permalink for this thread : http://search.catflaporama.com/post/browse/2781293
the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 17:07
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

these 'thugs' or 'louts' etc or whatever is your favourite word you like to describe other people who loot etc and cause grief are people from poor social backgrounds and poor standard of education, and i'd say a fair few of them probably want to escape there lives but cannot or feel peer pressured into doing the things they do

education needs to be reformed and made available to everyone at the same high levels, as apposed to just letting rich kids carry on there parents tradition of owning all the countrys wealth

as much as we all like to think council estates are full of scum etc, we all know it isnt true and the only difference between prince harry and a 18 year old 'lout' who is rioting in london is his epigeneology, wealth of his parents and his education

you are, what ever your environment makes you, its as simple as that

humans beings are only animals, i know that offends some doyles on here who think some magical man in the sky made us, but we all vain animals with an arrogance to match, we just happen to be more intellgent than the next apex predator down the line

its as simple as that


Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 10/08/2011 17:08
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

[^]

Rayman Posted on 10/08/2011 17:09
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Run the bit about Prince Harry past me again!

OPEO Posted on 10/08/2011 17:10
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Dude, take a bow.[^]
Too many people thrown on the scrapheap and becoming social outcasts. We revel in the likes of Robin Hood who was an outlaw or Dick Turpin. These people are the modern equivalents.

zaphod Posted on 10/08/2011 17:11
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Do you have any evidence that "inequality in society is the real reason for rioting" or is it just your prejudices coming out? Some of the looters don't seem to be poor & uneducated at all.

Voltaire Posted on 10/08/2011 17:12
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Great post, Dude [^]

moxxey Posted on 10/08/2011 17:14
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"education needs to be reformed and made available to everyone at the same high levels"

A lot of these kids do not *want* to learn, this is the problem. It's not about bad schooling, it's just the way life has become. By saying that there's too much of a divide between rich and poor is false - it was as bad if not worse back in the 40s and 50s, but people were determined to get themselves out of their mess.

A lot of kids these days aren't determined. They are determined to fanny about, impress their mates on Facebook and so on, but not learn.

What are you doing to do, set up a free Eton in Hackney? Would that - as a silly example - really make the difference? I don't think so!

Look at Charlie Gilmour. He's had a very privileged background, lots of money, good education and he was out rioting and so on.

MFC_Riverside Posted on 10/08/2011 17:14
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Very true. The parents are also part of there environment though so some blame must go to them. If it was all about school and education then most of the country would be rioting having been educated in the same environment.

robbso Posted on 10/08/2011 17:16
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"We revel in the likes of Robin Hood who was an outlaw or Dick Turpin. These people are the modern equivalents."

[:D]Funniest thing i have seen in a long time.

Judge_Mental Posted on 10/08/2011 17:21
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

If Robin Hood nicked a plasma from Currys and plugged it into his chipped PS3 instead of giving it the poor then, yes, these people are basically the Merry Men.

SmogOnTheRhine Posted on 10/08/2011 17:24
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The problem is simple... their parents were abandoned by Thatcher in the 80's... now we're paying the price with their offspring.

No role models in society for these children.

Alienated parents create alienated children.

Jonny_Ingbar Posted on 10/08/2011 17:29
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's easy to blame Thatcher, but this is seen the world over so I dont think that holds much water really.

I agree with th OP, although I'm not sure the divide between rich and poor (not just in monetary terms) is ever really going to be addressed.

Thats not to say we shouldn't stop trying.


Brick_Tamland Posted on 10/08/2011 17:29
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

There is a need for social change to be effected through culture and non-violent means but to speak of these teenagers and others in any other terms than scumbags is to lend credence to their actions.

These are opportunist scavengers. Educated or not, poor or not does not come into it. The uneducated 'poor' absolutely abhors this horror and it does not speak for them. These opportunist criminals are bored and greedy and don't care about the consequences of their actions. Please don't either give their actions gravitas or patronise that sector of society by talking about anger or disenfranchisement caused by others.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 17:30
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

charlie gilmour is probably a very unhappy man for whatever reason and is an exception to the rule, i have no idea of his background at all, maybe he didn't get the attention he needed as a child as his dad was always away, i have no idea of his personal circumstances and neither do you so why comment

it's very easy to judge somebody else, i think the modern pressures of society and in particular the media don't help kids at all, this constant bullXXXXXX we get 24 hours a day on tv, prefect looking girls and boys on televison, if your fat nobody likes you, if your poor nobody likes you, if youve got spots or if your teeth are not perfect theres something wrong with you, you need this car or that boat to get respect, or the key to happiness is having a house with 10 thousand bedrooms, its all a media lie, true happiness is based around family values and laughter, these kids grow up seeing there parents XXXXXXed on drugs or alcohol and just mimic there actions, the government are quite happy for people to get hooked on cigarettes and alcohol, 2 killer drugs that destroy the nervous system as they profit from it massively

you only have to read this board to know that kids from poor backgrounds often get slated, the term chav is used often to ridicule a youngster

i'm not saying this applies to everyone, as there are exceptions, no doubt there are rich kids who commit murder , and kids from poor backgrounds who end up vicars, its all down to the environment and circumstance in which the child is brought up in



Sitrep Posted on 10/08/2011 17:45
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

We have perfected the class system to the point where everyone thinks they are better than the next person, if you were brought up in this invironment without any future, a lot would do the same.

OPEO Posted on 10/08/2011 17:47
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

A lot of people in Middlesbrough were brought up in housing provided by the Corporation. Council housing. Now you've upped and bought you look down your snotty noses at those beneath you on the social ladder.

raglasher Posted on 10/08/2011 17:49
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I think a lot of crap has been spouted on this
subject of the poor youngsters of today. Poor my backside on a whole the are spoilt and lazy,
you dont see their ar-es hang out of their trousers or their shoes uppers flapping about.
Now people will say there goes the old git going on about what it was like in the old days but i would like to transport them back to them times. I was born on Sutton estate in 1944 and was from the start very tall 6ft 8in now, my clothes were always half mast, shoes were too small and everything was on ration. I didnt pass the 11plus and went to Marton Grove secondary school and left at 15,by that time both of my parents were dead father when i was 8, mother at 14. I lived at my brothers till i was nearly 16 then i went to live in London on my own. I got an apprenticeship in floor laying and nearly starved but i made it. Later in life i was self employed for many years, raised 3 kids and put them through University. So you can see i have no sympathy with the spoilt youth of today and we as parents have made them that way.

