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Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 29/03/2008 00:09
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

1.Dinosaurs ruled our planet over 75 million years ago was he the Dinosaurs God as well ?.
2.Evolution has been proved to the point that an half Ape half Human skull has been found (where does that leave the Adam & Eve theory)?.
3.We as Humans have only discovered a few planets either side of our earth , the universe probably goes on forever so theres no doubt that theres other planets in the universe with life on them (so is our God the ruler and maker of those planets as well or just ours)?.
4.The Dinosaurs ruled this planet we call earth FACT long before we did and if God was the Dinosaurs God as well why did he kill them off in a very inhumane way making them suffer a horrible and painful death.
5.Also all the different the Gods that are worshiped around the world today do make it look pretty farcical as surely they can only be one god (silly myths that have been passed on over generations and silly different religions)?.
6.At the end of the day Dinosaurs the universe and Evolution are facts that can be proven , but when will anybody ever come up with anything the can even slighty prove that a god exists ?.
I think people like to have faith to help them through life and help them cope and feel better but if you look at the facts it is highly unlikely that a God does exist but each to they own i suppose.


You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 29/03/2008 00:23
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Your argument refutes Creationism NOT the existence of a God, although I do not believe in either.

acklam_lad Posted on 29/03/2008 00:37
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

and if the adam and eve theory is true and they had kids then surely for there kids to have kids is incest!!!

boroproud Posted on 29/03/2008 00:40
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"and if the adam and eve theory is true and they had kids then surely for there kids to have kids is incest!!!"


Even more stranger than that,Adam and Eve had 2 sons.
So where the fook did the rest of us come from?

br14 Posted on 29/03/2008 00:45
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 - I think you must be right.

You're a living example of one of the prior states of human development.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 29/03/2008 00:53
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Even more stranger than that,Adam and Eve had 2 sons.
So where the fook did the rest of us come from?"

Actually they had three sons; Cain, Abel and Seth, and two daughters Awun (who married Cain) and Azura (who married Seth). These are the only children that are mentioned.

boroproud Posted on 29/03/2008 00:55
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Shows how much interest i take in it all!

br14 Posted on 29/03/2008 00:57
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Actually, who knows how many they had. I thought I remembered this from somewhere...

"4: And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: ****** and he begat sons and daughters: ******"

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 29/03/2008 01:01
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Who are the only children of Adam and Eve that have been mentioned?

AfonsoAlvesAnonymous Posted on 29/03/2008 01:03
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

So Cain got a bit of Awun, Seth got a bit of Azura, what did Abel do? Poor B******! He must have been the loneliest man on Earth

br14 Posted on 29/03/2008 01:04
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

So if they're not mentioned by name they can't exist.

Fair enough.

boroproud Posted on 29/03/2008 01:04
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Aye im sure Adam will have knocked a few more out.I wonder if the CSA ever caught up with him.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 29/03/2008 01:06
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"So Cain got a bit of Awun, Seth got a bit of Azura, what did Abel do? Poor B******! He must have been the loneliest man on Earth"

Abel was killed by his brother Cain.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 29/03/2008 01:08
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"So if they're not mentioned by name they can't exist.

Fair enough."

Who said that? As I have previously noted the ones that have been mentioned it is implied that Adam had far, far more children in his rather preposterous 930 year life span.

AfonsoAlvesAnonymous Posted on 29/03/2008 01:08
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Seriously though my opinion of religion is believe none, respect all. If someone gets strength from their faith and if it helps them through hard times then fair enough. If someone knocks on my door and tries to preach to me then they will get some awkward questions followed by the door being closed in their face!

Some_Strange_Gadgie Posted on 29/03/2008 01:10
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

It all sounds like an episode of Brookside.

Esekiel1517 Posted on 29/03/2008 01:11
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Why have you all gone God mad anyway?

AfonsoAlvesAnonymous Posted on 29/03/2008 01:12
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I felt sorry for Abel for being lonely, bit of a bugger. Turns out he was murdered by his own brother - ouch, good job this happened before God told Moses the 10 Commandments!

Esekiel1517 Posted on 29/03/2008 01:14
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

And that is a valid excuse is it?

boroproud Posted on 29/03/2008 01:23
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

According to the WWE,The Undertaker is Cain's brother.

So who is telling the truth?

The Bible (who only Newcastle United last trophy winning team were around when it was wrote)or

The WWE (who we can all watch and listen to)?

You decide.

Gillandi Posted on 29/03/2008 01:42
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Was the big bang a controlled explosion or did our god and his log-book perish in the blast, making orphans of the lot of us? The Bible reads to me like the kind of tough love foster care we'd need to make sense of the world after a tragedy like that. So I say he did exist but doesn't anymore. It was a chemistry set too far and he had to go meet HIS maker. Who I happen to have a hot-line too if anyone cares to join my cult.








king_hellfire Posted on 29/03/2008 01:53
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I'll join Gillandi, so long as you don't copy the Heavens Gate lot by wearing Nike trainers, i prefer Adidas.

Gillandi Posted on 29/03/2008 02:07
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Samba it is then for my devoted foot soldiers. Served me well for 20 years pounding the sports halls of Teesside so they'll do nicely on the march to enlightenment and an eventual mass suicide in Hambleton, North Yorkshire. Their first for many years.

king_hellfire Posted on 29/03/2008 02:15
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

North Yorkshire, you say?

I live in South Yorkshire, will i get travel expenses?

I'm not willing to be part of a mass ritual suicide cult, if i'm not going to get travel expenses.

AfonsoAlvesAnonymous Posted on 29/03/2008 02:23
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Science

Gillandi Posted on 29/03/2008 02:44
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You couldn't wish for a more democratic supreme leader than me Hellfire. All out of pocket expenses will be covered, under-written by Gods dad but they wont include Petch's pork pies or Suggetts ice-cream from nearby Great Ayton, if Hambleton is the scene of the final showdown. If you have any suggestions for a remote locale with a good echo for her majesty's land armies then lets hear em.

I must say, my first attempts at religious brain-washing are turning out to be bloody hard work.

Esekiel1517 Posted on 29/03/2008 02:53
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I doubt hard work would have even entered your thinking,being a daddies boy and all..

BobUpndown Posted on 29/03/2008 09:23
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

your getting confused that God & Religion have anything to do with each other.. points:1, 2 & 5

evolotion isn't a fact.. it's a theory.. a theory that scientists try and question again & again & again.. just to ensure the theory & evidence are accurate.. creationists just dismiss it out of hand [;)]

God will continue to evolve, in religious terms, as science improves.. as you say just look at how many forms of god people have worshiped over the centuries..

number9 Posted on 29/03/2008 09:31
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

why do people who believe in Evolution or don't believe in god feel the need to start threads like this every other day?

Is it perhaps a case of a fragile belief that they think attacking other beliefs give further credence to there own?

That said I am now bored with this thype of thread.

blackandwhitedreams Posted on 29/03/2008 09:34
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

What makes anyone think that 'God' is a 'he' ??

Duncan_Blackheart Posted on 29/03/2008 09:50
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

God is a gas. Fact.

Und er ist auch tot.

xxlshirts_fit_all Posted on 29/03/2008 09:54
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

i think evolution is a FACT, its the paths that evolution has taken that is a theory! ie did we evolve from this monkey or that ape

there are examples of evolution in living memory, spme salamanders in isolated pools have evolved during recent history

mm40 Posted on 29/03/2008 09:55
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

so what you are saying is the universe and all creation just turned up one day and then we all evolved into human being, why have we stopped evoluving then? is there a particular cut off point? to believe what we see every day, the planets, the solar system, life etc has evolved is harder to believe than it may well have been created.

boroproud Posted on 29/03/2008 10:00
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Never mind all that.


Think about poor Adam when Eve had the painters in,he could hardly say" fook this,im off down the pub with the lads" could he?

