strong arm of the law[ref]

outmac Posted on 11/08/2011 22:06
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

A line from a Sinatra song springs to mind.

yozzer_hughes Posted on 11/08/2011 22:07
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Fcuk him.... hope his cell mate is 6'7" 18stone and gay....and in jail for male rape[:(!]

6876 Posted on 11/08/2011 22:08
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Few scum bags will go to bed worried tonight, fearing a knock on the door.

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:08
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Lets play Mammy's and Daddy's ! ( you know the rest ) [^][^]

Voltaire Posted on 11/08/2011 22:12
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Answering my own question, but I don't think he did take the water from the shop -

"The court heard that Robinson had spent Sunday evening with his girlfriend and on his way home at around 2.40am went into the Lidl’s store as it was looted, where he was spotted by officers with the water.

“When he saw police his first reaction was to discard that case of bottled water. He accepts that he ran from the police. He was then arrested," said Mr Hussain."

Okay - so a 6-month prison sentence for being in a shop whilst it was being looted and picking up and dropping £3.50 worth of water??

Oliver Letwin MP took £2,000 from the taxpayer to repair his tennis courts, and when caught was given the opportunity to repay it and get a job in the government.

That, ladies and gents, boys and girls, is called a class system.


Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 11/08/2011 22:13
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

The appeals to the High Court are going to cost the country millions.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:13
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[V]a disgracefully long sentence handed down by a bellend judge who has probably evaded tax and cost the state far more himself

its acts of utter stupidity by moronic privately educated snobby judges that aggrivate acts of violence as apposed to supressing it


the fact some of you knobends think he deserves 6 months sums up your collective iq

child molesters get shorter sentences, an absolute disgrace of the british justice system

degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 22:16
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

durrr - I think that it is supposed to act as a deterrent you clueless cnut.

expat_smoggie Posted on 11/08/2011 22:16
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Some woman in Los Angeles just got a year behind bars for stealing a few hundred newspapers -- she said she collected coupons!

yozzer_hughes Posted on 11/08/2011 22:16
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Go fcuk yaself [^]

boroste Posted on 11/08/2011 22:16
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

So what do you suggest you utter idiot. Havent you seen the scenes the last few nights.

Probably sat cosy in your house miles away from the trouble. Nob

Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 11/08/2011 22:19
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

It's you who is coming across as the 'knob'.

The Dude's spot on.

riddler Posted on 11/08/2011 22:19
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

a disgracefully long sentence handed down by a bellend judge who has probably evaded tax and cost the state far more himself

Making unfounded remarks to back up your point. Some people are desperate [:o)]

child molesters get shorter sentences, an absolute disgrace of the british justice system

Are sentences based on other completely different sentences nowadays?

dodger Posted on 11/08/2011 22:20
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Absolute joke , this is mass hysteria.

Great British justice ? Have you forgot about the thieves in the commons who stole thousands and just said sorry?

The riots have given a smokescreen to hacking , bent cops and politicians. The same politicians are now rigorously fuelling the fires of this hysteria via the media.

It took these swine THREE days after the riots started to get their arses off their sunbeds to get back to Parliament.

Get a fuqqin grip.

Voltaire Posted on 11/08/2011 22:21
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

boroste - don't even joke about such things. How dare you. I live very close to a Lidl myself. I am absolutely appalled at the idea of bottled water being removed from the shop. Er, actually the shelf. It's no laughing matter at all. I understand the dread seriousness of the crime, and the prospect keeps me awake at night to be honest. But even given the severity and monstrousness of the offence, we must face our dread fears and see that justice is done - to murderers, rapists and, yes, if we can bear it, to Lidl water carry-awayers too.

yozzer_hughes Posted on 11/08/2011 22:21
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

And what would you suggest as punishment?........ 20 mins sat on the naughty step???

Bleedin hearted liberals, i feckin XXXXXX on em.


mickgaz Posted on 11/08/2011 22:22
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I love the fact if they are in council houses or social housing they may be evicted britain suddenly grown some balls. and liberty and human rights can do one [:D]

boroste Posted on 11/08/2011 22:23
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

So what do you suggest Corcaigh? A tap on the wrist.

Give over, youve heard what the vast majority of British people want, and it isnt that.

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:23
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Child molesters get less...... What a knob you have no idea

Space_Face Posted on 11/08/2011 22:23
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Have to agree with Dude here, except for his rant about the judge.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:25
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

it isn't a deterent its just a judge being a XXXXXXign knob picking on one person for an act of naivity, a bottle of water ffs, i hope that judge gets a sentence of his own for being a stupid XXXXXX


TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:25
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

This is spot on?

"child molesters get shorter sentences,"

You really believe that?

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:26
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

The kid is clueless

mickgaz Posted on 11/08/2011 22:28
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

its not the bottle of water its the big picture of these being on the streets to cause havoc and pain for others that judge deserves a medal [^]

riddler Posted on 11/08/2011 22:30
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Ssshh mick. [^]

Let him work it out himself. Although it may take some time.

Space_Face Posted on 11/08/2011 22:30
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Was he on the streets causing havoc?

If he'd attacked police, started a fire, smashed up property etc (how many of those have been charged?) I'd agree with it.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:31
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I honestly wonder what planet some posters are on.

There's a general riot, public order offences, resisting arrest, but no it's about a bottle of water.

If you're that myopic you haven't noticed everything else that went on, you must live in a dreamworld.

flaps Posted on 11/08/2011 22:31
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

" and liberty and human rights can do one"

Do you really mean this?

Sitrep Posted on 11/08/2011 22:31
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

So our great British police force stand by whilst the riots and looting are going on, watching people walk away with luxury items, then they see this fella with 3 quids worth of water, you'll do son. Pathetic.

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:31
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Still amazed at the child molester comment..... No idea [V][V][V]

Voltaire Posted on 11/08/2011 22:31
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Read the article, riddler/mick? I even posted the relevant excerpt for you above, which might help you.

As you might say, you'll get it eventually.

Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 11/08/2011 22:32
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"a disgracefully long sentence handed down by a bellend judge who has probably evaded tax and cost the state far more himself"

[:o)] Stupid statement

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:34
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"He got caught up in the moment"

He knew there was riots if he was'nt part of it he should not have been in the area.... End of

dodger Posted on 11/08/2011 22:34
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I noticed coppers stood doing absolutely fuqq all when the looting was going on.


the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:35
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

the most ridicuous sentence in the history of law

i guess were all XXXXXXed as just by downloading a song weve all done far worse

lad was in the wrong place at the wrong time and the idiots who run this country see fit to scapegoat him to farcical levels

i can only come to the conclusion the judge is a XXXXXXing idiot, he should have got a slap on the wrist at worst, now he has a criminal record and will probably XXXXXX his engineering course up

this is an example of why people are getting XXXXXXed off with the institution

the fact some of you think its a fair sentence must qualify you all for st lukes mental hospital, youve all done far worse in your life i can guarentee it

most vicars have done worse than steal 10p worth of water

6 months, a XXXXXXing farce


redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:37
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Should have got a slap on the wrist"

You on a wind up ya fooookin [:o)]

get to bed son your embarrassing [V][:o)][:o)]

red_harrington Posted on 11/08/2011 22:38
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

A copper on the radio today was dismayed in the 1 day sentence handed down to the teenager he arrested walking down the street with a bag of loot in the midst of the riots.

How can he get 1 day, yet this lad gets 6 months?

I just don't get it, and it's inconsistencies like this that boils my p1ss.

mickgaz Posted on 11/08/2011 22:38
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

just so everyone is clear i am glad he is going down for 6 month hope there is bigger sentences for looting bigger things [^]

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:39
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"the most ridicuous sentence in the history of law"

You are joking right?

You must have some serious authority issues 'dude'.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:40
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

thats because your a dickhead mick


borodavey Posted on 11/08/2011 22:40
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

If charged with public order the sentence would be short, with stealing 3.0 worth of water shorter still but on rioting charges he could have went down for 10 years.