Cleveleyssmoggie Posted on 10/08/2011 17:49
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Charlie Gilmour in common with a lot of the kids involved in this latest disorder are doing it for the buzz, social background is actually irrelevant.

Brick_Tamland Posted on 10/08/2011 17:53
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I'm not looking down my nose at anyone apart from criminals. There is widening gap between the haves and the have-nots and I agree the UK is destitute in terms of its cultural output, but we are not seeing protests by the poor: its criminal activity.

Protests, even anarchist gatherings, have some sort of ideological or political ambition. These lootings and acts of vandalism have nothing at their core apart from self-aggrandizement, personal gain and a false sense of empowerment for the participants.

outmac Posted on 10/08/2011 17:57
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The graphic designer and teacher come under
the equality flag ?
Lawyer at court yesterday was suprised so
many were'nt unemployed .

joshie Posted on 10/08/2011 17:58
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Always someone elses fault. I grew up in a council estate as did many of my friends. Some are now professionals, some of them have their own successful businesses.

Just because people start off poor doesnt mean they cant succeed in education and then life.

susy Posted on 10/08/2011 18:09
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Why are the people who live on long term benefits labelled as working class?

Working class used to be people who worked for a living, were proud of their achievements and looked after themselves and their community.

You talk about inequality, there always has been and always will be inequality. People are different and have differnet incomes and different values. We are just different.

The problems with schools that fail is often the fault of the parents. Parents who expect the school to discipline their children as well as provide child care while the parent sleeps through the day or whatever.

I am disgusted at what I have been seeing, I am glad that the police are starting to take a heavier approach.

Miklaadt Posted on 10/08/2011 18:18
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I look forward to watching you and your motivated followers marching into London to bring down the establishment and imposing your new order.

All the best. [^]

ccole Posted on 10/08/2011 18:20
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

You really suggesting that educated people dont rob? This guy worked in a school[:O]


Sometimes I do think ignorance would be bliss...


Link: Caught shopping at Dehenhams out of hours........

standards Posted on 10/08/2011 18:22
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

work hard and be nice to people...

works in a perfect world, only it's not a perfect world, so I air what little opinion I have, which is largely worthless, but people need to talk.

About 30 mins or so ago there were 3 black youths sat outside stockton swimming baths, talking to some other youths, bit mosherish. I was there waiting for the wife and kids, and sat further along but within earshot, I could hear them talking, one black lad, Id say about 13, seemed to me to be traumatised by it all.

In my opinion, its nothing more than a wrecking crew that have reaked havoc, and young minds that dont think have been swift to join in, but the spark may or may not have been the fear of not being likely to share a similar future to the well heeled of London and other major cities, or Peter Andre, or Katy Price, or the lass off the Iceland adverts.

stevestrange Posted on 10/08/2011 18:40
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

as much as you can draw on a posters character from what they put on here i have always had a genuine respect for you raglasher. one of the few who never seems to descend into the petty one upmanships o prevelant on here. after reading that post of yours have even mroe respect for you

clevelys - bang on mate[^], it's just the pack mentality brought on by opportunism, a sense of entitlement without any need to earn, pack mentality, mob rule and just generally no self respect or respect for society

these are not politically motivated protests/riots as mcuhas some on here would love them to be as they could then claim it as a damning indictment of the coalition government

it's thatchers fault - lord, give me strength

the equivalent to "buuuut sir, it wasnt me sir" excuses, excuses

guyb Posted on 10/08/2011 18:41
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Great piece here from a Manchester Vicar who got caught up in the nonsense the other night.

"My dog collar may have protected me, but I was left shocked by those who have been taught consumerism is a recreational right"


Link: Salford riots & the greed of the disenfranchised

Holgatewall Posted on 10/08/2011 18:44
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I have tremendous respect for anyone who improves their education ti help find employment.

In this department the government taking away the EMA is a bad move.

However many of the 'disaffected' people are beyond any help and are just happy to wallow in their misery blaming everybody else for mistakes they have made in life.

Society is broken but smashing up buildings and looting is no way to protest.

guyb Posted on 10/08/2011 18:47
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Except this isn't about Protest Holgate - never was.

As i've kept noting to my American chums over here asking me what's going on - "This isn't the Chav Spring - it's a chance for some swag and to take a swing at a weakened and distracted Old Bill"


Link: "This isn't the Chav Spring"

swordtrombonefish Posted on 10/08/2011 18:47
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

OP some decent points but all submerged in excuses. Not all of those who looted shops and performed random or even organised acts of violence were unemployed or 'victims' of society.

No, when the opportunity knocked to cause aggro and maybe score some gear it was grabbed with both hands, mob mentality and greed stepped up to the plate and took over. They are damaging their own as much as they impact the big traders, little shops and businesses and terrifying people into the bargain.

No excuses...at o' nine tails should make a comeback, but in public squares up and down the country so they can have sh!t thrown at them into the bargain.

standards Posted on 10/08/2011 18:48
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

the reason In the back of my mind that I think its not political, is that Police vans in South London were getting bottled before the change in government, and groups of 30-to 40 aka posses, or bmx cycle hoodies, were chasing each other out of their gang zones for the last few years, its all on you tube, its been brewing a long time.

Holgatewall Posted on 10/08/2011 18:55
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I'd like some clarification on the 'inequality' part of this. Who are they trying to be equal to and is their aim in achieving this realistic?

degsyspesh Posted on 10/08/2011 18:57
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

What f'cking inequality? I bet most of those little cnuts now have far better new trainers and electrical gear than I f'cking have!!!

I might go and do some protesting myself to bring a little equality back into my life.

Holgatewall Posted on 10/08/2011 19:01
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Thats my point degsyspesh.Who are they trying to be equal to because in my eyes they are equal to most people I know!

If they are trying to be equal with Beckham or Cheryl Cole or any of the other 'celebs' they adore they are going to be dissappointed.

degsyspesh Posted on 10/08/2011 19:05
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's a lack of discipline and too many rights acquired with zero responsibility that is the problem.

Diddly squat to do with inequality.

subbuteo_171 Posted on 10/08/2011 19:10
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

charlie gilmour is probably a very unhappy man for whatever reason and is an exception to the rule, i have no idea of his background at all, maybe he didn't get the attention he needed as a child as his dad was always away, i have no idea of his personal circumstances and neither do you so why comment

Yet you comment on it when you don't know his background.

Very interesting.