GGGG Posted on 29/03/2008 10:14
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

7. He cant exist as he made a species called the Geordies no one would be that cruel.

benpoolie Posted on 29/03/2008 10:23
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

no9, you never did answer my questions about the whole JW/UN thing....seriously, what do you make of it?

also all these changes in thoughts that are surfacing? kinda makes doing the Revelation book a bit pointless eh?! [;)]

number9 Posted on 29/03/2008 10:31
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

benpoolie

if you are what you say you are then you know my answers. As for the UN well it's fate will be the same as the league.

benpoolie Posted on 29/03/2008 10:38
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

fair do's

but for the WTB+TS to ally itself with the disgusting thing puts em in the same bracket as Babylon the Great yes?

benpoolie Posted on 29/03/2008 10:45
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

balls to it

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 29/03/2008 10:51
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

So just about everybody agrees then it is impossible for him to exist.
Think i will send this thread to the Church and ask them all to just pack everything in.

benpoolie Posted on 29/03/2008 10:55
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I don't know if I think it's impossible for him to exist, at the moment I really don't know what I believe in...but, I got an open mind now - which I've never had previously.

The brain washing has told me that evolution is absurd, it may well be!- to me blind faith is absurd.

number9 Posted on 29/03/2008 11:28
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

benpoolie

the answer to your question.

(Psalm 146:3, 4)

mickymacc Posted on 29/03/2008 11:35
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"from genesis,to revelation,the next generation
hear me,duda duda duda duda duda .

TheSmogMonster Posted on 29/03/2008 11:42
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"so what you are saying is the universe and all creation just turned up one day and then we all evolved into human being, why have we stopped evoluving then?"

Have we though?

When your frame of reference is only a few thousand years without proper records either, not easy to tell. We're taller & our jawbones are shinking, even in countries with bad healthcare systems.

In a thousand years, we'll be able to see the pace of it properly.

number9 Posted on 29/03/2008 11:45
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Good morning Smog..

Hate to be picky... but

"In a thousand years, we'll be able to see the pace of it properly."

You my friend will see nowt if evolution is correct.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 29/03/2008 14:01
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Go on explain that.. I'm interested.

You must have some huge misconceptions of what evolution is if you believe that.

Even creationist 'scientists' struggle to argue this one, that minor changes are common amongst populations. For instance, insects developing resistance to pesticides, bacteria developing resistance to anti-biotics etc. The length of Human generations plus the current globalised world make it difficult to observe in people.

In a thousand years, we'll have been looking.

benpoolie Posted on 29/03/2008 14:44
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

so no9, you're saying by 'not putting trust in nobles' that the UN have lied over this?

I'm afraid the evidence is stacked the other way, someone HAS lied and sadly I know who...

Senor_Chester Posted on 29/03/2008 15:26
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I think anyone with half a brain could work out that he probably didn't exist but a lot of people get more than that out of going to church and at the end of the day theres nothing really wrong with them believing it.

For the people at the top however it's probably about money. When I was in America I flicked onto some Christian channel and couldn't believe the size of one of the churches in Texas:





Link: Phwoar...

ThePrisoner Posted on 29/03/2008 15:40
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"For the people at the top however it's probably about money. When I was in America I flicked onto some Christian channel and couldn't believe the size of one of the churches in Texas:"

Biggest mental asylum I've ever seen!

TheSmogMonster Posted on 29/03/2008 15:41
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Arn't alot of the bigger evangelical preachers over there under investigation for fraud?

king_hellfire Posted on 29/03/2008 15:44
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

'at the end of the day theres nothing really wrong with them believing it.'


There are various problems that arise from believing in God, here's just one of them...



Link: ....

number9 Posted on 29/03/2008 16:01
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

smogg...

nah can't be bothered.

have a nice day its raining here

HolgateEnd Posted on 29/03/2008 16:07
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Actually they had three sons; Cain, Abel and Seth, and two daughters Awun (who married Cain) and Azura (who married Seth). These are the only children that are mentioned."

Who was the vicar who married the brothers and sisters? He must have been one sick pervert.

wokingmassive Posted on 29/03/2008 16:13
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I learned all about the bible from watching the movie 'The Omen' so I am a bit of an expert on this subject.

number9 Posted on 29/03/2008 16:24
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

benpoolie


Whilst I appreciate your concern for my spiritual welfare I have said to others on the board I will not get into theological discussions on the board, too easy to hide what you are.

And (Psalm 146:3, 4) was in response to your post

“I don't know if I think it's impossible for him to exist, at the moment I really don't know what I believe in...but, I got an open mind now - which I've never had previously.

The brain washing has told me that evolution is absurd, it may well be!- to me blind faith is absurd."

wokingmassive Posted on 29/03/2008 17:04
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I filled out my organ donation card today.

Read that lots of religious people dont want to donate their organs when they die - they came into the world whole - and they want to go to heaven whole - all that sh*t.

Ultimatly this means they are, by their inaction, causing unnecessary death and suffering.

Good old religion eh?

Not really helping humanity - more of a hinderance really.

The only religion that the world needs - is kindness.

True story.



number9 Posted on 29/03/2008 18:47
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

bit of a sweeping statement that don't you think?

I believe in God, practicing JW (well only sort to be honest as if not practicing you are by deffinition not one).

You can do waht you like with my bits when i'm dead. only stippulation would be G Best types can't have my liver.

king_hellfire Posted on 29/03/2008 19:11
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

number9, would you deny your dying child a blood transfusion even if it would save his/her life?

SplendidStuff Posted on 29/03/2008 19:32
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

This old chestnut again.

Before jesus was supposed to of existed there were many sons of god born of virgins, and sought by 3 kings..



Its all astrology related if you want to do the research.

neilg Posted on 29/03/2008 19:36
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

if god created man in his own image - he didnt leave me much to the imagination. xxx

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 30/03/2008 20:59
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

This shroud of Turin crap on the tele proves it even more that God And Jesus never did excist , although a fellow called Jesus did excist and was a crackpot why do people believe in all this crap its a same if you ask me but each to they own i suppose.

Muttley Posted on 30/03/2008 21:10
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"why do people believe in all this crap its a same if you ask me but each to they own i suppose."

Why is it important to you whether they do or not?

Oh and it's spelt exist - no "c" do you see? Retin.

bic_biro_eye Posted on 30/03/2008 21:11
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

god is dog backwards

respect all dogs, coz if you dont they will bite you on the arse

bear66 Posted on 30/03/2008 22:05
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I exist, therefore God does

king_hellfire Posted on 30/03/2008 23:05
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Are you claiming to be God, bear66?

BoroInLondon Posted on 30/03/2008 23:58
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

There will come a time when religion is reduced to mere social and charity work, and it isn't even great at that.

I honestly can't see how any intelligent, educated person - after studying the facts and actually questioning it all - can still believe in God.

I'm often asked by religious folk why i am an atheist. The answer is simple - we are all atheists, i just believe in one less God than them.

bear66 Posted on 31/03/2008 00:00
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Are you claiming to be God, bear66?"

Err . no . . . sorry if I gave that impression ; God came to earth once before but most people ignored Him; those that didn't crucified Him

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 31/03/2008 00:17
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Muttley i started this thread spelling exist correctly and i do not really care what people believe that much but like Boroinlondon has said it does irritate me why people and religion cause so much trouble in the world when any half decent educated human should look at the facts and understand that a god almighty just can not exist full stop i think its sad to be honest that half of the worlds population believe in such crap.

LeitrimBoro Posted on 31/03/2008 01:12
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I believe in God. I have that faith.
I don`t have to prove anything about my belief.
I do not start a thread about "reasons why God can not exist" yet you do??? Curious ???

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 31/03/2008 01:33
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Good luck you silly person.