I think you need to understand the law a bit more before passing judgement. He did steal something of low value but he did participate in a riot. That in itself means he would get a longer sentence,

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:40
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I agree about the inconsistencies...... Thats normally the difference between a disrict judge and having a magistrates bench..... but to say he should have had a slap on the wrist is a joke...... Think Dude says alot of things just get an arguement

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:41
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

what do you mean by authority

i don't have any peers

so how can i have an authority issue?

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:41
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

borodavey, nah it's just about the water, nothing else, don't be talking sense.

"what do you mean by authority

i don't have any peers

so how can i have an authority issue?"

Don't be deliberately thick dude, you know exactly what I mean.

ThePrisoner Posted on 11/08/2011 22:43
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"How can he get 1 day, yet this lad gets 6 months?"

I think if you're found on the premises it's construed to be more serious. Even so, 6 months? He should have said he was going to use it to fill his duck-moat and he'd have just got a ticking off and on your way.

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:43
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude learn a bit about the Law and The Courts before you start spouting your shoyte [:o)][:o)]

Space_Face Posted on 11/08/2011 22:44
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Good point Davey. I'm more interested in the perpetrators of the violence/arson etc being sent down than those on the fringes - hopefully that will come.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:45
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

there is no evidence to say he was part of a riot or commited any damage or was abusive

he was walking home and naively took some water

i think some of you need to start questioning things more and understanding why things happen instead of trusting the rich educated judges who make gormless decisions

all that sentence will do is incite more people and create more anger at the government, and that prick judge is to blame

borodavey Posted on 11/08/2011 22:47
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

No evidence of him ina riot. He was in the shop with rioters. he was looting. Thats a bit of evidence

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:48
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"authority issues"

I think you need to start questioning what you type before you type it.

dodger Posted on 11/08/2011 22:48
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Eric Illsley, who admitted falsely claiming £14,500 between 2005 and 2008, received £151,000 in expenses in 2010-2011

This MP was sentenced to 12 months!!!

He served 3 months , great British justice?


redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:48
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Naive ? Laughable

So all the looting that was going when he was in the area he did'nt see ?? So he naively went through that area and "picked" up some water coz he had a tickly throat ????


[:o)][:o)][:o)]

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:48
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

i know quite a bit about the law actually, and the fact it was set up based on religion and to protect rich people, for instance, its still legal to kill a welshman with an arrow if he invades on your property

it has nothing to do with silly XXXXXXing rules set down hundreds of year ago you stupid XXXXXX, and everything to do with consistency across the board and fairness without prejudice to social circumstance, its a nonsense sentence and it deserves to be ridiculed

Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 22:49
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Does it matter whether it's water or diamonds? It's theft, he joined the mob in opportunistic theft, it's the mob mentality that strikes fear into ordinary law abiding citizens, I hope it sends a strong message out to kids, break the law and you will be punished. That's his story, what if they all said the same thing. No sympathy.

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 11/08/2011 22:49
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

dude - You've been on form all week, and your posts on this thread are no exception. [^]

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:50
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

You know jack shyt about the law i'm afraid

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:50
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"its still legal to kill a welshman with an arrow if he invades on your property"

That is so XXXXXXing stupid, and actually highlights that you know nothing of the law, and are wearing a tin foil hat.


mickgaz Posted on 11/08/2011 22:50
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

thanks dude good to hold a rational debate with you ...not

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 22:52
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Total bellend [V][V][V][V][:o)][:o)][:o)]

Space_Face Posted on 11/08/2011 22:53
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

i know quite a bit about the law actually, its still legal to kill a welshman with an arrow if he invades on your property

[:D][:D][:D]

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:53
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I XXXXXXing love that he thinks it's ok to kill a welshman in your home.

borodavey Posted on 11/08/2011 22:53
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I know a bit about law as my uncle was a judge. In this case the judge followed the guidelines and actually gave a lower sentence because of the low value of goods

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 11/08/2011 22:55
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

With regards to that Welsh person/bow and arrow thing, isn't it legal within the city walls of Chester or something like that?

Or is it just a myth?

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 22:55
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Or is it just a myth?"

Use your noggin Viv.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:56
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

david cameron will get good pr from an act like this as there are plenty of morons in britain who think giving somebody half a year in jail for stealing a pennys worth of tap water in a plastic bottle is just and fair

the same XXXXXXing idiots sit on there computers all day downloading films and music thinking its different

i hope one of you knobs gets caught downloading a film and gets 6 months for it, i think then you might have a different perspective of it, or better still, one of your teenage kids get caught and they get 6 months

redwurzel Posted on 11/08/2011 22:57
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

How much did Freddie Goodwin take from us Taxpayers and how has it been rewarded.

Giving out of proportionate sentences just breeds anger - its not about been soft or hard.

Of cause there may be more to this sentence like criminal damage or rioting.

What would be the sentence for stealing a Plasma TV?

ThePrisoner Posted on 11/08/2011 22:58
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"its still legal to kill a welshman with an arrow if he invades on your property"

Genius[:D][^]

That is up there with Lance Armstrong on the moon.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 22:59
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude, he's just a casualty of war in this instance.

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 11/08/2011 22:59
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

TheSmogMonster - There's some pretty bizarre laws around that have never been repealed. So although it sounds completely ridiculous, that doesn't mean such a law doesn't exist.

riddler Posted on 11/08/2011 23:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[:D][:D]

Honest!

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

if a pennys worth of water is 6 months, because a bottle of water in lidls never cost 3.50 at all

then a plasma tv would be 55 life sentences

unless your rich of course, as the law doesnt apply to you, the laws only affect the working classes



Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 23:02
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

That's some chip you've got on your shoulder.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:03
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!


In Liverpool, it is illegal for a woman to be topless except as a clerk in a tropical fish store

[:D]now thats a law

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 23:03
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Viv, seriously, use your noggin.

Don't end up doing a dude and changing the subject.

Space_Face Posted on 11/08/2011 23:03
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

What about the Welsh?

riddler Posted on 11/08/2011 23:04
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

FFS! It's not about what the item is worth you thick moron. Sorry boys but the idiot needed to be told of the elephant in the room.

two_banks_of_four Posted on 11/08/2011 23:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

the guy was caught red handed commiting commercial burgalry during the biggest civil disturbances for years. The fact that the nobber was risking his liberty for £3.50 of water is down to his own stupidity.

On the bright side he isn't welsh so can enjoy a day out in chester anytime he wants, when he gets out obviously.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

not really lisbon


unless you think stealing tap water is worse than 42 billions worth of tax evasion

i wonder what sentence blair should get for sending thousands of troops to there deaths so he could have a good life


viv_andersons_nana Posted on 11/08/2011 23:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Wasn't attempting to change the subject at all.

"It is legal to murder a Scotsman within the ancient city walls of York, but only if he is carrying a bow and arrow."

That's why I wondered whether what dude said was true or not, because laws of that nature still exist.

Skitchy Posted on 11/08/2011 23:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I feel we are all missing the real crime here ....

£3.50 for a bottle of water??? Now that's what I call robbery


red_harrington Posted on 11/08/2011 23:06
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

It was a crate of water bottles

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:08
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[:D]its funny how everyone is XXXXXXing on about it not the value of the item to justify the preposterous statement


i hope you all hand yourselfs in for copyright theft in that case, you hypocrite, XXXXXXhouses, i bet every single one of you has been stealing for years of the net

your all too busy celebrating the victim you wanted to understand the hypocrisy in it all

XXXXXXhouses

Space_Face Posted on 11/08/2011 23:09
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Peckham Spring Water.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 23:10
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

He didn't just steal a bottle of water, he contributed to and took advantage of riots that terrorised and endangered lives in the capital. Let's pat them all on the back and let them off cos that'll teach them.

Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 11/08/2011 23:11
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I don't think the Dude's suggesting that.

blindschool Posted on 11/08/2011 23:12
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

It makes me think of the greedy, avaricious, immoral and dishonest money men who looted our country and destroyed our economy and have suffered nothing at all, whilst we working people make the sacrifices to pay it back while they carry on paying each other multi million pound bonuses.
Makes me proud to be British.

two_banks_of_four Posted on 11/08/2011 23:12
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

the value of the object is immaterial to the crime committed you dullard. I thought a man of the law such as yourself would has grasped that simple legal principle.


TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 23:12
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Wasn't attempting to change the subject at all.

"It is legal to murder a Scotsman within the ancient city walls of York, but only if he is carrying a bow and arrow."

That's why I wondered whether what dude said was true or not, because laws of that nature still exist."

I wasn't saying you were changing the subject, I was alluding to the dudes craven dodging.

Now do you SERIOUSLY believe that if someone killed a scotsman carrying a bow and arrow they'd get away with it?

I'm trying to be polite here.... just google it or something and spare me.

Dave_ Posted on 11/08/2011 23:15
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"so a 6-month prison sentence for being in a shop whilst it was being looted and picking up and dropping £3.50 worth of water??"

i love the phrase 'being in a shop whilst it was looted'. as if he walked in when it was open and just got caught up in it.

Fact: the shop was closed and secured. rioters break in and he follows them in. therefore he is also looting, and he is also a rioter. to me it doesn't matter if he took NOTHING. he entered and joined in. guilty.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:17
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

yeh, i knew that because tony blair got a nice retirement package and a book deal for murdering thousands of young british men and women by sending them to an illegal war so he and his tosspot family could have jaguars and a big swimming pool

i'll leave you all to get back to your illegal downloads now lads, hoping and praying one of you gets caught and gets 6 months so i can laugh when you come on here and cry about how hard done to you are

hypocrites

red_harrington Posted on 11/08/2011 23:18
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude have you ever broken the law?

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 23:18
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

And I'll leave you professing your knowledge of the law (while knowing XXXXXX all).

Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 23:19
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I think we all agree that the politicians should be punished but this is a different issue.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:20
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

get back to your downloads smogmonster

you tedious little hypocrite XXXXXXhouse

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 11/08/2011 23:21
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Let's pat them all on the back and let them off cos that'll teach them."

That kind of thinking is part of the problem that will prevent any kind of rational to debate as to attempt to understand why these incidents happen, and how we make sure they don't happen again.

Most people seem to think questioning a six-month sentence for stealing some water equates to saying 'let them off' or 'pat them on the back', when it doesn't equate to that at all.

What people are looking for is consistency. I mentioned it yesterday; People steal billions and billions of pounds from the economy(either by gambling it away on the stock-market or moving it into far-away tax-havens) and steal money from the tax-payer to hide their crimes. The rich and powerful send people off into illegal wars, to ransack other countries and steal their wealth, at the same time as killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. They get away with all those things - because they are part of the political elite. Would you or I get away with not paying billions in tax? Would we get away with mass-murder? No, we wouldn't.

Before anyone starts whining on about how I'm 'condoning' the riots and the looting - I'm not. I'm saying that there is absolutely no consistency with regards to how the law is applied in the UK. Which is why a man whose lies led to the death of god knows how many men, woman and children can walk away scot-free whilst a man who steals some water is sentenced to six-months in prison.

Absolutely ludicrous.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:22
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

i would think there isnt a single person in england with a computer who isnt breaking the law

whats the point


skiprat Posted on 11/08/2011 23:22
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I think he's finally gone berserk.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 23:25
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"get back to your downloads smogmonster

you tedious little hypocrite XXXXXXhouse"

LOL

You know nothing of my work.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:26
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

people are making this lad out to be part of a riot or being part of something causing damage

he hasnt donw anything aside from an opportunistic act of naivety, he hasnt put windows through, he hasnt caused damage, he hasnt cost anybody anything apart from the taxpayers tens of thousands in jail fees


we are short of space in prison cells, surely fining this lad £100 would be far better than wasting tens of thousands on prison fees for such a pathetic crime of stealing tap water

fine him, make him do community service, but 6 months

XXXXXX off

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 23:26
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Is he going to bed ? Thank christ the bloke is a knob...... totally clueless

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:27
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

so are you saying you have not downloaded a single thing illegally of the internet smogmonster?

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 11/08/2011 23:28
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Now do you SERIOUSLY believe that if someone killed a scotsman carrying a bow and arrow they'd get away with it? "

Well, looking at how the courts are working this week and how they are determined to apply 'the letter of the law' in all cases(under extreme political pressure, it must be said), I would expect nothing less than to walk away from court free of charge should I decide to commit the act mentioned above.

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 23:28
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

are you saying you have'nt ?

two_banks_of_four Posted on 11/08/2011 23:29
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"people are making this lad out to be part of a riot"

just popping into lidl for his weekly shop was he? Good job he missed those riots, might have got hurt....

Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 23:30
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Viv, I believe in a hard line stance, things have become too soft, too many righteous do gooders saying you can't do this or that. This is about ensuring this never happens again, no matter what he stole, he was part of a disgusting and unbelievable sequence of events. Yes, the punishment is tough if you look at in isolation but it was part of a much wider issue and I'm afraid if were to make these idiots take notice then these people need to be made an example of. He wasn't 15, he was a grown man who contributed to spreading fear across the capital. He'll have 6 months to reflect on his idiocy,

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:30
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Throwing the book at some random student is not the way to rebuild trust in the system

Aside from the social fallout from oversentencing, a six-month prison stint makes no fiscal sense for a government already suufering from a recession

its bollox and you all know it


redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 23:30
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

If its a district judge Viv your going down !

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:33
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

but it would be alright if he was a puppet for the military establishment and went and shot some brown people

is that ok lisbon?

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 11/08/2011 23:36
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I'm not saying he didn't partake in it though. I'm saying a six-month sentence is ludicrous when you consider that people who commit far, far more serious crimes are allowed to walk away scot-free.

Six-months for stealing water/a crate of water(whatever it was) IS ludicrous because people do worse things and don't even get charged. If the law was applied consistently, regardless of wealth, power or where you sit amongst the elite, from top-to-bottom then six-months for this lad might not seem so bad.

People are annoyed because rich and powerful thieves(who steal a hell of a lot more than water, electrical goods and shoes) aren't treated in the same way as poor thieves. Which is evidenced by how the Government/courts/judges have responded to the incidents of the last week or so.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:37
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

theyve got want they wanted viv, a scapegoat


everybody is happy now and they can return to there illegal downloads, knowing the worlds a better place because a 23 year old student is doing 6 months for stealing tap water

[rle]bellends

TurnbullsCans Posted on 11/08/2011 23:40
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

A scapegoat?? Serves him right, he took the decision to nick it. Tough shyte.

Hope more of the fckers end up getting more than they bargained for.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:41
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

says turnbull half way thorugh watching planet of the apes

SidSnot Posted on 11/08/2011 23:42
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

6 months seems harsh given it was bottled water. However, we have no idea why it was water, perhaps he was thirsty, perhaps all the flat screen tv's had gone. I'm sorry Dude, but I think you're attempts at equivalence are wide of the mark. Looting is far more serious than common thieving whether it's illegal downloading or MPs stealing from the taxpayer. Harsh punishment, heavy price to pay, but still no one to blame but himself.

redisameancolour Posted on 11/08/2011 23:43
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[:o)][:o)]

TheSmogMonster Posted on 11/08/2011 23:47
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Took a while to type this while watching QT but, viv I think yours and the dude's argument relies on a fallacy that because it comes across as one crime is unpunished therefore any punishment for any other crime is almost unjustified.

But as people said to you earlier, your comparing cut and dry crimes done on CCTV in front of a line of police and press with failing on the stock market.

It's not an objective way to look at things, I accept Blair should be in prison (I can actually argue the point far better then 'Dude'), alongside some MP's on hefty sentences for their part in the expenses scandal, I accept some in the financial services got away with more then the deserve, but do you honestly believe many feel different?

You can't just let these looters get away with it because there are other problems in the world. The dude claims that the law is unjust because it's based religion and then uses something analogousness to a religious manta 'let he who without sin cast the first stone' etc. (You seriously are the worst athiest ever dude.)

This guy took part in a riot, I agree it's a heavy sentence, but there's alot of scared people out there and being caught doing it means your going down and rightly so.

It's easy to maintain this pacifist position when it's not your home/business/life ruined by these events, and this mans sentence is heavy because he was part of it.

As for the causes, it's an unbelievably complex set of problems, but none of it justifies in anyway whats gone on.