Professor_Yaffle Posted on 10/08/2011 19:15
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

They looted because they realised they could get away with it. If you left your car with the keys in and it was robbed you wouldnt ask why it happened, why are the kids angry etc. You would just think someone took it because they could and therefore did. Once the kids think they will get caught and get say a five year stretch they will stop.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 10/08/2011 19:34
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Young lad on the radio this morning managed to XXXXXX all over your argument before you made it dude.

He said he was nicking stuff, because even though his parents would buy him it, this is an opportunity to get 'free stuff' and 'why miss out?'

He went on to say that the cops arn't arresting enough people to worry him and it'd be his first offence, so he'd only get an asbo. His parents 'might' shout at him, he neither seemed sure or seemed to care.

In short, he could afford it, he wasn't poor, he was doing it because he felt he could.

Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 10/08/2011 20:14
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"It's a lack of discipline and too many rights acquired with zero responsibility that is the problem.

Diddly squat to do with inequality."

[^]

Cleveleyssmoggie Posted on 10/08/2011 20:19
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Charlie is only David's step son.

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 20:23
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Bigger carrot needed along with bigger stick.

stethegadgie Posted on 10/08/2011 20:31
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The origin of this thread is the biggest pot of 5hit I have ever read on this site.. and that's saying something!

Inequality? Unfairness?? This is typical of the pi55y 5hite that liberal fcuking hand-wringers like you just love to spout. These people 'rioting', 'looting' or whatever you want to call them are nothing more than senseless, moronic, ignorant and pi55 lazy scum who think the world owes them a living.

Thatchers fault???? Get a grip you clueless fcucking bell end.

In case you're a 'frustrated' youth considering 'expressing' your frustrations... Go near my sisters shop and i'll put a shotgun to your face and blow your fcuking jaw off. You've been warned.

Hopefully during my 12 months in prison I can do my Masters to my degree.... For free.

Fcuk me, I despair of some of the social d1cksplats in Teesside.

degsyspesh Posted on 10/08/2011 20:33
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Ste - very eloquently put [^]

Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 10/08/2011 20:43
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Haha Ste has it in a nutshell

rivals_oldschool Posted on 10/08/2011 20:47
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's prevalent in these riots that amongst many things that are bubbling over, racial tensions are there and it;s from all quarters.

The media is tip toeing around it the best they can but it's there.

White bloke on the news up north blaming the polish.
I'm seeing plenty of worried Asian community's on the news throughout the country which I find hard to believe are not being targeted and it's'not just from whites.

The bottom line is we have successive Governments continuing to bring in foreign labour, yet the opportunity for our youth across the spectrum is drying up. They smell the bullsh*t and it's created a powder-keg.

susy Posted on 10/08/2011 20:50
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Yes I saw the northern guy blaming polish immigrants for stealing our jobs! He looked stoned, I yelled at the telly " yes cos you are making yourself SO employable arent you!" What an idiot!

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 20:52
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Some good points made here but I have to say that in my view a lot are over thinking it.

It's not a social, political or cultural uprising, it's not down to a lack of education, poverty, lack of opportunity or anything else like that. It's opportunistic. It's borne out of greed and herd mentality.

They need convicting, not educating. They need imprisonment, not support. They need justice, not extra benefits or a shove up the social ladder.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 20:56
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

whislt your there adi, build a prison for all the rich people who thorugh tax evasion cost the country 42 billion last year


its opportunistic and bourne out of greed

crime is only crime if poor people commit it

mwelolo Posted on 10/08/2011 20:58
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Just embarassing and juvenile that people seek to justify this behaviour.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 20:58
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

ste is just another angry boring man, using swear words every sentence to add a certain emotional context


Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 20:59
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

So you think that because I condemn the people rioting that I condone tax evasion?

Strange position to adopt.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 21:01
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

not really, your proposal that states to imprison everyone who commits crimes wouldnt leave anybody outside to run anything, seen as how the vast majority cheat and steal to some extent, including yourself who has probably cheated the tax man or somebody to an extent

how would these 45 million prison cells be paid for adi




rivals_oldschool Posted on 10/08/2011 21:02
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's clearly political, it's a collapse of mainstream politics that for so long hasn't represented the people.

Our immigration policy I think adds to the melting pot.

We successively bring in one wave of migrants, subsequently then abandon many of them onto the scrap heap as industry changes, only to then replace them with the next wave of migration.

09_dave_09 Posted on 10/08/2011 21:03
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Sorry to say that this shows the problems in the UK people acting in this way then other people discussing why or why not they are doing it. The truth is this mindset is so widespread then of course there is going to be a underclass. Until a terminal illness only affects violent law breakers and thiefs, then people in the UK will live along side them.

redisameancolour Posted on 10/08/2011 21:04
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Christ i did'nt realise these "People" causing this mayhem and violence were just poor little boys who did'nt stick in at school ....... christ we should be giving them telly's and computers so they dont have to steal them..... Awwww the poor little mites........



FFS






Scum of the earth........ get the plastic bullets out or should we just let them reign terror among innocent citizens so they can have a few more luxuries..... Bet most of the foookers get as much in benefits as some hard working people [V][V][V][V]

Only_Me Posted on 10/08/2011 21:06
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Excellent posts susy and sword trombony!



"
these 'thugs' or 'louts' etc or whatever is your favourite word you like to describe other people who loot etc and cause grief are people from poor social backgrounds and poor standard of education, "


What a load of rubbish, quite frankly!
It does not cost one penny to teach your kids right from wrong. That's what's missing from these kids lives.

Having kids comes with the responsibility to teach them good behaviour and as I said, that doesn't cost any money at all and at the age most of these rioters are, they should know anyway that what they have done is wrong.

As regards some of them not being educated, well again that's down to themselves mostly, although there are a great many things wrong with education in this country, there is still free education for all under 19's of some description, all they need to do is to apply themselves, which is more than can be said for peoples of other countries who suffer real poverty and who would give their right arms for the opportunities that are thrown the way of some of these poor down trodden rioters. Let them trade places with the little kids in India who are working in sweat shops for bobbins and lets see who really is hard done to.

mwelolo Posted on 10/08/2011 21:07
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's not political, it's opportunism and self indulgent lawlesness.

It is certainly not the collapse of main stream politics politics either, it will soon be over and the media will be focussing on something else all together.

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 21:08
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's not a proposal, it's simply the rule of law. Is your proposal that we should have s system whereby people who commit crimes aren't punished?

I find the suggestion that these people should, instead of being arrested and charged, be educated better absolutely absurd in the extreme.