LeitrimBoro Posted on 31/03/2008 01:35
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Silly" ????
Bless her. Name calling now???

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 01:36
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"I'm often asked by religious folk why i am an atheist. The answer is simple - we are all atheists, i just believe in one less God than them."

i'm often asked if i can lift a quote from someone far more intelligent than me that proves to my mind that something is fact or fiction without having to do the thinking bit for myself

i generally tend to approach those sources that i know agree with me

funny that...

wokingmassive Posted on 31/03/2008 09:07
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

The catholic church aided the escaping of Nazi's at the end of World war 2.

Isn't religion great?

Helping Nazi's - it just doesn't get better than that. You'd be daft not to sign up really wouldn't you?

The only religion the world needs is kindness.

True story.

mm40 Posted on 31/03/2008 09:22
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

gibson just by having an opinion does not make you right, why not leave people be who have faith in God.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 31/03/2008 09:30
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

mm40 why don't religious folk leave us atheists alone?

This week I've had JW's at my door, been hassled by a street preacher, and as a new one to me, been told by a Buddhist that "Why don't you meditate? - I do shoalin me" (true story - never had that one before - told him that it wasn't a very Buddhist thing to say).

I was 'brought up' a catholic and that was really just a bunch of people attempting to transfer their belief system onto me when I was just a kid.

I know its some peoples culture but seriously, no one is actively walking around trying to convert you to atheism.

number9 Posted on 31/03/2008 09:56
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Just a couple of points....

Smoggy hope you were polite?

Gibson said

"why people and religion cause so much trouble in the world when any "

Can't deny that but between them Stalin, Mao & Hitler (all athiests to varying degress) managed to murder up to 100,000,000 in less than 50 yrs not a bad effort?

king_hellfire

good question one i won't have to deal with as i don't have children. As for me, whether I do or don't is none of your business. But remember this that the next time you go into hospital for an op (hope it is never) your chances of recovery will be better without a transfusion of blood. And if they use a blood salvage machine during the op the chances are that it was donated to the hospital by Jehovah's Witnesses. if you want to know the reason we reject transfusions ask then make your mind up instead of what you hear second hand.

As for Gibson's original question....

God gave us free will. Believe what you want makes no difference to me. i've not lost any sleep over smoggy's beliefs as I am sure he's lost none over mine.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 31/03/2008 10:04
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Smoggy hope you were polite?"

Always am, didn't even ask any hard questions; I gave the 'Buddhist' a harder time because we were in a pub having a nice chat, and he just came over because my mate was wearing beads wouldn't leave us alone, and then came out with "I do Shaolin" in a sideways threat after he was asked to leave us alone. I don't think he was expecting the chorus of laughter he got to that one either.

Never met a preachy Buddhist before.

mm40 Posted on 31/03/2008 10:15
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

this topic is debated on here about one or twice a month and its the same old stuff atheists are right/wrong and believers in God are right/wrong. No one can prove either, so choose what you believe or what you do not and start a new thread.

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 14:22
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"no one is actively walking around trying to convert you to atheism"

considering that 99% of the God threads on here are started by athiests telling believers that they are all idiots and should pack it in, i would argue against that statement

the biggest problem is that those that declare themselves to be "open minded" are usually the most blinkered - the fact that a good proportion of the anti-religious stuff on this thread has been disproved in the past to the same people regurgitating it speaks volumes

say it loud enough and long enough and it becomes true unless it is challenged

TheSmogMonster Posted on 31/03/2008 14:41
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"considering that 99% of the God threads on here are started by athiests telling believers that they are all idiots and should pack it in, i would argue against that statement"

Much of what goes on on this board is a response to outside activity. The board does not exist in its own world. I for instance can't stand the moves by creationists to have religious theory thought as science in schools. Thats why a lot of the angst comes out on here thats not the same as trying to actively convert you, like JW's missionaries and street preachers do.

"say it loud enough and long enough and it becomes true unless it is challenged"

Didn't Blaise Pascal say something like that concerning religion? (and he was pro-religious belief in his own way)

Nothing has ever been 'shown' to be true by religion, thats why you operate on faith isn't it? Because you can't show it to be true? Its all belief.

I'm sorry but if you criticize the other side are 'blinkered' when you've not met their standards of proof when others have - then you are missing the point. I want logical evidence, fine for you that you don't, but you can't have a go that I do.

There has been too many of these threads I think, but thats because theres nothing else either side can really say. On a personal level it doesn't mean I'm going to leave something without 'challenging' it when its in my eyes wrong.

Lefty Posted on 31/03/2008 15:30
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I'm not sure anyone can be certain God(s) don't exist, but in any case they need to be properly defined.

The god responsible for the creation of our universe may be different to the one who performed a bit of genetic tinkering to a primate to create Adam and school him on language and behaviour.

theboydom Posted on 31/03/2008 17:08
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

BIL

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 18:05
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

TSM - i fully understand that this board doesn't operate in a vacuum but unless i'm mistaken this thread (and a lot of strikingly similar ones) appeared apropos of nothing

it isn't the truth or untruth of religion i'm talking about, it is the literal truths of many of the examples posted as to why God (generally painted as the Abrahamic variety) doesn't exist

one simple example is the Jesus = Horus bolx that has been disproven at length both on here and elsewhere but is still put forward as a valid reason not to accept Christ - what bothers me isn't that people are not willing to believe, but that they are actively trying to sow doubts amongst others with lies - either knowingly or unknowingly (and if its the latter then all the bolx about 'scientific research principles' flies out the window)

there is no standard of proof that will ever satisfy an athiest that God exists - which as you say is where faith comes in - however it is the regular lack of standards from the 'open-minded' that causes me to despair

the big problem that athiest-science seems to have with religion is that most Christians don't conform to the views that the athiest-scientists want them to

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 18:16
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"the big problem that athiest-science seems to have with religion is that most Christians don't conform to the views that the athiest-scientists want them to"

And vice-versa, Scrote.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 18:17
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"the big problem that athiest-science seems to have with religion is that most Christians don't conform to the views that the athiest-scientists want them to"

And vice-versa, Scrote.

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 19:04
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

so are you saying that scientists don't believe in scientific theory?

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 19:11
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

No, go back and try again. FFS!

Muttley Posted on 31/03/2008 19:16
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Evangelical Atheists? How the F*** did that happen? [:P]

I find that the people that I get most irritated by are those so convinced of their own truth that they must save other people from their own falsehoods. You know the sort, Mormons knocking on your door on a Saturday morning, Baptist ministers expounding on the evils of Rome, Islamic preachers spreading hatred of the west? So where on such a list would you put the Messageboard Atheists Truth-sayers? Not terribly high up, but irritating anyway.

Silly examples of Dinosaurs (I fondly imagine GibsonP45 bashing two model dinosaurs together making roaring sounds) I mean come on! Oh and Aliens (that reminds me, I must press my Star Trek uniform for the convention)...

Sorry.

Look just let people get on with their own lives and is it really such a bad thing to turn the other cheek? I think not.

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 20:20
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

YDMS - i'm afraid you'll have to enlighten me

muttley - in all honesty i see the MAT-S (as opposed to athiests willing to engage in debate) in as a bad a light as the others you mention due to their pernicious nature

number9 Posted on 31/03/2008 21:00
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I once had a conversation with an "athiest" on this board and he/she said I should have faith in evolution?

Takes a bigger leap than believing in God imho.

But that said free will and all that.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 21:13
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"I once had a conversation with an "athiest" on this board and he/she said I should have faith in evolution?

Takes a bigger leap than believing in God imho.

But that said free will and all that."

How does that one work then? I mean if having faith in evolution is bigger leap than having faith in God explain how so. There's plentiful of evidence available to suggest that evolution is very much fact, what is there to prove that a God exists other than the ramblings of folk from by gone eras, who used religion as a method to explain the going ons they simply didn't have then means to educate themselves otherwise?

number9 Posted on 31/03/2008 21:35
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You_Drive_Me_Swayze

"There's plentiful of evidence available to suggest that evolution is very much fact,".