"Well, looking at how the courts are working this week and how they are determined to apply 'the letter of the law' in all cases(under extreme political pressure, it must be said), I would expect nothing less than to walk away from court free of charge should I decide to commit the act mentioned above."

Your just highlighting how you don't understand the system, un-repealed laws in this country are meaningless. It's quite painful, because previously I thought that even though I don't always agree with you, that your a reasonably intelligent bloke, but now I'm guessing I was wrong. I was seriously trying to be polite, but if you can't figure it out for yourself, I don't see why I should bother if you're (just) going to be willfully stupid.

And dude I'll tell you when you admit how XXXXXXing stupid your welshman post was.

SidSnot Posted on 11/08/2011 23:48
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

People are annoyed because rich and powerful thieves(who steal a hell of a lot more than water, electrical goods and shoes) aren't treated in the same way as poor thieves. Which is evidenced by how the Government/courts/judges have responded to the incidents of the last week or so.

That's desparately one eyed Viv. Charlie Gilmor just got 16 months for swinging from the cenotaph. He's a Cambridge student and his Dad a multi-millionaire rock star. Besides, the important thing here is that looting and common theft are not equivalent crimes.

Skitchy Posted on 11/08/2011 23:51
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Would be interesting to see what happened to crime rates if they made six months the minimum sentence for any theft at all regardless of monetary value.

Maybe the argument shouldn't be that others got lighter sentences for worse crimes so therefore this sentence is too heavy, but rather that this shows so far we have been too lenient on criminals and that is why the country is in such a state.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:53
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

40 thousand in prison fees for 10p worth of water


maybe its time the law was changed to reflect the value of the item stolen, it can only be damaging to the long term economy to sentence people for 6 months for stealing penny mojos

either that or a more revolutionary idea like, community service or a fine

ffs








Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 23:54
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

No Viv, the riots ruined people's lives, I've friends who's kids wake up crying in the night because of what happened and people who now don't feel safe in their homes. This can't happen again, ever. stop whining about politicians and the past and let's talk about this issue which needs dealing with.

the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 23:57
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

blah blah blah smog, you can does this better etc

i could myself give a better argument if i could be arsed

i just want you to admit your a hypocrite because you download illegally and therefore the rest of your post is worthless and so is your opinion

denial is pointless

your a thief and no better than the lad caught stealing water

if anything, your crime is worse as water is free anyway and its value is only in its packaging

get back to your downloads, your boring

SidSnot Posted on 11/08/2011 23:57
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I suspect crime in total costs the economy far more than the criminal justice system. Besides, can I just re-iterate that looting is not the same as common theft. You're trying to make it out like it was shoplifting. It wasn't.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 23:58
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Spot on Sid.[^]

degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 23:59
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude - you are either taking the pi55 or are utterly brainless.

This has nothing to do with stealing - it is looting. Not only is it looting, it is looting in the middle of the capital during the greatest civil unrest for 30 odd years at a time when copy cat incidents were starting to happen across the country.

I'm sure if he'd just shoplifted the water during normal opening hours he would have got off rather lighter.

I have some sympathy with him - but what the f'ck do you expect to happen. Most of these little cnuts are only doing it because they think that they will get away with it scott free or perhaps with a slap on the wrist at worst. When they start seeing people sent down for 6 months I'm sure it will act as a slight deterrent.

(Oh, and by the way, trying to convince others of your knowledge of the British legal system by quoting archaic laws about killing welshmen has a somewhat opposite effect)

redisameancolour Posted on 12/08/2011 00:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

totally agreed LL..... christ i'm agreeing with Lisbon !

The point is he was involved in a riot.... what part of that is hard for you to understand dude ?

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 00:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Spot on Degsy.[^]

SidSnot Posted on 12/08/2011 00:03
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

No Viv, the riots ruined people's lives, I've friends who's kids wake up crying in the night because of what happened and people who now don't feel safe in their homes.

Quite right Lisbon. Some people seem to be talking like it was victimless crime or it was ok "coz the rich thieve their taxes, innit".

The footage of the Malaysian student was all over the news here in the US. The reputation of our country has taken a terrible battering.

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:03
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

what constitutes being part of a riot

walking past damaged property


so if boro gets trashed tonight and i walk past it tommorow im part of the riot

XXXXXX

that lidl was trashed before he got there, he wasnt involved in trashing it and was infact just a petty thief, just like you are illegally downloading

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 00:04
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Spot on redis.[;)]

Skitchy Posted on 12/08/2011 00:04
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Downloading music isn't technically theft as you don't deprive anyone of their property - I think the legal term for illegal downloads "copyright infringement"

Of course, big buisiness would like to portray it as theft as it suits their agenda but no one caught will ever be convicted of theft.

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 00:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

All I was commenting on is what I perceived to be inequalities in the charging and sentencing of various groups of criminals. One set of rules for one group of people, one set of rules for another.

"Your just highlighting how you don't understand the system, un-repealed laws in this country are meaningless."

I don't profess to be an expert in this field, so if I could ask a question in all seriousness; when does an un-repealed law become meaningless and why aren't they scrapped and/or updated as time moves on?


Boro_in_Sleaford Posted on 12/08/2011 00:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[?]

TheSmogMonster Posted on 12/08/2011 00:06
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude you do know downloading 'illegally' isn't actually a criminal offence don't you?

Unlike say killing a welshman....

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:06
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

so what are we saying now, stealing and fraud is acceptable as long as it isnt from a shop thats been trashed


this word riot, smells a bit lite bullXXXXXX to me, an evocative, emotional word a little bit like terror, terroism

mayeb if the lad waited a week, booted the windows in by himself and stole 400 bottles of whiskey he would have got a weeks community service for petty theft

XXXXXX, your all too hung up on the word 'riot' and the context that anybody anywhere near ones is a rioter, irregardless of the fact it crossed the path where he always walks home

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 00:07
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Sid, the Dude and Viv obviously have other agendas, tough justice needs to be meted out to these idiots, water, diamonds, trainers or whatever, punishment is due 1) to show the criminals they can't do what they like and 2) to reassure the law abiding public who have been shaken by these events.

Boro_in_Sleaford Posted on 12/08/2011 00:08
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Theft is Theft no matter what the object is worth and I agree that the criminal should be punished however,A six month sentence does not reflect the relaxed law that Britain has dug itself into. I have no care for the guy who commited the offence or the judge who passed the sentance. What really annoy's me is that there is no consistancy and this "opportunist" will be made an example of yet I predict (hope I am wrong) that 80% of the rioters will not be punished.

Before these riots if you entered a commercial premesis with intent to steal you would have received a suspended sentance.(providing it was your first offence)

The real topic of discussion is why does it take 3 nights of rioting & looting, costing hundreds of thousands of £ to decide that we will punish using the laws of the country

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 00:08
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Some people seem to be talking like it was victimless crime or it was ok "coz the rich thieve their taxes, innit"."

Bloody hell. I understand it these riots have ruined people's lives, their businesses and their communities. People are assuming because I'm not advocating six-month sentences for looting bottles of water I'm therefore condoning these actions or saying we shouldn't be punishing those involved. I'm not. They should be punished. So should ALL criminals, which is the point I am making. Or at least attempting to make.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 12/08/2011 00:08
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"I don't profess to be an expert in this field, so if I could ask a question in all seriousness; when does an un-repealed law become meaningless and why aren't they scrapped and/or updated as time moves on?"

Google it, I'm off to bed, this stuff is very easy to come by. If you managed to find a boro messageboard you have it within you to do so.

"the Dude and Viv obviously have other agendas"

[^][^][^]

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:10
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

dont forget to put your firewall on smog, virgin are getting big on illegal downloads

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 00:11
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"That's desparately one eyed Viv. Charlie Gilmor just got 16 months for swinging from the cenotaph. He's a Cambridge student and his Dad a multi-millionaire rock star."

His sentence was a political statement. It didn't reflect the crime committed(if indeed swinging from a lump of Portland stone is a crime at all).

SidSnot Posted on 12/08/2011 00:12
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude - think looting, not rioting and yes, if you walk past a smashed up store in the Boro tonight and wander in to pick something up, then that's looting and it's a very serious offence for which you would rightly go to prison.