Your post made the very definite implication that you thought my view was based upon the wealth, or lack of it, of the rioters. Absolute rubbish.

As for your suggestion that I've cheated the tax man, well I find that highly offensive and can state, categorically, that I have never cheated anyone out of anything.

redisameancolour Posted on 10/08/2011 21:10
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It certainly is'nt political......99% of these animals would'nt even know the name of the prime minister and would'nt have a clue what a coalition was....... Opportunist thugs hell bent on causing as much trouble as possible

TheSmogMonster Posted on 10/08/2011 21:12
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I actually don't believe anyone capable of typing it could hold the dudes views on this.

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 21:14
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I know plenty of people that have come from difficult backgrounds but who have made a success of their lives based on good, basic moral values.

I also know people from wealthy backgrounds that have ended up with no moral grounding and live reprehensible lives.

Senor_Chester Posted on 10/08/2011 21:30
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I don't know why anyone rises to Dude, this post, like all his others, is to get a reaction (yet some people are agreeing with it [rle]).

He'll generally only reply when Adi posts as well [?]

redisameancolour Posted on 10/08/2011 21:30
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

He does talk alot of bollix to be fair

Gillandi Posted on 10/08/2011 21:48
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

If it's nothing to do with poverty or inequality why are there no riots in Ascot or Chalfont St Peters?

Only_Me Posted on 10/08/2011 21:50
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Maybe because parents there spend a bit more time explaing right and wrong to their kids?

redisameancolour Posted on 10/08/2011 21:50
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Pathetic reply

redisameancolour Posted on 10/08/2011 21:51
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Only Me [^]

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 21:53
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

There are riots in ascot. Just not being reported. Did you not see the picture of the bloke with a top hat and a massive bag of quinoa?

Gillandi Posted on 10/08/2011 21:55
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Only Me - So why have parents in Tottenham and Toxteth been failing to teach their kids whats right and wrong for 30 years?

TheSmogMonster Posted on 10/08/2011 21:55
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"If it's nothing to do with poverty or inequality why are there no riots in Ascot or Chalfont St Peters?"

Population density.

Why has there been none round here?

Senor_Chester Posted on 10/08/2011 21:57
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"If it's nothing to do with poverty or inequality why are there no riots in Ascot or Chalfont St Peters?"


Perhaps when your working and earning things that people in 'poverty' get for free you have more respect?

outmac Posted on 10/08/2011 21:58
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

because those parents are usually not there
Gilandi to do just that .

atkingson Posted on 10/08/2011 21:59
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The Lower Class will always feel left out...



They should all join the plazmuh club with me and find their very own oasis in the clouds.


Extra G
[:P][:P][^]

Only_Me Posted on 10/08/2011 21:59
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I suggest Gillandi you ask them that and while you are at it, ask them why they have allowed their offspring to be involved in the gang culture thing that seems prevalent in those areas. Why aren't they making sure that their kids are at home on a night - there were reports of kids as young as 7 and 8 ( maybe younger ) being involved. Why? Where were the parents and why aren't they cleaning up the mess that their kids have caused?

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 21:59
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Are people genuinely suggesting there isn't a link between poverty and violence. [:D]

Only_Me Posted on 10/08/2011 22:03
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Sherriff - as I said, good manners and good behaviour cost nothing, not a red cent!

HolgateCorner Posted on 10/08/2011 22:07
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Only Me has touched on the problem behind the riots - a complete lack of moral code.

Only some of that is down to the parents though, kids pick up their behavioural code from their entire environment including school and the country they live in.

We have problems with behavioural code at every level in this country from MP's to police to bankers to tax dodgers to journalists to just about every sector you can think of. Serious problems too.

The rioters are the tip of the iceberg.




Gillandi Posted on 10/08/2011 22:07
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Only_Me - Exactly, those questions have to be asked and many others or there'll be no progress. Trouble is, to ask such questions equates to excusing the rioters to many an the moment in their quest for vengeance. Tories dont want to look that deep, nor does the leader of the opposition. What are they frightened of?

Senor_Chester Posted on 10/08/2011 22:12
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

What do you define as poverty then sheriff?

Do you think half those kids wouldn't be going back to homes with 40" Plasma's and Playstation 3's?

Only_Me Posted on 10/08/2011 22:19
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I'm afraid Gillandi you are right that those questions won't be asked - maybe because to ask them could be construed as being racist by those with other axes to grind.
You are right that we can't progress whilst we ignore the major cause of the trouble which is bad parenting.

HolgateCorner Posted on 10/08/2011 22:23
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

'Tories dont want to look that deep, nor does the leader of the opposition. What are they frightened of?'

Our politicians are struggling.

They are struggling with economic meltdown, a breakdown of law and order, Rupert Murdoch, and a politically split electorate.

I honestly don't think Cameron knows what to do about the country's problems and Ed Milliband is probably glad he's not in power at the present time.





sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 22:27
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Poverty is when you've got no money.

Of course theyve got flash trainers and big tellys. I'd imagine most of them are utter XXXXXXs.

It doesn't chance the fact that if you don't have money, and little chance to get any, you're more likely to be drawn to crime.

I mean that's really really basic stuff. If you have a society where wealth is concentrated in the hands of the few it kicks off. Do a bit of history.

These riots are enabled by the current economic volatility and the advent of social networking sites and mobile technology.

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 22:30
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

HC I think that's one of the biggest troubles we have. Our politicians aren't real people. They are PR people spouting empty buzzwords like robust and progressive.

littlejimmy Posted on 10/08/2011 22:32
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The original grievances people had (rightly or wrongly) have been hijacked by opportunist looters who, poor or not, should know better. They're only damaging the cause of those who may in future want to protest against cuts or whatever, because I have little doubt that the powers that be will use this to their advantage. It has also given too many people an excuse to air their barely-concealed unsavoury views.

God! Posted on 10/08/2011 22:33
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

it's pure greed

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 22:34
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

anybody who thinks people are bad people because they are inherently evil are XXXXXXing idiots

people are evolved organisms who adapt to there surroundings and are victims to the culture and environment that they grow up into, its basic epigeneology

all this other XXXXXX about morals is based on religion and christianity, we are not holy, blessed beings either good or evil, we are a carbon based organism that reacts to the environment that we are brought into

every single one of the posters on this board would be involved in those riots if they lived and experienced the enviroment that these 'rioting scum' have lived in

that is an absolute fact of nature, it has nothing to to with intrinsic altruism, we are chemical organisms, we don't have spirit that tells us what is and isnt the right thing to do, only from the interactions with others do we learn that



HolgateCorner Posted on 10/08/2011 22:35
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

spot on Sheriff, they are more worried about how they look and sound on bbc and sky news than addressing the issues of the country.The media have completely dummed the country down.