Show me. Present the missing link, explain where the matter to create the big bang came from, explain exactly how life originally spontaneously happened and demonstrate it in a lab. Explain to me the vastness of the universe or why we die but want to live forever. Explain why we see in colour or homosexuality? Show me evolution in progress not adaptation (a fruit fly is a fruit fly), explain morals, explain love, devotion, despair at the death of a loved one, explain hate, fear, explain why only humans are self aware and aware of there own limited life span and ultimately there own death. Explain why we care for those in need, explain compassion, desire both sexual and the one that makes your heart burst when you experience it and every other emotion that separates us humans from my pet dog, who by the way can crap and not have to wipe his backside with a sheet of paper. I could go on and on and on like every other poster on this board but frankly I’ve had a couple of whiskies and cannot be bothered with knob heads.

You also said
“simply didn't have then means to educate themselves otherwise?”

I would also point out the people of UR had central heating and if some are to believe electricity, they had a strong social structure which cared for those in need as did the Jews, just because people lived in the past does not make the less intelligent. The Arabs invented Algebra over 900 year ago. Job new that the Earth was round and how the tide and season worked when you’re ancestors were running around in blue paint. Your arrogance is embarrassing.

The Pyramids were built over a 2000yrs ago but will still be standing when the CN tower et all has collapsed./


I just cannot be friggin bothered this thread has been done too death in fact the only two people I respect when it comes to these threads is Smoggy & lefty.

You never heard of irony, you know ironic and all that?

If you can't work it out I’m not going to explain it.

RANT WELL AND TRULY OVER.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 21:38
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I have but it's difficult to judge on a F***ing Internet forum mate especially when you're not familiar with the posters.

LeitrimBoro Posted on 31/03/2008 22:35
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

YDMS Number 9 asked you a few questions. We await your response.

saaam121 Posted on 31/03/2008 22:42
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

if god moulded all people in his imageh how come we have differant races?

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 23:02
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Isn't it great when people start barking orders at you to answer questions like your obliged to do so? If number9 hadn't edited his fooking post after I'd responded maybe I would have!!!

Regardless,

"Show me. Present the missing link, explain where the matter to create the big bang came from, explain exactly how life originally spontaneously happened and demonstrate it in a lab. Explain to me the vastness of the universe or why we die but want to live forever. Explain why we see in colour or homosexuality? Show me evolution in progress not adaptation (a fruit fly is a fruit fly), explain morals, explain love, devotion, despair at the death of a loved one, explain hate, fear, explain why only humans are self aware and aware of there own limited life span and ultimately there own death. Explain why we care for those in need, explain compassion, desire both sexual and the one that makes your heart burst when you experience it and every other emotion that separates us humans from my pet dog, who by the way can crap and not have to wipe his backside with a sheet of paper. I could go on and on and on like every other poster on this board but frankly I’ve had a couple of whiskies and cannot be bothered with knob heads."

Take you head out of your arse and go look for it yourself, dickhead!

Researching the scientific analysis of Peppered Moths, Fruit Flies and the works of Michael Majerus maybe a good place to start if you want answers to Evolution. If you want answers to the philosophical, epistemological and metaphysical clap-trap you've been spouting then Nietzsche, Aristotle, Plato, Russell should whet your appetite. Frankly you're no where near important enough to me to warrant me spending my time and effort searching for answers to satisfy your aggressive demands.

"I would also point out the people of UR had central heating and if some are to believe electricity, they had a strong social structure which cared for those in need as did the Jews, just because people lived in the past does not make the less intelligent. The Arabs invented Algebra over 900 year ago. Job new that the Earth was round and how the tide and season worked when you’re ancestors were running around in blue paint. Your arrogance is embarrassing."

Yes, and they thought that the world was flat, that the Earth revolved around the Sun, they had no knowledge of the Geology or Astronomy that civilisation does today, they simply put; hadn't evolved to the levels of sophistication in scientific methods that we have today. It's nothing to do with intelligence it's education and understanding. They couldn't put a man on the Moon or split the atom. They couldn't see into the far reaches on the universe, scale the highest point or descend into the lowest trench. You see evolution taking place in history you blinkered idiot! You've seen the advance in infrastructure, the way of life and what not, human beings evolving over the course of recorded history. It's there if you bother to go look for it.

Seeing as you're acting such a clever sod what evidence at all is there to prove that Creationism exists or God or any of the radical and frankly absurd myths, fables or stories in the Bible or Koran and Tanakh?

It's nothing to do with arrogance, it's common F***ing sense, something which seems to allude you.

LeitrimBoro Posted on 31/03/2008 23:07
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You do seem to have a bad temper.
Relax.
Stop swearing.
Chill out

outoftowned Posted on 31/03/2008 23:09
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"if god moulded all people in his image how come we have differant races?"

more like .. if god moulded all people in his image how come we have kerry katona???

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 23:10
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"if god moulded all people in his imageh how come we have differant races?"

You see that another bullS*** Bible story about how civilisation tried to celebrate it's strengths and create a tower (Tower of Babel) to reach the heavens, but God annoyed with this act of defiance scattered his creation across the globe and gave them different languages as so the resulting miscommunication would result in the tower not being completed, and some people believe this along with Noah's Ark, Adam and Eve, walking on water and all that stuff!!!

LeitrimBoro Posted on 31/03/2008 23:13
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Now now.
Settle down. Pour yourself a nice cup of Horlicks.
I think you worry to much.
Blood pressure will be going through the roof with all your ranting tonight.

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 23:14
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YDMS - just a couple of points - don't feel obliged to answer them if you don't want to

1. "Researching the scientific analysis of Peppered Moths" - is this the study that the scientist admitted he had to fake by gluing moths to trees?

2. "Yes and they thought that the world was flat, that the Earth revolved around the Sun, they had no knowledge of the Geology or Astrology that civilisation does today..."

a) the Greeks knew the earth was a sphere 2000 years ago - that knowledge was lost as "more sophisticated" nations went on the rampage

b) Astrology????? WTF!

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 23:17
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

1. No it isn't, go look it up.

2. Well done the Greeks, could they put a man on the Moon? or probe far reaches of the universe?

3. Astronomy, sorry.

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 23:21
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1. Yes it is - even if the science is sound the pictures used to prove it were created by gluing the moths to the trees - as you say "go look it up"

2. So knowing that the earth is a sphere and the solar system is heliocentric are no longer signs of an advanced civilisation?

3. I'll give you that one [;)]

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 23:22
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Oh and maybe you and that clown number9 would care to provide this wealth of evidence in favour of Creationism that I assume must be available to back up not only the existence of a God but ID too.

Scrote Posted on 31/03/2008 23:25
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i don't believe in creationism any more than you do (cf my post at 18:05 (and an answer to 20:20 would be interesting))

LeitrimBoro Posted on 31/03/2008 23:27
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Being abusive again. Tut tut.
Try some relaxation techniques. Deep breathing is a good starter.
Try it. It will help with your "issues"
Now after 3. Breath in.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 31/03/2008 23:35
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

1. No it isn't. Either your mistaken or obnoxious or swallowing the Creationists propaganda regarding the of purpose photos for the sake of documentation that you've been fed like a sucker!

2. Like I said; did they have the advanced and sophisticated levels of Geology and Astronomy that we possess today? These are simple examples amongst many that could be listed; Mathematics and Biology too for example?

Do you think the Old Testament would have made such audacious claims if the authors were fully aware of the history of Earth that we know today through the evolution of Geology, Chemistry, Physics and Archeology? Advancements in every single scientific field that has afforded civilisation more understanding about the nature of creation, the existence of life.