There is an element of hypocrisy of course and in the interests of balance, let me point you to a brilliant article written by Peter Oborne.




Link: two wrongs still don't make a right though

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:16
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

its a question of balance, and the lack of it

that 6 month sentence has just made that lad and his family and friends even more angry at the justice system , not respectful of it

society needs to respect the system for it to survive, and for it be respected it cant hide behind XXXXXXty legislation and inequality where bankers can take your house/mortgage and sell it on for profit etc, and then sent an individual away for 6 months for something that comes out of a tap

its dissproportionate and unfair and a huge tax burden on the state


viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 00:18
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Googled and understood. Statutes and interpretations, that kind of thing. Forgive my apparent stupidity, but I posted in innocence.

As for having 'another agenda', well yes. Fairness and equality being two of the key words in that agenda.

degsyspesh Posted on 12/08/2011 00:20
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude - what do you think the effect of this sentence will be on those people who were thinking about going out rioting etc in the next couple of days?

My guess is that it will make the majority of them not bother. They aren't hardened criminals, they're just chavvy little cnuts who thought that they could get away with it. Well they can't.

I would bet that there are a lot of them currently sitting very quietly at home with there ar5e5 twitching waiting for a knock at the door.

SidSnot Posted on 12/08/2011 00:20
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

It doesn't come across that way though Viv. I think most right minded people would agree that justice should be blind. Referring to "rich" people evading justice is just as likely to be perceived as providing approval and encouragement to the less fortunate in society.

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:21
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[^]good article that sid, the rioters are merely mimicking the cheating, decietful XXXXXXhouses that are in the house of commons

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:24
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

you cant punish somebody with a sentence as a warning to the acts that somebody else might do

thats like giving an mp 6 months for cheating the tax payer with false expense claims so that none of the others do

on second thoughts.............

besides, the answer to reform isnt through fear, its to restore hope and give people a better vision of what there lifes can be like

borodavey Posted on 12/08/2011 00:26
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Like said earlier he got a lower end of the scale sentence for rioting. Rioting can bring a 10 year sentence.

I can't believe some of what I read. Saying he wasnt involved in the riot. Err yes he was, he was in the shop with the rioters. Saying he got caught up in the moment. Well all can say that can't they. The facts are the facts. He was caught looting(not stealing) during a riot therefore the sentence is higher. You can agree or disagree but it's the law and he broke it. He never just got 1 bottle of water, he got a crate so it wasn't that he was just passing and was thirsty. He went in looking to loot. It backfired and now he is in jail.

Can the ones who assaulted people also say, I was just passing and got caught up in the moment. I wasn't a rioter. Or the ones who killed the 3 guys. No. Because they contributed to the riots just like this guy did. End of.

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:29
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

oh XXXXXX off, comparing assualt and murder to stealing tap water

there is some confusion here, it isnt about if he was right or wrong, its the dissproportionate sentencing considering the thousands of things worse in society that happen without punitive action, usually on a corporate level

borodavey Posted on 12/08/2011 00:34
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Go and learn a bit about the law mate. You will see I am correct in what I am saying. It's a small part about he water.. Mainly its about he riot. That is a serious offence. Thousands of lives ruined. People have lost jobs because of these looters. Businesses have had to shut. People where scared for there lives. It's a much more serious crime than stealing water. He participated in that and needs punishing accordingly.

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:37
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

this lad didnt ruin a single persons life by lifting bottled water

who told you that, rupert murdoch?

thousands of people lives are 'ruined' by tax evasion as well, and illegal wars

like i said, scapegoats

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 00:41
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Referring to "rich" people evading justice is just as likely to be perceived as providing approval and encouragement to the less fortunate in society."

My reasons for believing this sentence is disproportionate and unfair are based on what I believe to be an unfair system. I gave examples of why I think it is unfair - people perceiving that to be providing 'approval' or 'encouragement' to the less fortunate is part of the problem, and it's a problem that is going to dog the debates that will no doubt take place over the coming weeks. Questioning the sentencing, the reaction of the politicians, the media and the police, attempting to understand why these things happened in the first place, how we deal with the people who took part and how we punish them ISN'T offering 'sympathy' to the perpetrators, or 'condoning' their behaviour nor is it offering 'approval' or 'encouragement' - lots of people seem to be wrapped-up in that kind of thinking.

It seems like you can't acknowledge that politicians have more than played their part in the unrest and that, to me, seems very wrong indeed. It feels like the only people who will be listened to are those who advocate 'throwing away the key' and all the other short-termist nonsense we'll hear in the near-future. There is mass-inequality in our society. Until we acknowledge that, what causes that and how we actually attempt to correct it, well these things will continue to happen. We have to tackle, or attempt to tackle, the root causes of these riots.

That isn't me offering 'support' or 'encouragement' to criminals. I'm just saying we live in a society riddled with so much inequality that rioting was a cast-iron certainty, it was a matter of when not if, and that is a very different thing.

Anyway, to go back to the matter in hand; I believe the sentence this lad received is unfair, and doesn't fit the crime. Nor do I think it acts as a genuine deterrent.

borodavey Posted on 12/08/2011 00:43
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

No 1 person in the riots did. It was collective and he was a part. If he robbed a bank but was only the driver should he not get a sentence for bank robbing. Just dangerous driving? He was sentenced within the guidelines of the law.

Btw getting into war crimes etc is a whole different ball game. Yes IF found guilty They should be big sentences. Fraud, tax evasion etc maybe should have bigger sentences. That doesn't mean sentences for rioting should be reduced though. That's a whole different unrelated thing.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 00:46
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Viv, so what do you think will act as a genuine deterrent?

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:47
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

if anything viv, i think it will just XXXXXX people off even more

i really do

obviously it will please the simpletons who like social example scapegoats, but in the big scheme of things, its a nonsense

it was coming as well, this publicity stunt, as soon as cameron decided to release his big propoganda statement, you could sense some random man or woman was going to cop it as an example


the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 00:49
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

again davey, nobody is arguing his guilt, just the sentence

in your eyes stealing some water is worse than stealing thousands of pounds with false expense claims, or worse than sending soldiers to there deaths in an illegal war, or bankers making profits from repossed houses

in mine it isnt

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 00:52
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

A genuine deterrent? A fair and equal society, everybody being treated in the same way, rich or poor would act as a better, and far more sustainable, deterrent than you may initially think.

As for this particular crime - a fine and a few weeks community service(clearing up the communities damaged in the riots) would be enough, in my opinion.

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 00:54
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"if anything viv, i think it will just XXXXXX people off even more

i really do"

I agree with that. People need to have faith in the system, that they will be treated in exactly the same manner as the next person, whether they be black or white, rich or poor. If there is such inequality, such blindingly obvious inequality, in said system then it won't work. Which is why it hasn't worked, and why it will continue to not work.

Jonicama Posted on 12/08/2011 01:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I've read some of this trhead but not all.

I don't think anyone on here would think that stealing a £3.50 crate of water desrves a 6 month prison sentnence - but that isn't anything like the full picture.

As someone did say earlier it was against the background of a large civil disturbance (riot). All the defendants are going to argue that they "were caught in the moment". That is just rubbish.

Dude - Genuinely intersted - what sentence do you think he should get.

Voltaire Posted on 12/08/2011 01:03
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"so what do you think will act as a genuine deterrent?"

Provide people with jobs and security.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 01:07
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

This is not a game with which to measure previous punishments given out, this is a totally unique phenomenon that needs a hard line approach if the law and judicial system isn't to fall apart entirely. The millionaires getaway driver daughter will no doubt receive the same sentence as this person. There's your equality. Everyone knows there are big problems in the social system that won't be solved over night but this is here and now and needs dealing with.

Viv, you're talking like a University lecturer, do you have a degree in Sociology?

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 01:10
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Provide people with jobs and security."

[:D][:D][:D]

TeessideCleveland Posted on 12/08/2011 01:11
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

'the_dude_abides Posted on 11/08/2011 22:13

a disgracefully long sentence handed down by a bellend judge who has probably evaded tax and cost the state far more himself'

So 'probably' allows for wild acusations?
Should have got 6 years



I don't think anyone on here would think that stealing a £3.50 crate of water desrves a 6 month prison sentnence - but that isn't anything like the full picture.