And they don't see much wrong in fiddling expenses if the truth were known, a fine example to the rest of society.

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 22:36
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Exactly littlejimmy. This isn't a social uprising, it's opportunistic, greedy scumbags basically getting a few freebies from Currys.

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 22:37
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Well glad you've cleared up the centuries old nature vs nurture debate for us there.

boringblock_21 Posted on 10/08/2011 22:38
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Inequality?! Give me a break.

A lack of respect for other human beings is the only reason for this violence.

Everybody in this country can achieve whatever they want if they have the drive to do so.

Don't feel sorry for these morons who have put peoples lives at risk setting fire to buildings, save your sympathy for the starving in Africa. On that continent, true inequality exists.

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 22:39
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

What if you're thick as XXXXXX though?

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 22:40
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

adi, if you had been born in the same environment that these opportunistic scumbags had been born in, then you would be the same


or are you saying you have magic powers and are somehow different to any other organism in that you just 'know'

the only reason you are the person you are is because of the interactions of others, if you had been born in india youd be starving yourself now you narrow minded doyle

this isn't a question of what is right and wrong, it's human interaction and youths following other youths, like most ape like species act on earth

these kids dont have direction in life, they are not evil or scum

sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 10/08/2011 22:42
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Gay men are blokes who were given barbies as children.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 22:46
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

the fact that english and amercian troops can kill over a million iraq and afghan civilians and nobody really gives a XXXXXX is an example of how peers and the media can affect the masses and how our environment and interactions with it shape our moral structure

make no mistake, what the english and us have done is mass murder for oil, but because we have been brainwashed and dumbed down with all this terroist shyte, we dilute it in our minds, and convince ourselfs its all for the best

british people loot and steal a few tv's and there is hell on, drop a few bombs on brown peoples schools and nobody bats a XXXXXXign eyelid

Senor_Chester Posted on 10/08/2011 22:46
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"if you had been born in the same environment that these opportunistic scumbags had been born in, then you would be the same"

So how come everyone from those environments aren't rioting and looting? In reality it'll only be a very small percentage.

boringblock_21 Posted on 10/08/2011 22:47
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

[Dude] [rle] Tangent and completely irrelevant to the argument.

boro74 Posted on 10/08/2011 22:51
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Sorry, but that OP is a load of XXXXXXe. The reason for the rioting is that some people think they are entitled to luxury without having to work for it. They have a take it mentality.

People are blaming it on government cuts, or no perspectives for the youth in the deprived areas, or the class system in England. None of these explanations are completely wrong. But they are being used to turn the offenders into victims. As if these looters were some kind of social revolutionaries. They're not. They're just common criminals.

The opportunities are there for people to improve their lives if they are prepared to work hard. There are hundreds of thousands of examples of this. These looters just want something for nothing. It's what they're used to. They are used to society keeping them.

Every person is in control of his own destiny and it's his own responsibilty if he takes the opportunites that are there or not.
This lot are just losers who want wealth without work and have seen a short cut to getting there by smashing shop windows and helping themselves to the contents.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 22:59
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

i wouldnt say so, i think there a more variables to the behavior of human beings and our interactions and environment are huge

its isnt on a tangent at all, its others trying to simplify it by calling everyone rioting scum that refuse to deviate and are narrow minded

may i say that you would also be rioting scum if you were born and lived there boringblock

boringblock_21 Posted on 10/08/2011 23:02
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

And may I say I wouldn't. Because the environmental stresses I was exposed to by my parents have made me the person I am, not the place I was born.

Besides, how exactly do you explain Ealing then?

TheBoy007 Posted on 10/08/2011 23:03
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"There are hundreds of thousands of examples of this."

Name 1000.

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 23:06
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Dude, firstly I'm going to respond, then I will tell you what I think.

"all this other XXXXXX about morals is based on religion and christianity, we are not holy, blessed beings either good or evil, we are a carbon based organism that reacts to the environment that we are brought into"

Nothing to do with religion whatsoever. I'm talking about basic morals, the fabric of society. Most people living in the conditions you describe as poverty will have those basic moral standards, regardless of religion. Most will be decent, hard working people.

Those that are rioting don't have those qualities. They are greedy, opportunistic and deserve everything they get. I doubt there's a single motivation. Some will be bored, some will just want free stuff, some will be racist, some will be following the crowd. I doubt any of them are doing it because they're not educated or they're tired of their social standing or lack of employment. Plenty of unemployed people are staying at home looking for jobs.

"adi, if you had been born in the same environment that these opportunistic scumbags had been born in, then you would be the same"

We're all products of a combination of our genes and our environment. That doesn't conflict with what I am saying at all. I wouldn't be the same. This is a very small percentage of the people. Absolute nonsense.

"this isn't a question of what is right and wrong, it's human interaction and youths following other youths, like most ape like species act on earth"

It's very definitely a case of what's right and wrong. Anyone that suggests otherwise is plainly wrong. Is it just youths following other youths or inequality in society then? You seem mixed up.

And now I'm going to tell you what I think:

"the only reason you are the person you are is because of the interactions of others, if you had been born in india youd be starving yourself now you narrow minded doyle"

On almost any thread in which you contribute you end up insulting those of us that disagree with you. I've seen you tell people that they must have learning difficulties, I've seen you insult them, call them stupid and a vast array of other equally intelligent responses.

On this thread you've accused me of tax evasion, called me a narrow minded doyle and just been dismissive.

I'm going to tell you once and for all and put it as simply as I can.

XXXXXX off.

Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 10/08/2011 23:06
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

This has been coming for awhile.

It's the way kids are today. They're molly coddled And have no discipline. They don't want to work for anything in life, they want it all given to them. Is all about instant gratification. If they can't have the things Cheryl Cole or Jordan, or other stupid 'role models' have and they see a chance to take it they will.

When I was at school people aspired to be doctors, nurses, tradesmen, teachers, etc.

Now what do most of them aspire to be? X-Factor contestants, Footballers and WAGs.

boro74 Posted on 10/08/2011 23:07
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"Name 1000".

I don't personally know the names of the hundreds of thousands of honest hard working law abiding citizens that live in London and don't go around destroying other people's property and stealing their goods.