Are you seriously suggesting that we aren't more of an advanced civilisation than thousands if not hundreds of years ago.

Scrote Posted on 01/04/2008 00:35
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

1. as i've already pointed out earlier - the biggest problem for you (as an athiest-science type) is your inability to see beyond your blinkered view of anyone who believes in God

i'm quite happy to accept the science behind pepper-moths

i'm also quite able to understand the reason and need to engineer photos

that was the point i was making and it seems to have gone completely over your head in your rush to discredit anything you see as an assault on your beliefs (or lack of them as the case may be)

2. like you said - "...they thought that the world was flat, that the Earth revolved around the Sun..."

surely as a scientist you can admit when you make a mistake and correct or clarify it (without editing the original post as that just confuses the issue further)

where do you think our knowledge of geometry or astronomy or biology come from? seriously??

the ancients didn't know everything but then neither do we - but they knew a damn sight more than you want to give them credit for because you need to paint them as mumbo-jumbo idiots to fit your beliefs again - if they were intelligent AND believed in Gods then the argument that enlightenment == death of God suddenly isn't so secure

are you seriously suggesting we are more advanced socially than our ancestors? you really need to get out more [;)]

science and God co-exist for many people - the athiest-science stance is IMHO as blinkered as the creationism-science stance and is as equally invalid


You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 01:05
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

1. No. You used the issue regarding the photos to discredit the entire collection of experiments - "...is this the study that the scientist admitted he had to fake by gluing moths to trees?". He didn't have to "fake" it, the results were already concluded. Again; go look it up.

My problem with people who choose to believe in God is the lack of substance to back up exactly why they choose and thir insistence on discredited the entire science behind evolution without producing any substantial counter argument they simply insist on discrediting a vastly growing wealth of evidence because their beliefs are being called into question, scrutinised, under jeopardy, religion is faltering and the science behind evolution, an explanation to our creation and existence has come leaps and bounds in a fraction of the time that religion has been in society.

If people chose to believe in evolution purely on the basis of blind faith as exemplified in religion they would be mocked.

2. Purposefully avoiding the questions once again, like a coward???

Who said we were more advanced SOCIALLY? Those are your words, not mine that you've deceitfully fitted into you weak argument to give something substantial, typical cowardly tactics those. Well done.

If you are seriously avoiding the clear evidence that civilisation hasn't evolved over the course of thousands of years then I seriously don't see this discussion being anything more than an opportunity to laugh at you. You can't seriously suggest that civilisation isn't more advanced than by gone years, that we as a species have learned and are far more knowledgeable as a whole than the likes of those that lived 2000 years ago. Are you that simple?

"the ancients didn't know everything but then neither do we - but they knew a damn sight more than you want to give them credit for because you need to paint them as mumbo-jumbo idiots to fit your beliefs again - if they were intelligent AND believed in Gods then the argument that enlightenment == death of God suddenly isn't so secure"

Horse S***! I'm not disputing the intelligent of ancients as if I need to F***ing reiterate that once again for the ignorants inhabiting this topic. Even someone like you can acknowledge that religion was a mechanism devised to give meaning and purpose to the happening that weren't understood as they are in this day in age.

Blinkered; you most certainly are and a few simple questions for you; if you believe in God, why so and what do you have to prove that such a thing exists, and do you think that a device such as God could be created and and universally excepted in today's world?

br14 Posted on 01/04/2008 01:14
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You_Drive_Me_Swayze - I think you may be on to something here.

Rather than pointless arguments back and forth, how about establishing some criteria for determining the truth.

For example, what evidence would be required to prove that some form of "God" or extra terrestial being, if you prefer, actually exists.

Conversely, what evidence would be required to prove that life spontaneously generated, in whatever form you prefer.

Once we can define the criteria to demonstrate the truth, we can observe whether the evidence available is sufficient to prove one way or the other.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 01:24
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

No, you don't swing out of it that easy. It's not a case of me determining why constitutes as proof, that stance is typical of the Creationists who simply argue to dismiss the Evolutionists stance whilst not providing and substantiating their own beliefs.

If you want to argue the position of ID and Creationism, the existence of God then do so, don't rely on others to spoon-feed you, I've asked for you to provide proof then do so, provide whatever you deem to be proof.

I've made myself very clear that I'm an atheist, I do not believe in the existence of God or Gods. I do not believe in ID or Creationism simply because neither are coherent or rational and purely rely upon the naivety and ignorance of the human mind in order to from some radical and baseless claim as to the creation of life and existence.

Understandably the science behind evolution isn't 100% simply because it is still in it's infancy and yet provides more evidence more backing, more substantial and factual evidence to suggest so than it's counters have done in their entire lives.

Scrote Posted on 01/04/2008 01:42
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

1. did he or did he not glue moths to trees - straight yes or no

2. not sure which question i'm avoiding - please clarify and i'll give as straight an answer as i'm able

3. "socially" is my word - it was put on a new paragraph to emphasise that it wasn't a direct continuation of that above it - however the point still stands - you claim we are more advanced - i personally feel we are just better at making each others lives a misery

religion and God are two different things - and creationism is a tiny but loud subset of one aspect of one religion - and it also happens to be one i disagree with (as mentioned already) - so why you keep banging on about it as a necessary proof that God doesn't exist is beyond me

i can't prove God exists and i've never tried to - all i ever set out to do on these threads is correct fallacies (from both sides)

if you want to find someone who doubts the existance of God go and hang around a Catholic church at kicking out time - having doubts is a cornerstone of the faith

unfortunately a messageboard isn't the place to try and explain why i have faith in Christ but i do, and i also believe in evolution (i'm still not 100% convinced on the big bang though (or string theory))

br14 Posted on 01/04/2008 01:59
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I am neither for or against creation or for or against evolution.

I was simply trying to establish what evidence would constitute proof for either position.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 02:05
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

1. Who? And please again for the love of God(!) go read up about it before mouthing off, it's clear you've got the tail end of some crap most likely Jonathan Wells and took it as conclusive proof in dismissing the scientific work collected. the process of obtaining photographic documentation of a single piece of work isn't substantial in denouncing everything associated with it.

2. Go read my posts again.

3. So why this remark then: "are you seriously suggesting we are more advanced socially than our ancestors"? You're either not very bright or have the memory of a goldfish. That is a clear insinuation directed at me indicating that I've stated something that I haven't, try again.

We are more advanced it's damn right ignorance to suggest we're not, are you categorically stating that civilisation isn't, in a plethora of aspects more advanced then it was for our ancestors? Are you prepared to admit that we're not culturally advanced, scientifically, medically, morally even? That just about every fabric of our lives isn't advanced at some level or another, that every single aspect of science as we know it has been at a plateau for thousands of years and no advancement has taken place whatsoever? The catalogue of knowledge and understanding is far greater than it was 2000 years ago as a perfect example of evolution has taken place throughout history, the minds of humans have adapted and developed as more knowledge and with that understanding has become available. Is this not clear to see?

I'm aware that religion and God are two different things I didn't ask for an explanation otherwise. I asked if you believed in God which you haven't stated. Why do you insist on avoiding the questions and going off on a tangent? If you believe in God, why so and do you think that a device such as God could be created and and universally excepted in today's world?

You haven't corrected any fallacies, nice to know that you pretentious nature knows no bounds though.

It's fair another derided the comments I make but when you say you have faith in Christ but don't back it up, you simply act like a coward.

"Faith" - quite possibly the most dangerous word in the history of mankind.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 01/04/2008 07:27
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Scrote FFS you talk about atheists spreading lies and then start go on about the peppered moths, pure propaganda. You undermine any argument you have by 'going along with it'rather then having a look. Even if you continue to believe its false.. go critique another one of the thousands of items of research work that show evolution in action.

As you claim not to believe in creationism.. well do you believe we evolved or not?