As someone did say earlier it was against the background of a large civil disturbance (riot). All the defendants are going to argue that they

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 01:13
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"This is not a game with which to measure previous punishments given out, this is a totally unique phenomenon that needs a hard line approach if the law and judicial system isn't to fall apart entirely"

It already has fallen apart entirely. It's been falling apart for thirty-odd years. Society itself has been falling apart for thirty-odd years and that is the most pressing issue, the issue we should be most concerned about. A load of headline-grabbing, short-term measures won't prevent these things from happening again. They've tried those methods many times in the past and they didn't work. Indeed, they've lead us to where we are now.

No I don't have a degree in Sociology, unfortunately. Though I wouldn't mind one.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 01:18
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

You are missing the point entirely, I walked down the Uxbridge Road earlier and there were 50 odd riot police on the streets and I can hear sirens outside now. The effects of these riots are there for all to see, we need to deal with the immediacy of what has happened and this is part of that. What also should happen in the background is some sort of social reform, the two can go hand in hand. However, this is the here and now, you can't fix 30 odd years of mistakes in a week, that will take a lot longer, I think every man and his dog knows that.

Voltaire Posted on 12/08/2011 01:19
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Yes, a ridiculous idea, LL. You retreat back to your middle class existence and we'll throw the poor and the desperate in jail. I'm sure that'll work. Until next time.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 01:21
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I asked what would be a deterrent to rioting and you said give them all jobs, the majority of these scumbags are finished, they're too stupid to be educated unfortunately and who in their right mind would give that scumbag Manc with his face covered gloating on TV a job?

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 01:46
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Going off your last post, Lisbon, I'd say it was you that is missing the point entirely.

'Scumbag', 'finished', 'who in their right mind would employ him', 'too stupid'. You should think about writing press-releases for the Conservative Party, or perhaps look for some work as a part-time social-commentator for one of the many right-wing propaganda machines some people might refer to as 'newspapers'.

I fully-understand that you can't right thirty-odd years of wrongs in one week. You can acknowledge the part they have played though. You can attempt to debate why these things happen and why they will happen again. Indeed, not to acknowledge them is to weaken the debate considerably. It's all very relevant.

As for these people being locked-up; yes, some of them will deserve to go to prison. Those who set fire to homes, shops and cars, those who looted and stole and those who trashed their own communities. People who commit serious crimes deserve to be punished. But what do you do with them when they come out? Those who you dismiss as being 'stupid' or 'scumbags', well they will still exist and have a place within society when they are released.

It's not as easy as you think, just chucking them in prison and hoping they'll go away. They'll still exist, even if they're under a carpet somewhere, and you'll still have to address every single contributing factor as to why they were involved/imprisoned in the first place if you ever want to move on properly.

Grrreds Posted on 12/08/2011 07:21
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Don't lose sight of the fact he was sentenced for burglary.

This wasn't a daft shoplifting, looting is burglary.

Hurworth Posted on 12/08/2011 08:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

The analogy regarding Letwin misappropriating £2k from the taxpayer and this Robinson lad who looted from a Lidl supermarket concludes that neither will commit the same crime again.

Therefore, both ways, a satisfactory result and the law can work.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 08:14
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"'Scumbag', 'finished', 'who in their right mind would employ him', 'too stupid'. You should think about writing press-releases for the Conservative Party, or perhaps look for some work as a part-time social-commentator for one of the many right-wing propaganda machines some people might refer to as 'newspapers'."

Viv, I'm simply being honest I'm afraid, something which you seem incapable of with your flowery sanitised approach to law and order. Not everyone has the capacity to learn or change their ways. The country doesn't have the resources to cuddle and nurture these toe rags. It's sad to say but a large proportion of these people should be written off so we can start again. It doesn't please me to say that but it's the truth. Whatever the reasons for the riots and the creation of these mini thugs, they happened. Let's get this right, they're being taught a lesson with a six month jail sentence, they're not in their for life.

I have acknowledged that there is a wider issue in all this which needs addressing but you also need to show everyone that if you break the law and spread terror you will be punished. What sort of message would it send out to the police who risked their lives capturing these people if we gave them a few hours community service. Once this has moved on and order is restored then you address why this has happened and there's not a simple answer but a plethora of wide ranging factors over many years.

Buddy Posted on 12/08/2011 08:54
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I'm not entirely sure that I agree with the notion that somebody stealing something in the vicinity of a riot has committed a far greater offence than someone who decides to go out and steal.

Sergio_Pizzorno Posted on 12/08/2011 09:01
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

It doesnt matter whether it was water or a gold-plated Rolls-Royce. The fact is he STOLE it.

I dont care that judge was heavy-handed with his sentence.This sends a message out and people might think twice in future.[^]

Grrreds Posted on 12/08/2011 09:24
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

He committed a BURGLARY.

He entered as a trespasser, a building, and stole whilst in there. People are talking about it being a 'daft theft' it wasn't it was a burglary which carries a maximum penalty of 14 years in prison.

He was sentenced accordingly and if he'd taken it to the Crown Court might have got longer.

Maidenhead-RED Posted on 12/08/2011 09:24
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Anyone who thinks this punishment is harsh, needs to have a word with themselves. Yes, it may be true that he only stole a bottle of water, but perhaps this is all he got caught for. How do we know he never kicked a pensioner 30 mins before, or started a fire, or shot a brick at a policemen. The simple fact is, he was there, and involved. Today’s society need to be shown that this is not a normal way to live a life, and respect to the authorities. Without such punishments, this country will only get worse. We need this type of action, and we need it now.[^]

Sergio_Pizzorno Posted on 12/08/2011 09:27
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Agree Maibenhead 100%

Holgatewall Posted on 12/08/2011 09:32
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

The judges appear to be giving the lawbreakers the sort of sentences they believe the majority of the British public want to see handed down to these rioters/looters.

Whether the sentences fit the crime is open to debate.

Some will appear too harsh and others too lenient.

Can't please everyone.

stevie-g888 Posted on 12/08/2011 09:44
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

i don't think courts decide the sentence on the value of goods stolen[:O]

Dibzzz Posted on 12/08/2011 09:47
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Great, but he'll do a month tops, he should have been at home out of the way if he didn't want to be involved.

Fearless_Fish Posted on 12/08/2011 09:58
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

So Maidenhead - you think sentences should be dished out for things people might conceivably have done, without and evidence?

skiprat Posted on 12/08/2011 10:18
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

The sentence is extremely harsh, but you have to look at the facts, he was in the middle of a riot, got caught committing burglary and now has to bear the brunt of those decisions.

I think a month would have been fair personally but comparing it to the MP's and illegal downloading (WTF) is pathetic.

"oh XXXXXX off, comparing assualt and murder to stealing tap water"

You are comparing someone being in the middle of a riot, the worst in 30 years to someone downloading Britney Spears album, who is being the more dramatic here?

They are crimes in a completely different backdrop to this.

Can anyone argue that this sentence won't have the effect it's supposed to bring?

inoffthepost Posted on 12/08/2011 10:20
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Does anybody have any idea how i can get my dodgy box working again.DudeANY IDEAS?

BoroAl Posted on 12/08/2011 10:24
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

If your car had been burnt,your kids terrified,your family scared to go out,how would you fell if the nice people who were running around doing all this got off because:-
"Well they weren't doing anything serious"

Maidenhead-RED Posted on 12/08/2011 10:32
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Fearless Fish - No i don't think sentances should be given for things that MIGHT have happened. I was mearly pointing out that Nobody knows what else he got up to, and we should not think that all he did was try to steal a bottle of water, get a grip on reality, people don't go on the streets to loot and just steal a bottle of water, he was there with the intention of causing trouble, and grabbing what he could for free, it just happened to be a bottle of water he got cought with.