Space_Face Posted on 10/08/2011 23:11
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Nicely put Adi [^]

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 23:12
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

[:D]i only insult you adi, because your a dickhead

i debate with others

boro74 Posted on 10/08/2011 23:12
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Thankyou for ignoring my post Dude. It kind of indicates that you think I'm right.

But then again, at least you got your ton Which was probably the entire point of that provocative bullXXXXXX.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 23:14
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

except that i didnt ignore your post, and i have no interest in how many replies i get

what a ridiculous assertion

HolgateCorner Posted on 10/08/2011 23:15
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

pog - its because the media have dressed up x factor, footballers and wags as the route to easy money.

They don't highlight that for every x factor finalist there were thousands shown the door or for every prem player who makes it there are thousands who don't.

Plus you are not allowed to be ordinary these days, if you are on average wage in an average house with an average lifestyle, in the media you have failed, no you've failed big time.

kids live in a funny world these days.

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 23:15
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

You didn't accuse me of having learning difficulties Dude, that was another poster.

If you think I'm a dickhead I can only be pleased with that, it means I'm on the right track.

boro74 Posted on 10/08/2011 23:16
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Did you used to be called onthemap?

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 23:17
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

if only the kids had all been brought up like adi dem

mr perfect

imagine the world with 7 billion adi dems



mcbrid Posted on 10/08/2011 23:20
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

This always happens after a Labour Government has XXXXXXed things up and allowed people to live high on the hog without having to work for it.

13 years of the nanny state and euro human rights laws making them feel untouchable.

Certain people do it when they think they can get away with it - simples

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 23:20
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I'm not perfect Dude, never claimed otherwise but I am a good and decent person.

He isn't onthemap, he debated reasonably and was articulate.

TheBoy007 Posted on 10/08/2011 23:30
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Isn't it strange that the only time we have riots on this scale is when the Tories are implementing slash and burn economics? Monetarism doesn't work, Thatcher proved that.

Adi_Dem Posted on 10/08/2011 23:33
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Plenty of riots under labour governments too.

gravyboat Posted on 10/08/2011 23:43
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I agree almost entirely with dudes post of 22.34. The idea of an inherent 'evilness' as an answer to why a human is capable of comitting crime is one that can only be arrived at by simpletons. That said, those that are capable of truly horrific acts clearly do, in certain cases, suffer from some sort of chemical imbalance within that delicate brain of ours, as apposed to it always being a result of environmental factors.

Anyway, bit off topic that. Carry on.

the_dude_abides Posted on 10/08/2011 23:54
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

adi

how can you possibly say that if you were subjected to the same enviroment, social interactions and peer pressures that you wouldn't be exactly the same as them(the scum)as you call them

a 'moral' isn't a magical, nebulous spirit your embued with because your more special than anybody else and have blessed genes

its a mathematical rule you create snyaptically through interactions with your environment

i'm very interested in the explanation as to how you differ chemically from the 'scum' that is being refered to in the riots


degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 00:08
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

People are trying to over analyse and make far too much out of these riots...

London has a population of about 7.5M, of which about 1M are in the typical rioters age range of 15-25.

Of those 1M, how many come from disadvantaged areas and suffer inequality? - as a guess lets say 250,000. How many rioters have been on the streets - as a guess lets say 2500.

So basically, if the above figures are right, only 1% of those from disadvantaged areas and suffering from "inequality" were involved in the rioting.

So why did the 1% riot when the other 99% managed not too despite suffering the same "inequality" - simple, because the 1% are little chunts. Kick their f'cking ar5es and sen them home.

chimpy07 Posted on 11/08/2011 03:27
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

There's a strange sort of irony in all this, lots of excellent views, points, beliefs. So many conflicting, but no obvious outstanding.

If it was possible to identifying every last contributing factor forming this problem, would there be a definate solution?? Or just a much larger divide in opinion.

Ilsan_Boro Posted on 11/08/2011 06:06
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

In Britain we always seem to want there to be ONE solitary reason that we can conveniently point to for this kind of stuff. I think it rarely, if ever, is as simple as that.

On one side some folk are saying that the carrot is the problem, in that lots of young people don't have any prospects of making much of their lives, and on the other side some are saying that the problem is the stick - we let them get away with too much.

I actually think it's a bit - or even quite a lot - of both. It seems to me that there's an ever increasing number of kids who just don't give a toss because they don't see that they have anything to lose by just doing whatever the feck they want. Yes, it's a small minority, but it's still big enough to matter.

On the one hand, they don't see any legitimate opportunities worth pursuing in life. That's NOT to say that those opportunities don't exist. I think sometimes (but not always) they do indeed exist. But the point is these kids don't see and/or don't want those opportunities. Whether it's their fault for being too stupid/lazy/useless/whatever to look for them, or someone else's fault for not making them better aware of the opportunities and making them sufficiently attractive isn't the point either. Bottom line is they don't care enough to take any interest in what society offers them and don't think it's anything they should worry about losing.

All that said, I think the stick is failing just as much as the carrot. Because another clear reason why these kids don't give a toss is that they simply don't fear either getting caught or what will happen to them if they do. Maybe they're too thick, too uninformed or too stoned to realise the consequences. Or maybe we, the state, are too soft. Again, I suspect it's a bit of both but the exact proportion isn't really the point. The point is that, whoever's fault it is, these kinds of kids are largely out of control.

I think many of the reasons go back several decades. Over the past few decades, various government policies, although perhaps well-intentioned, have had the effect of creating lawless sink estates where the police sometimes daren't/won't go and lawless sink schools that hardly anybody either wants to teach in or send their kids to. As a society, we could get away with having these piles of crap down at the bottom IF we could keep them under control. And in the past, the volatile hordes at the bottom could be kept under control, or least prevented from bothering too many other people. But we can't control it any more - the "behave/do as yer told or else" approach just doesn't work like it used to.

The reasons being complex and stretching back over quite a long time means, I'm afraid, it's the same for the answers - lots of things need to be tackled and looked at over a long time - unfortunately, a longer time than any government is likely to be in power for, which in turn perhaps decreases the likelihood of getting it right.[sad]

Kevlar Posted on 11/08/2011 06:37
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Chimpy - Exactly.

Everyone who has put an opinion forward, has it part right.

This isn't a protest, it is a wave of opportunist, criminality. The people propogating this crime, come from communities, long since forgotten, with little options, discipline or hope. They wouldn't know how to protest, and the actions they are taking are bringing the same response, though with less public support, obviously.