I also fail to see where you've corrected a fallicy for both sides... guess my eyesight is failing.

"I am neither for or against creation or for or against evolution.

I was simply trying to establish what evidence would constitute proof for either position."

Well there is evidence for evolution - some direct proof for god is probably what people are looking for.


Link: I'll help you - moths

wokingmassive Posted on 01/04/2008 08:18
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

The best bit for me about religon is this - in the bible Jesus lives a frugal exists, nothing fancy. How has this become so twisted that the Pope now lives in the most expensively furnished palace in the world?

So lets just run by the fact, millions starving, living in poverty, pope lives in gigantic palace with the most expensively furnished interior in the world.

Religion - its just great isn't it.

The only religion the world needs is kindness.

True story.

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 08:52
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

This argument gets better, I just love it when insults start flying about…

Now let me clarify some misunderstandings about me.

1) I am a Jehovah’s Witness NOT a creationist. A creationist believes that the Earth was created in a literal six days. This is wrong.
2) Stop confusing religion with faith. Even an evolutionist has faith.
3) I do not discredit the fossil record but accept it as part of what God created.
4) I do not need physical evidence, miracles etc, to know that God exists. I see it every day all around me in the diversity of life on this planet.
5) No one has discredited the Bible when it touches on scientific facts it is accurate.
6) Isaiah new the Earth was round long before the Greeks (Isa 40:22) The book of Isaiah was written about 740BCE. Job new the Earth Hung in Space (Job 26:7) and his book was written about 1473 BCE. Pythagoras lived about 540 to 500 B.C.E also new that the earth was round. A Norwegian textbook written in 1250 not only said the same thing, but also gave the reasons for the varying climates of the earth, the angle of the sun at different times of the year and the prevailing winds. Not all the ancient knowledge had been lost it— was just out of favour for a while.”—The How and Why Wonder Book of Explorations and Discoveries

I am not going to get into a scientific debate as I have no argument with most of what they say, it is there interpretation of the facts I disagree with. No one has yet disproved the Bible as an historical and factual book but science HAS and continues to issue out fraudulent evidence and results based on tampered and altered test results.

Now my last word on the matter…

When the Bible states man was created in God’s image
We are here to populate the earth, to care for and cultivate it, and to exercise a loving stewardship over its plants and animals. We are equipped by God to do this by being made in his likeness—not in any physical appearance but in being endowed with certain attributes of his, such as love, wisdom, power, justice, and a desire to do purposeful work and feel achievement. It is being in the likeness of God in this way that sets us apart from all animals and causes us to ponder the ultimate questions that never occur to any other earthly creatures.

Believe what you will but I am starting to get dizzy.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 01/04/2008 09:15
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....



For pure fun factor:

"1) I am a Jehovah’s Witness NOT a creationist. A creationist believes that the Earth was created in a literal six days. This is wrong."

So how did it all come about in your opinion? Thats just arguing semantics if you just believe god did it in a million years instead of six days surely?

"2) Stop confusing religion with faith. Even an evolutionist has faith."

Religion IS faith, take the faith out of religion - even religious sources and what are you left with. IF you don't have faith the bible is real then what do you base your beliefs on? Now evolution has verifiable evidence, thats different to faith, its not perfect, but any argument further that way is stepping into 'I think therefore I am'. What can you truly know? etc.

"3) I do not discredit the fossil record but accept it as part of what God created."

What were his motives? Why would the god you believe in lie to people?

"4) I do not need physical evidence, miracles etc, to know that God exists. I see it every day all around me in the diversity of life on this planet."

Thats a fair thought process if you don't accept evolution

"5) No one has discredited the Bible when it touches on scientific facts it is accurate."

But you've already said you don't believe in six day creationism? Very pick and mix to suggest some parts of the bible are factually accurate and therefore prove anything while other parts don't prove anything.

You're like a peppered moth to the flame, theres not a chance that was your last word on the matter.

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 09:21
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Big smilie thing

Edit

Heb 11:1,2

neilg Posted on 01/04/2008 09:23
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

jesus was training to be a goal - keeper but gave up because he was afraid of high crosses.

littlejimmy Posted on 01/04/2008 09:54
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Observation: the essential difference between science and religion is that science continually corrects itself as more evidence is found and has no problem with revising or even scrapping its theories. Religion, on the other hand, maintains it hold the absolute truth, and doesn't need any evidence to prove it, and if you question it, you're going straight to hell.

Scrote Posted on 01/04/2008 11:46
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

YDMS - there is little point continuing this as you are not prepared to either read what is written or clarify your points when asked to do so

however, to reiterate one last time

1. where have i denounced everything associated with anything? i asked a question to provoke a response and to very little surprise on my part i got the respoonse that i thought i would - a blinkered, closed-minded tirade against what you wanted to think had been posted rather than answering the questions

source 1: a newspaper article some time ago that reported on the pepper-moth work being fraudulent due to moths being released in areas where there weren't any to begin with, moths being released at the 'wrong' time of day and, moths being glued to different trees dependent upon their colourisation

source 2: on bringing this up on an actual creationism/evolution thread (as opposed to a more general an anti God/religion thread) i was pointed by another poster (buddy, i seem to remember but i could be wrong on that) to various other sources that refuted the claims made

source 3: having checked (on the interweb) i found that the original article had indeed misrepresented the facts and i changed my mind (ironically, something which you keep telling me i'm incapable of doing whilst you chunter on like a stuck record) - one current link to this information is below although this isn't the one i originally read

point: you can't bring yourself to admit moths have been glued to trees to further evolution research even when it appears to be an accepted (if not perfect) method of research - this either means you don't know what you are talking about or you unable to comprehend simple english

2. i've re-read the posts and i'm still not sure which part of it i haven't answered - again i ask you to clarify and i'll happily answer to the best of my ability

3. i am categorically stating that in my opinion civilisation (as a whole) is no more advanced than it was 2000 years ago if not longer

i am also categorically able to accept that in certain areas (mainly technology and ability to travel) we are massively advanced - the problem i have is that you seem to judge civilisation by its technology alone

do you think that harry potter is more advanced than homer's odyssey for instance?

i also think that in many areas we are going backwards and society is the main one

4. me - "unfortunately a messageboard isn't the place to try and explain why i have faith in Christ but i do"

you - "I asked if you believed in God which you haven't stated"

again - learn to read or clarify that you want me to write "I BELIEVE IN GOD" rather than assume some level of intelligence and comprehension ability in other posters

i also didn't say i'd corrected anything on this particular thread - i used "threads" plural deliberately - learn to read


Link: pepper moth article part 1

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 13:47
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Yet more derivative and misleading bullS***! Frankly I haven't got much time for the God Squad by virtue of the fact they stumble and fall when tricky questions are directed at them and carefully avoided giving straight answers, instead proceed with S*** evident by yourself and that ignorant JW. Oh, and when any idiot starts using the Bible as evidence that's time to simply but the argument to bed; it's beyond hope. When people like you are claiming "learn to read" you either can't be bothered yourself or simply haven't the mental capacity to do so it's about as hopeless as trying to prove God exists.

This sums up the pig-S*** ignorance of some: "No one has yet disproved the Bible as an historical and factual book". F***ing Amen to that brother!!! All that Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, Virgin birth S*** is FACT and even more now I've typed it in uppercase!

I suppose that's the rather ignorant beauty of religion or God or ID or faith or Creationism; it's doesn't require facts or evidence to exist, it requires narrow-minded, ignorant and naive individuals who are prepared to lap up any old S*** because they are "told" it exists.

wokingmassive Posted on 01/04/2008 13:52
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

My R.E teacher always used to say that every crime is mentioned in the bible.

I always used to say - what even video piracy?

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 13:56
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"yourself and that ignorant JW"

You mean me by any chance?