Maidenhead-RED Posted on 12/08/2011 10:36
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I also noticed yesterday a Guy got 10 weeks for swearing at a policeman ! There is no hard rule at present what sentence is the correct sentence. Which is the whole point. Society needs to know, That if you are thinking of heading out tonight to cause trouble, you have to be prepared for the consequences, regardless of the crime ! and that is a big thumbs up from me [^]

Grrreds Posted on 12/08/2011 10:41
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

""i don't think courts decide the sentence on the value of goods stolen""

Yes they do. Sentencing guidelines for theft do reflect the value of property stolen, as well as aggravating and mitigating factors. I'm sure that in the middle of a riot the aggravating factors were overwhelming and the only mitigating factor will have been the value of property stolen.

Don't forget that he was sentenced for burglary.

Holgatewall Posted on 12/08/2011 10:43
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Basically what the courts are doing is saying if you were there at the scene of these riots and there is some justification in believing you carried out theft or assault etc you will be punished.

To me if you were there and there is conclusive evidence you took part in any disturbance you deserve to be punished.

Grrreds Posted on 12/08/2011 10:44
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

I also noticed yesterday a Guy got 10 weeks for swearing at a policeman ! There is no hard rule at present what sentence is the correct sentence.

More rubbish. There are sentencing guidelines that if sentencing Judges (or Magistrates) don't adhere to they will be appealed. Judges don't like to be appealed.

north_east_invader Posted on 12/08/2011 10:48
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

To begin with, I have to say I thought this was way over the top, but to be honest, the more I think about it - they HAVE no choice but to set examples with this (ring leaders or opportunistic chancers) and show everyone involved not that this WILL NOT be tolerated.

I think there are quite a few that will get a massive wake up call, and to be honest thats probably all thats needed here ... There were a few hard core idiots and a lot of people that didn't think, got caught up in it and thought they would get away with it ... well they will think again next time ... which is kind of the point.

Now, moving onto trying to bring in more draconian powers - especially switching off/restricting liberties and use of social media etc is something else - so far it seems the system is managing to do the job quite well to me as it is. True some lessons learned, but thats always the case - the hangover will hurt a few, but thats the slap in the face they needed I guess.

Yours,

The airy fairy liberal [:D]

sasboro1 Posted on 12/08/2011 10:57
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

crimes during rioting will always carry heavier sentences. you have to, otherwise you would get more riots and it becomes a lawless society

Fearless_Fish Posted on 12/08/2011 11:00
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"I also noticed yesterday a Guy got 10 weeks for swearing at a policeman ! There is no hard rule at present what sentence is the correct sentence. [...] and that is a big thumbs up from me"

So basically, if you ever utter "phucking police" you'll suddenly realise what you've done, hand yourself over, and accept a 10 week prison sentence and think that's fair?

I personally thing people should be sentenced on the crimes they've committed, not based on "well there was a riot on so he was probably up to much worse".

north_east_invader Posted on 12/08/2011 11:16
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"I personally thing people should be sentenced on the crimes they've committed, not based on "well there was a riot on so he was probably up to much worse"."

but its not that though is it, its not whether they may have been up to much worse or not, its to show that the mob does not rule, and this kind of action WILL NOT be tolerated.

Fearless_Fish Posted on 12/08/2011 11:26
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

So basically if you commit a crime then your punishment is based on what everyone else is up to at the time, not what you were actually doing yourself?

north_east_invader Posted on 12/08/2011 11:34
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"So basically if you commit a crime then your punishment is based on what everyone else is up to at the time, not what you were actually doing yourself?"

Combination isn't it. Tell that to the people working office admin at Auschwitz(*).

Isolated incidents can be looked at in isolation, incidents during a riot need to be looked at in context - a lot of people did stuff because they thought, well everyone else is doing it - so I can get away with it - they probably wouldn't even have considered doing it off their own back. After this lot I don't think as many would consider joining in if it happened again, and thats what is needed here.

(*Incidentally that was not an intentional invocation of Godwin's law, but it appears to have been anyway [:D]).

borodavey Posted on 12/08/2011 11:42
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

How many in the riots can say they set fires or something much worse than burglary. Most where there and got carried away and started looted just like this guy. He was there.. He looted. There is no difference to from him to 90% of the people in the riots. Only a small percentage committed worse crimes like assault or arson. They will no doubt get longer in jail. He was charged for being in a riot. What else he did matters little. He participated.

If the people committing fires etc where the only ones out. The police would have dealt with that easily. The reason they couldn't is because of people like this guy. The opportunists that turned up in there thousands in the mayhem to steal. Because of these they where outnumbered and it caused mass panic. So yes he should be sentenced accordingly as a part of it.


Link:

ThePrisoner Posted on 12/08/2011 12:13
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Twotontastic [^]

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 12:32
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Viv, I'm simply being honest I'm afraid, something which you seem incapable of with your flowery sanitised approach to law and order. Not everyone has the capacity to learn or change their ways. The country doesn't have the resources to cuddle and nurture these toe rags. It's sad to say but a large proportion of these people should be written off so we can start again. It doesn't please me to say that but it's the truth. Whatever the reasons for the riots and the creation of these mini thugs, they happened. Let's get this right, they're being taught a lesson with a six month jail sentence, they're not in their for life."

So you just write them off and leave them to rot on council estates? You talk of setting examples with these sentences being handed down, well, allowing hundreds if not thousands of young people to rot on council estates, on the streets, that's a great example to set isn't it. I'm not sure I want to be part of a society that conducts itself like that.

I AM being honest. My point(to repeat myself again) is that there is an unfair system in place. I don't have doubts as to whether these people should be punished. They should. I have acknowledged that so many times on this thread and others. What I am looking for is ALL criminals to be treated in the same way, and ALL people to be given the same access to a fair system and opportunities.

Sergio_Pizzorno Posted on 12/08/2011 13:18
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

So you just write them off and leave them to rot on council estates?

YES.[^]
Lets get something straight. These rioters/looters were not protesting against the government or police. They were looting and robbing.They are the scum of the earth and all of them charged will hopefully get nice long custodial sentences as least as long as the water thief.

Sergio_Pizzorno Posted on 12/08/2011 13:20
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

And if you obey the law and do go robbing and looting you dont get arrested and improsoned. Quite simple for decent folk really....[^]

viv_andersons_nana Posted on 12/08/2011 15:09
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Blimey. How short-termist of you. If you really think it's ok to leave these people to rot then brace yourself for more riots, more disorder and unrest, more damage done.

superstu Posted on 12/08/2011 15:24
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Lisbonlegend Posted on 11/08/2011 22:49
"Does it matter whether it's water or diamonds?"

Does it matter whether I killed a spider in the bath or a person in the bath?

superstu Posted on 12/08/2011 15:42
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 00:07

"Sid, the Dude and Viv obviously have other agendas, tough justice needs to be meted out to these idiots"

So what if Sid, the Dude and Viv do have other agendas? Are you suggesting they're the only ones? People calling for harsh sentences and "tough justice" probably would have done so a fortnight ago.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 16:28
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Viv, you're full of questions and no answers, how would you deal with that scumbag Manchester with the scarf over his face gloating about his part in the riots, Mr Long Termist.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 12/08/2011 18:26
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"So what if Sid, the Dude and Viv do have other agendas? Are you suggesting they're the only ones? People calling for harsh sentences and "tough justice" probably would have done so a fortnight ago."

It's a sense of perspective thing, just as an example the dude doesn't like any authority for whatever reason, any thread involving the police, religion or government its the same, on football I'd respect his opinion but on this his judgment is so cloudy that at one point he questions the existence of 'riots' which I suppose is very easy to when it hasn't touched your life.

I personally wouldn't give out a sentence like this for stealing water even in this context but the circumstances of a crime are important and that's why he's got a heavy sentence. I don't agree with it, but if this guy had got a week the dude would still have been offended by it because of 'Blair, etc, etc.'

They don't look for the rights and wrongs of a situation or try to be objective, and compare it to unrelated situations because they can't actually make a great argument for their views, they just hammer away even when the evidence is totally against them. I Personally think that unless your a complete tool you have to learn to change your mind when the evidence is against you or even when a suitably compelling argument is put forward.

Coincidentally as regard to 'only stealing' shops are having to close now because of these riots and people are losing their jobs, it was looting that finished them off.