Now, that doesn't mean it is an excuse to turn to banditry. Many people put forward themselves, or people they know who escaped poverty to become respectable citizens. This is great, and I have no doubt that these communities have the same stories. But this isn't about the people who had the determination to escape, this is about those left behind.

Growing up in places with high unemployment, a lack of role models, disruptive classes, surrounded by criminals, stopped and searched regularly by the police and labelled 'scum' and 'chav' by the rest of society. This is their beginning, what is the course of a young, angry, teenage male, to be? It's difficult enough staying out of trouble as a teenager with a comfortable homelife, with out these age old, cultural burdens, weighing heavily on young shoulders.

Before any of you accuse me of being a bleeding heart liberal, or a loopy lefty, or whatever infantile stupidity you wish to spout, I agree that this immediate problem needs to be dealt with. Extra police, examples made of ringleaders, claim back the streets. But what then?

Without follow up action, this problem will happen again, when the next stop and search goes wrong, or there is a midnight raid on the wrong house, or wherever the tectonic plates of police and minority scrape too close for comfort. In my opinion, once the streets are reclaimed, there needs to be significant communication with these communities, and other areas of the country with the same negative numbers of unemployment, low education standards for school leavers and high crime rates. People of standing in these communities, spokespeople, should be asked questions, and allowed to ask their own. Find a way to help them rebuild, plan and to give their dissatisfied youth options, whilst trying to have entire communities, instill discipline on their people, and to take responsibility for them and their actions.

Someone further up said Bigger carrot, bigger stick.

The only way to guarantee that the night isn't taken by angry mobs with nothing to lose, is to give them something to lose.

Timboi Posted on 11/08/2011 07:17
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

there's a definite difference between what happened in Tottenham and then what proceeded it across the country.

Tottenham has social issues and there's been tension there for some time - and there are similar tensions in other parts of the country.

But the sporadic looting is simply due to little scrotes thinking they can do what they like and get away with it. there is no consequences for a lot of young scrotes these days so they don't mae a connection between actions and cosequences.

More worrying though is a trend towards people not having any empathy towards anyone else - a kind of systematic sociopathy if you like - that is a big problem.

First thing that needs to be done is establish that anti-social behaviour will result in unwanted consequences. After that then the deeper societal issues need to be addressed.

boro74 Posted on 11/08/2011 07:30
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"So why did the 1% riot when the other 99% managed not too despite suffering the same "inequality" - simple, because the 1% are little chunts. Kick their f'cking ar5es and sen them home."

Post of the day. Well said Degsy.


Adi_Dem Posted on 11/08/2011 07:32
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's simple Dude. If you were right then everyone from those areas would be rioting. As degsy says it's actually a small minority.

Oh, and I didn't call them scum.

degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 08:08
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

How anyone can try and attribute the cause of the rioting to social factors when the percentage of those people subject to those factors that are rioting is statistically negligble is beyond me.

That's not to say that there isn't inequality in society, clearly there is but to blame this for the current problems is just a contrived, predictable and cheap attempt to try and back up some peoples political views.

Kevlar Posted on 11/08/2011 08:13
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The problem is Degsy, society is a complicated beast.

You can't just look at this as goodies and baddies, cowboys and indians or cops and robbers.

If we do that, and just lock them all up(or castrate them, or kill all of the first borns), without tackling the root of the problem, it will just return later.

Picture, in your mind, the weedkiller adverts. Your plan is a little like 'the other brand', that they show first. [smi]

Adi_Dem Posted on 11/08/2011 08:21
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Some excellent posts here.

I don't think anyone believes it is that simple kevlar. Certainly I don't.

One point for me, as I said above, is that I very much doubt there is a singular 'root cause' and so it isn't simply a case of saying that social inequality caused all of this and so let's better educate the people.

degsy's point is an important one. This is a small minority of people. The rest of the people in those communities, or that vast majority at least, are disgusted by it. They are in the same social environment.

No-one is saying, as Dude seems to believe, that there isn't social inequality or that there aren't social problems that need tackling. Of course there are and they are both deep and numerous.

What is being said is that these riots aren't, in my opinion, a symptom of that social inequality. This is no social uprising in my view. The people involved have simply seen an opportunity. They deserve punishment.

degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 08:36
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Kevlar - I'm well aware that society is a massively complex issue with many different problems in many different areas. My point is that the riots have absolutely nothing to to with society (other than through a lack of discipline and moral responsibility) - these are not political protests nor are they some form of social uprising. They are a load of little scrotes that represent an insignificant proportion of their communities that are basically taking the pi55 and nicking a load of gear because they know that they can get away with it.

To try and liken what is happening now to the riots of the early 80's which were fuelled by genuine social problems merely cheapens the cause of what happened back then and the progress that has been made since.

gravyboat Posted on 11/08/2011 08:54
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's some statement to suggest these riots have 'nothing to do with society'.

Really? Nothing whatsoever?

degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 09:37
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

gravy - read the next ten words in brackets.

TheBoy007 Posted on 11/08/2011 09:55
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Some top posts there lads. I like the analogy of a bigger stick to deal with the immediate problem and a bigger carrot to stop it happening again and deal with the root causes. Good stuff[^]

robbso Posted on 11/08/2011 10:23
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I think the amazing thing on here,is the debate going into the reasons the minority of the population riot etc,especialy this being a message board populated by football fans.

Havn"t football fans been tarnished over the years due to the actions of the moronic minority who are better known as football hooligans.

Why did/do they act as they do spoiling it for everyone else.

It is only less common now because of increased,tougher laws,surveillance etc.

BoroAl Posted on 11/08/2011 10:43
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I could'nt be arsed reading all this,but explain to me the Reasons they are robbing,vandalising,settling grudges,causing fires,rioting in SHOPPING CENTRES,burning shops,other peoples cars and houses.Which if it happened to them would say ,Oh it's all right it's only some disadvantaged youths standing up for their rights.
And it's not only chavs,dolies,junkies etc.There was teacher,a millionaires daughter etc.
It's fun,said those 2 16 yr olds from Chiswick(?)
How many of them are old enough to vote,so therefore have the right to protest.(see above)

chimpy07 Posted on 11/08/2011 10:50
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Did anyone see the clip on the news yesterday, some women arguing with a bloke about the rioting, she started with
"so you think its ok for the police to just shot somebody in the street"
he countered with "this has nothing to do with the death of the man in tottenham" it went on, ending with her telling him his ignorant ways make him just as resopnsible, telling him to "jog on"

The more I think back to that clip the more I think, she actually makes a good, valid point. Although her attitude stinks, her views seem ridiculous and she leaves you with the feeling she thrives on confrontation.