Just remember that JW's are NOT pacifists laddy. in some ways I suppose I am ignorant, always say hello, thank you and open doors for women and old folk. Have always been ignorant when it comes to Rugby don't understand it at all, same with Quantam physics goes way over my head.

But with you swayz not ignrant at all. know exactly where you come from shines right thru with your elegant english.

Guess you win Smogg.. Moth to a flame (or super glue to a tree)

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 13:59
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Well you're the only ignorant JW in here so give yourself a round of applause!

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 14:00
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big smillie thing

benpoolie Posted on 01/04/2008 14:12
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I thought JW's were pacifists....???

anyways, what would Jesus do?![;)]

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 14:20
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Common misconception benpoolie.

We are neutral as far as politics and wars go and will not repsond if persecuted for being a JW. But if you attack me and it's not related to my belief i will defend myself and family.

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 14:38
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

To me its quite obviously all a load of bo11ox this god stuff.

How people can believe in it seriously baffles me.

But theres nothing wrong in trying to live your life by the bible which is basically just a moral compass.

God was created to keep men in AWE.

The only problem I have is Jehovas coming round to MY house trying to change MY beliefs the cheeky cuunts.

What gives them the right to do that.

ABsolute ar5eholes the lot of em.

Il come round theirs for an argument if they want

benpoolie Posted on 01/04/2008 14:45
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

huh, didn't know that no9
wonder why I got in bother with our elders for clumping someone then?[and getting in chew with the police]

they told me stuff like 'turn the other cheek' and 'vengeance is mine, I will repay'....

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 14:55
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

benpoolie

Each situation is different I suppose and should be judged on merit. If you can turn the other cheek fair does. Someone brakes into my house they can expect to thumped. Would excersise restraint though.

I guess the opperative word is "defend".

Heres a couple of points I would apply based on Ex 22:2

If flight is impossible, the individual may be able to reason with the assailant. But, at other times, trying to reason with a person determined to inflict injury may lead to loss of valuable time. The situation may be such that the only thing a person can do is to use whatever is at hand to protect himself or others. As a result, the attacker may receive a fatal blow. From the Scriptural standpoint, the one acting in self-defense would not thereby incur bloodguilt.

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 14:58
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

number9

do you feel urged to try and change peoples beliefs and actively do so by canvassing people in their own homes?

Do you advocate this process?

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 15:07
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

SuperBokSupper

Like many you think that we are trying to convert you, in essence this is not true. If you do not want to be "converted" fair does. When i knock on a door I am hoping to find someone who is spiritually minded and open to reason and is looking for what i consider to be truth. if you want JW's to stop calling tell them that and they will no longer call.

There are many reasons why we activlive preach too many to go into on this round about thread.


benpoolie Posted on 01/04/2008 15:14
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

SBS, what no9 said....but they will still give you an annual knock to make sure you still don't want to be called on! no escape!![;)]

no9's allright tho, he's only sticking up for his beliefs on here and isn't trying to convert - not even the 'incorrigibly wicked' [see WT 01/04/08 page 31] benpoolie!

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 15:26
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I find it extremely offensive that someone else obviously believes I need saving from myself and take it upon themselves to come round my gaff and alter my views.

You canot seriously say when your lot go round they arent trying to convert people into JW's?

I havent told them I dont want to come round as I enjoy arguing with them, not in a nasty way like cos its normally old biddies looking for a free cup of tea and some good old fashioned patronising preaching.


benpoolie Posted on 01/04/2008 15:30
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

thats definately the plan SBS, I aint been door-knocking for about 18 months now but I know nothings changed

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 15:45
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

The reason we supposedly evolved from the monkies and have not evolved since is because we were helped along the way by some devine intervention.

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 15:47
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Whats a cheesy 1970's pop band got to do with divine intervention.

Daydream believers are what most Xtians are neway

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 15:52
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Im not a christian (although i technical am because I have been christened) and im not refering to the story of the creation, but theres more evidence to make me believe that than we just got up one day and decided to start doing stuff.

Lefty Posted on 01/04/2008 15:55
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You're referring to the rather rapid rise to dominance of homo sapiens due to the expansion of the human brain and the development of language etc guisBOROugh?

TheSmogMonster Posted on 01/04/2008 15:57
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

It wasn't really all that rapid though was it?

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 15:57
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Yep, im not trying to get anyone to believe me either, just annoys me when people (usually atheists) wont accept that everything we have are only theories and are too small minded to accept other ideas.

Lefty Posted on 01/04/2008 16:00
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

In evolutionary terms it is astoundingly rapid.

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:03
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

is this thread still going.....

You lot got nothing better to do?

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 16:04
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

I just cant resist a debate on creationism/evolution

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 16:06
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Enlighten us then guisBOROugh with this "evidence"? Maybe you and the deluded harassing ignorant JW could inform us atheists what were missing in our lives.

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 16:08
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Yep, im not trying to get anyone to believe me either, just annoys me when people (usually atheists) wont accept that everything we have are only theories and are too small minded to accept other ideas."


Im small minded because I refuse to believe a random deity in the sky created the World in 6 days and the human race was created by a single peson who made a woman out of his rib then boshed her before putting some clothes on after ignoring the advice of a talking snake.

Then the Son of God came to earth and not only could he perform miracles but could come back to life and his mam never even had sex to get pregnant.

How did God get his spunk up Mary's fannee without her noticing FFS.

Of course the scientific theories and proofs arent the correct way of thinking if youre scared of your own mortality.

Give over lads.


number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:13
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You_Drive_Me_Swayze

You going to the man u game per chance. Mabey we could meet up for a quite pint like?

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:16
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Guess not then

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:19
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Not even for a free pint of Tets

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 16:21
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

SBS, Maybe you missed the bit where I said I wasnt referring to anything in the bible, so as to most of what you slated me with there, I have nothing to say to that.

Also I never said I dont believe in evolution, because I do think it happens. I just personally believe that isnt the only reason why we are how we are, is that okay for me to think?

As for the evidence I said, why not take time to think about the fact that in every known ancient civilisation, which sprung up roughly all at the same time, they all have written records depicting that we were put here, not that we just evolved by chance. Which to me shows better evidence than a few men in white coats who have found bones that suggest we evovled from apes, yet cannot fill a 10,000 year gap that should be there with all their other bones.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 01/04/2008 16:22
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Yep, im not trying to get anyone to believe me either, just annoys me when people (usually atheists) wont accept that everything we have are only theories and are too small minded to accept other ideas"

The scientific use of 'theory' is not the same as the common usage of the word though. Scientifically theory is based on facts, often its just a best guess, but in evolutions case its a best guess thats been observed on a smaller scale directly and on a bigger scale indirectly. Plus you can't just expect someone to accept your ideas without merit, especially with religious beliefs as yours isn't the only one.

One thing I can't stand is when people regurgitate that particular 'theory' nonsense as its a completely semantics based fallacy based argument with no merit in reality.

"A few words need to be said about the "theory of evolution," which most people take to mean the proposition that organisms have evolved from common ancestors. In everyday speech, "theory" often means a hypothesis or even a mere speculation. But in science, "theory" means "a statement of what are held to be the general laws, principles, or causes of something known or observed." as the Oxford English Dictionary defines it. The theory of evolution is a body of interconnected statements about natural selection and the other processes that are thought to cause evolution, just as the atomic theory of chemistry and the Newtonian theory of mechanics are bodies of statements that describe causes of chemical and physical phenomena. In contrast, the statement that organisms have descended with modifications from common ancestors--the historical reality of evolution--is not a theory. It is a fact, as fully as the fact of the earth's revolution about the sun. Like the heliocentric solar system, evolution began as a hypothesis, and achieved "facthood" as the evidence in its favor became so strong that no knowledgeable and unbiased person could deny its reality. No biologist today would think of submitting a paper entitled "New evidence for evolution;" it simply has not been an issue for a century.