There's going to be a lot of fallout to come from the victims of these riots before I start worrying whether the rioters have thrown themselves on the scrapheap or have received overly harsh sentences and I imagine most feel the same.

Lisbonlegend Posted on 12/08/2011 18:33
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[^]

Holgatewall Posted on 12/08/2011 18:38
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Too many 'bleeding heart liberals'make excuses for people who have no regard for anyone else.

If anyone really believes that there isn't an underclass in sociey who have no intetion of working and only want to live on benefits they shoul take a walk into our town and see them hanging around outside Macdonalds.

borodavey Posted on 12/08/2011 18:45
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

[^] smogmonster

Exactly what I was thinking.

SidSnot Posted on 12/08/2011 19:26
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Good post Smogmeister. Another thought occurs to me too. The problems of an "underclass" are very complex to solve. They are common across many countries and have existed throughout history. It would be in society's best interests to try to solve the issue. Many have tried and failed and more will try in the future with hopefully more success. Given that these are complex issues that are not easy to solve, then the next question you have to ask is whether harsh punishments will act as a deterrant or condemn the recipients to a life of crime. Equally, would soft punishments provide a green light for future mis-behaviour or be enough to make the perpetrators mend their ways. Seeing that the riots and looting spread when it appeared that the perpetrators would not be stopped, I would say that strong deterrant punishments are needed sadly.

Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime.

ThePrisoner Posted on 12/08/2011 19:28
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

'The poor will always be with you'. As some Jewish bloke once said.

superstu Posted on 12/08/2011 19:31
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"They don't look for the rights and wrongs of a situation or try to be objective, and compare it to unrelated situations because they can't actually make a great argument for their views, they just hammer away even when the evidence is totally against them. I Personally think that unless your a complete tool you have to learn to change your mind when the evidence is against you or even when a suitably compelling argument is put forward."

Except Viv has been talking about us living in a society based around inequality. Viv couldn't be more correct. There is nothing but evidence to support that.

superstu Posted on 12/08/2011 19:32
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime."

SidSnot, what do you think those words mean?

superstu Posted on 12/08/2011 19:34
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Too many 'bleeding heart liberals'make excuses for people who have no regard for anyone else."

Here is an example of a poster I think doesn't seem to have much regard for others. Is yozzer a bleeding heart liberal?

yozzer_hughes Posted on 11/08/2011 22:07

"Fcuk him.... hope his cell mate is 6'7" 18stone and gay....and in jail for male rape"

outoftowned Posted on 12/08/2011 20:35
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

most jails are about full ... there is a fair chance that some career criminal will be let out early to make space for him...
would not 6 month community service make more sense?

Bill_Leather Posted on 12/08/2011 20:51
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Apologies for hoofing this one back, but thought some of you legal-eagles might be interested to read this blog about the fairness or otherwise of the 6 month sentence for Nicolas Robinson (aka Lidl water thief).

Oh and BTW apparently the author of the blog is not seen to be a liberal type. Worth noting.


Link: MTPT blog

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 21:02
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

the legal genius on here proclaimed the judge give him a lenient sentence, shows they havent got a clue either

according to that article, the judge gave him the harshest possible sentence law allows him too

i agree with the article, community service and a fine would have sufficed, instead of putting the whole legal system into question with a 6 month sentence


sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 12/08/2011 21:05
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

While I accept that we live in a hideously divided society where social mobility get a kicking year after year by the political classes inability to deal with complex issues, the aggravating circumstances make it right to hand down heavy sentences.
The police clearly cannot cope. A common theme amongst interviews of looters is the idea that the police will be powerless to stop them and sentences will be weak. It's needed as a pragmatic measure to stop further violence.

And regarding judges. They aren't fools, and they are retracted in their sentencing powers by sentencing guidelines. They are overwhelmingly drawn from the privileged classes. Labour tried to put a sticking plaster over that by introducing some sort of new council to pick them but by failing to address or acknowledge the wider social issues which mean only the privileged get to be in the position to be judges they typically failed. Judges are just as likely to be liberal rather than conservative. If we did see them drawn from a wider background I think you would find them less liberal if anything. This opinion comes from experience rather than subscribing to cliched unthinking views to fit an inflexible ideology devoid of nuance. [:D]

the_dude_abides Posted on 12/08/2011 21:07
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

for me law is about how much money you have, the poorer you are the greater chance you have of prosicution for similiar offences


you only have to look at how many speeding fines that bloke gets footballers off with to know there are 2 sets of rules, the ones with money and the ones without

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 12/08/2011 21:17
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Bonfire of the vanities is an interesting book to read in the current climate. It was written after a great deal of research and chimes pretty well with a lot of my experiences.
There are a number of forces at work in the justice system. There is a strong strain of liberalism. There is populist political pressure. Ruling all is money. Making money, saving money. I could write loads about this, but banging out stuff on fmttm while I'm sitting on the bog is not the place. If you catch me in the pub I can bang on about it for hours.

Bill_Leather Posted on 12/08/2011 21:27
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Sheriff [^]

How about offering the Dude some words of wisdom about how to marshall an argument...

Buddy Posted on 12/08/2011 22:27
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Just came here to post the MTPT blog - excellent to see I've been beaten to it. [^]

borodavey Posted on 12/08/2011 23:14
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

The problem with that article is that it keeps referring to the crime of public disorder act of 1986. There is a different act that a riot falls under. That is the serious organised crime act of 2005. This has a sentence of up to 10 years. Te Tories made clear there feelings that they would like people trailed under the 2005
Act. That's a poorly researched article IMO as he hasn't even mentioned this act.. Instead he viewed
It as a public disorder act when a riot is clearly more serious than that.

degsyspesh Posted on 13/08/2011 08:55
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Dude - "for me law is about how much money you have, the poorer you are the greater chance you have of prosicution for similiar offences"

Very true, but that is not so much to do with the legal system as such, it is because having money allows you to hire the best lawyers. If poor people had the best lawyers they would avoid prosecution just the same as rich people do.

It's just a perk of being rich, no different to paying for better health care, better education, better house, holidays, cars etc etc.


bear66 Posted on 13/08/2011 09:13
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

A perk?

Presumably the rich person is innocent or he wouldn't get off so the poor man goes to jail when he's innocent?

If the rich man is not innocent but gets away with it then it suggests the legal system is cor(bank)rupt

Skitchy Posted on 13/08/2011 11:14
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Not sure I am happy with the suggestion of writing people off as being "beyond hope".

How many blokes on this list can look back at themselves aged 13-20ish and not have a few moments that they now aren't terribly proud of?

Imagine if you had been caught during one of those moments and essentially the rest of your life had been written off because of it?

You might not be able to accept the idea but most of the kids getting involved aren't that different to the daft kids you used to be. Easily influenced and swapping stories of who is hardest and who did what to who with a kind of reverence. Looking for something or someone to anchor ourselves to as we move from childhood to adulthood.

I suspect the majority of people involved in those riots will grow out of the need to prove how tough and macho they are over the next few years and go on to live useful and productive lives.

HOWEVER - there is a hard core or violent offenders who care nothing but themselves and believe they have a right to take whatever they want. I'd hapily see them locked up forever.

Senor_Chester Posted on 13/08/2011 12:22
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

"Does it matter whether I killed a spider in the bath or a person in the bath?"

Yeah, because one would be a crime and the other wouldn't [:o)]

Bill_Leather Posted on 13/08/2011 12:29
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

BoroDavey,

that's an interesting point, albeit not a relevant one.

Robinson was charged with “Theft and Burglary in a Building other than a Dwelling”. So tell me why sentencing might occur under the auspices of under either the Public Order 1986 Act or SOCPA 2005?

yozzer_hughes Posted on 13/08/2011 12:32
Six months for stealing £3-50 of water!

Superstu

Im no bleeding hearted liberal ![:(!]

In fact im as far from that as ya can possibly get !

I just have no sympathy for the rioters,looters,arsonists,robbers,murderers that have been involved in the problems during the last week.

These people chose to do what they did !

There victims had no choice[sad]

If they lose there jobs,homes,freedom,anal virginity ..... i wont shed one tear.

FCUK EM ALL !!