Its only when I stop myself and ask, what exactly gives me the right to pass judgement on her, other than my overwhelming feeling of self importance as a higher ranking member of society.

Culpable ignorance backed by arrogance. On every level imaginable.

BoroAl Posted on 11/08/2011 10:52
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Does it have anything to do with the killing in Tottingam?
If so please explain what.

degsyspesh Posted on 11/08/2011 11:17
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"Does it have anything to do with the killing in Tottingam?"

I think it started with a few people who felt they had a genuine grievance about what happened in Tottenham (you know, that outragous incident where police shot a wholly innocent man just because he was carrying a loaded firearm.....[|)]) and then everyone else thought that it looked like good fun and was a good way to get free trainers and electrical gear.

TheBoy007 Posted on 11/08/2011 11:42
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The spark is now irrelevant, the question now is, what type of society fosters a underclass of youngsters capable of committing these crimes on a mass scale and how do we put it right?

Kevlar Posted on 11/08/2011 11:59
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Theboy - Exactly right.

Many people want to treat these rioters like an invading enemy. They are not, they are English citizens, behaving like barbarians.

The government(s) created this mess with years of mismanagement. Time for them to sort it out.

Holgatewall Posted on 11/08/2011 12:01
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

And that's my reason for not wanting to see the miitary on the streets.

bryan_munich Posted on 11/08/2011 12:07
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

The government(s) created this mess with years of mismanagement. Time for them to sort it out.
_________
But the politicos have got bigger fish to fry like putting Tarquin and Jemima through school and managing their property and share investment portfolios. These morally bankrupt c*nts can't be trusted and moreover cannot relate to the lower orders.

09_dave_09 Posted on 11/08/2011 12:07
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Because they are not very good at keeping the peace, "bloody sunday". Also not like the job they have done in Iraq or Afagan has made the population love them.

superstu Posted on 11/08/2011 20:39
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

stethegadgie Posted on 10/08/2011 20:31

"...nothing more than senseless, moronic, ignorant..."

"...i'll put a shotgun to your face and blow your fcuking jaw off..."

What an absolute treat you are. If the people threatening to shoot other human beings faces off AREN'T the senseless, ignorant morons then we are in deep trouble.

Bill_Leather Posted on 11/08/2011 22:01
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Degsy - 'My point is that the riots have absolutely nothing to to with society (other than through a lack of discipline and moral responsibility)'

Great example of having your cake and eating it, there Degsy. Thanks!

Nothing to do with society. What does that mean? One way of thinking about this concerns an over-attchment to consumption ie the primacy given to consuming things by SOCIETY. Hence the looting. Wouldn't have happened when society was more sacred or spiritual would it - ooh, let's go and rob the church candles or the blood of Christ....

Probably lots of many and varied reasons why people 'chose' to get involved but to say it had nothing to do with society is nonsensical. Everything people do is - in some way or another - related to the society they are born into. Lack of discipline? Err related to circumstances of upbringing in society. Lack of moral responsibility - OK, but where does that come from. It's society innit...


HolgateCorner Posted on 11/08/2011 23:11
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

of course its everything to do with society Bill Leather.

It's a covenient way of sweeping the hard truth under the carpet by simply saying the solution is to drive these louts off the street, give them a sentence and make them behave.

br14 Posted on 12/08/2011 00:58
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

And what is the alternative?

The implication of your comments is that the riots happened because people were living in poverty and have no opportunities.

And yet during the rioting many were wearing the latest designer gear. Benefits have never been higher. Cuts haven't really hit benefits so far.

If the riots happened in Middlesbrough or Sunderland you could blame the lack of opportunities.

But surely not in London. One web site alone has over 6500 vacancies. Plenty of work for those that want it. And there seem to be a fair few training programs available.

So what else is the cause?

HolgateCorner Posted on 12/08/2011 07:15
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

I personally don't think the riots have anything to do with poverty or inequality and have never said they were.

I think they are a result of the break down of the behavioural code at all levels in society.

moxxey Posted on 12/08/2011 07:21
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"Inequality?! Give me a break."

And there are far more poor people condemning the looting and rioting than taking part! Most people, generally speaking, are decent, however much they earn. In fact, as we know from the North East, some of the nicest and genuine people are those without ridiculous amounts of money. There weren't any riots in the North East!

The biggest worry for society is that 50% of he looters were under 18. There's NO reason for these kids to be rioting. It's crazy. At 11, 12, 13 they are just starting secondary school! They don't need to worry about money, work or similar issues.

Also, you'll notice that no attacks were made in West London, it was all on their home turf. That in itself tells you they have no respect for themselves, never mind inequality. If it was about inequality, they'd be rioting on Bond Street or Richmond.


Hurworth Posted on 12/08/2011 08:20
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Every child in this country is given the chance of an education, free of charge and free from race, creed or religion. We are all the same.

Some chose to make the most of this opportunity, rise from their background and succeed greater than their parents, which is generally viewed as the goal of all caring parents.

Others chose to do things differently and expect to be cared for from cradle to grave without ever contributing to the system which provides their welfare.

It's a clear cut choice. Accept the educational opportunities available to a better life, or don't, but please don't bleat about not being equal.

Education is the key to the social and economic problems of the UK today.

DowningAlbion Posted on 12/08/2011 08:48
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

When there is no social mobility you cannot expect those at the bottom to continually support the status quo when they have nothing to gain.

Social Justice was abandoned under Thatch but until then it was an important principle in getting a consensus of support for an 'unequal' society.

bryan_munich Posted on 12/08/2011 08:55
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

It's a clear cut choice. Accept the educational opportunities available to a better life, or don't, but please don't bleat about not being equal.
________
I would imagine the Bullingdon Buffoons have access to a better education and career choices than most of us.

Back in the ordinary world, it may be easier for some kids to succeed academically than others if they are at the 'right' school (hence the clamour over parental choice in the state system) and have a more conducive home life.

Hurworth Posted on 12/08/2011 09:00
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

Parenting and education are the key. Some take the responsibility associated with both, others don't and become forgotten, but there is a choice.

Fearless_Fish Posted on 12/08/2011 10:53
Inequality in society is the real reason for rioting

"Parenting and education are the key. Some take the responsibility associated with both, others don't and become forgotten, but there is a choice"

Not for the kid.