- Douglas J. Futuyma, Evolutionary Biology, 2nd ed., 1986, Sinauer Associates, p. 15"


Link: Theory.. someones put it better...

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 16:24
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"You_Drive_Me_Swayze

You going to the man u game per chance. Mabey we could meet up for a quite pint like?"

Maybe you could just come round my home harass we for a while and shove a leaflet detailing that life-saving blood transfusing are wrong. The last lot that tried that S*** were lucky they weren't chewing the F***ing pavement.

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:25
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Sorry smog just could not resist

Side line for him is it (biochemistry)


Link: link

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:25
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

big man huh

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 16:26
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

With regards to aincient civilisations, even right up to 18th century Europe they havent had the scientific advances or academic knowledge to piece together evidence such as that first championed by Charles Darwin.

So they just made stuff up.

I thought anybody would realise that.

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 16:27
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

The Smog Monster..

Im not trying to say evolution doesnt exist, i believe it does.

What I meant there was i just dont see why people are so quick to dismiss something that they cant understand or dont think is likely, and say that something IS fact when theres every chance that we could be wrong on it. It happens in science all the time.

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:27
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

So they just made stuff up?

Uhhhmmmm


Link: link

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 16:30
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Right thats one person who has 'cheated' to prove his point by creating evidence.

There are thousands maybe millions of accredited pieces of evidence for evolutionary development way beyond the timescale in the bible.

If you can show me one, just one, piece of cast Iron evidence, compared to the millions of ones as mentioned above, then Ill start to take you seriously.

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 16:30
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

SBS, how come ancient Sumerians, a race over 6000years old have accurate depictions of our solar system, these include some objects that we have only discovered in very recent history, and pluto which was only discovered in the 20th century by us. People dont just make things up.

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:32
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

SuperBokSupper

lighten up mate in all things retain a sense of humor at theose annoying little ironies that pop up in life.

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 16:33
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

look between the 2 guys heads towards the top left.


Link: solar system

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 16:33
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"As for the evidence I said, why not take time to think about the fact that in every known ancient civilisation, which sprung up roughly all at the same time, they all have written records depicting that we were put here, not that we just evolved by chance. Which to me shows better evidence than a few men in white coats who have found bones that suggest we evovled from apes, yet cannot fill a 10,000 year gap that should be there with all their other bones."

What utter S***!

How the hell can you claim that to be "evidence".

For a start every known civilisation didn't "spring" up at the roughly the same time at all, nor did they all create records detailing the existence of life. The simple reason why none of these ancient civilisations mention Evolution is simply because none had developed the means in order the research such a thing, they didn't have the advancements in science and Geology and Astronomy that we have today or the advanced levels of understating in Physics or Archeology either.

Evidence isn't about thinking it's about facts, which you can't seem to provide and instead rely on misinformation to try and get your point across. Poor show. Please don't act like you have the intelligence to know what you're posting, clearly you don't.

Pinkers Posted on 01/04/2008 16:36
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Why are these threads never titled 'Reasons Why God Can Exist' or 'Evolution - what a load of C****'? Athiests seem to invest a great deal of time and effort in trying to 'convert' people to their ways of thinking. More than the Jehovas in fact. There must be something missing.

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 16:37
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

annoying little ironies I can cope with,

stubbing my toe

forgetting to put the bins out

banging my bonce on a cupboard door.



However two dikheads coming round my house trying to change my beliefs I cannot accept, and will not.

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 16:38
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

So written evidence isnt real evidence is it?

How about if I come upto you in 6000 or 4000 or even 2000 years and give you darwins theories of evolution which as far as we know is solid, would you take that as fact because there is very little difference except the language and the medium.
Also you clearly know little about how advanced past civilisations have been if you think they had little understanding in astronomy or archeology.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 16:41
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Why are these threads never titled 'Reasons Why God Can Exist' or 'Evolution - what a load of C****'? Athiests seem to invest a great deal of time and effort in trying to 'convert' people to their ways of thinking. More than the Jehovas in fact. There must be something missing."

Do atheist go around banging on people's doors harassing them telling them they need enlightening despite knowing F*** all about said person?

At least atheists take the time to provide evidence and back up their beliefs rather than relying on ignorance and blind faith, which is essentially the reasoning behind those that choose to believe in God.

SuperBokSupper Posted on 01/04/2008 16:48
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Dont be so presumptioous about what I may or may not know.

I may not hae as greast a knowledge as you about aincient civilisations but I do know a fair bit about History.

You dont accept that the reason that old civilisations had theories on a God / Gods who created everything was because they had nowhere near the technology ar academic capabilities we have now then.

Cos if you dont il call you a liar.

Pinkers Posted on 01/04/2008 16:48
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Do atheist go around banging on people's doors harassing them telling them they need enlightening despite knowing F*** all about said person?"

No they don't, but as far as I know only Jehovahs do, and they are but a tiny percentage of people who believe in God on a global scale. Instead they go on and on and on with tedious threads on message boards and write books like God Delusion. Yawn.


TheSmogMonster Posted on 01/04/2008 16:48
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"So written evidence isnt real evidence is it?"

Well first off, no its not, not in the context you're using it. It can't be relied on when its the 'god of gaps'

Secondly, who are you talking about? Because all the ancient civilisations didn't rise up at the same time, and they were all predated by tribal hunting groups, take for instance the Paleolithic period, just have a look at it.

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 16:54
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Well i'm off out now. Enjoyed today, made some cash, sold the aprt in dubai, and had a laugh at the life this round robin of a thread has had.

Last chance You_Drive_Me_Swayze meet me for a pint on sun. i sit in blk 17 or if you prefer i'l meet you outside the club shop. You can then tell me to my face how ignorant i am and make me eat tarmac if you like.

guisBOROugh Posted on 01/04/2008 17:04
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

SBS, Your right I dont accept that they just made these ideas up because nothing else made sense, I cant see why the same story would crop up all over the world just be coincidence.
And sorry, your right to say I shouldnt assume what you know.

And Smog Monster, I didnt mean at the same time, most of the civilisations which we have good evidence from rose up within perhaps a thousand or 2 years of each other, which sounds alot, but when talking about evolution it isnt.


Can I just propose this idea to people, and before I say anything I am in no way trying to state this is what I believe is our history, its just an idea that is in the box.

As a more advanced human race, say in 200 years when we know more of space travel, more of biology and everything else, we land on a planet, could be mars, could be in a different solar system, there we set up research bases and find a primitive race similar to humans of say what we know of the stone age. How long before we start experimenting on these creatures, see how they 'evolve' themselves and continue to monitor them. Could be that before long they are creating their own civilisations similar to the rise we have seen on Earth.

Now if these beings know very little of what is happening to them or why, they are going to try to explain it to themselves in what very basic way they know.
Could this IDEA fit into how we have seen the idea of Gods originate on Earth? It very well could. And I dont think that is completely unthinkable of to anyone who believes purely in evolution. Its just an idea though remember to try and show you how things can happen.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 17:09
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Right so it's only atheists like Dawkins that write books regarding their beliefs is it? Only atheists that create "tedious" threads is? Ah right because there's no corner of the Internet that doesn't contain the God Squad ranting and raving, denouncing Evolutionism and what not is there? You truly are F***ing ignorant beyond belief aren't you? Ever hear of Jonathan Wells, Tom Bethell, Michael Behe or Phillip E. Johnson?

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 17:15
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"Last chance You_Drive_Me_Swayze meet me for a pint on sun. i sit in blk 17 or if you prefer i'l meet you outside the club shop. You can then tell me to my face how ignorant i am and make me eat tarmac if you like."

Ah the old "say that to my face" S***! What makes you think I'd want to fratenise with an ignorant, blinkered narrow-minded cretin like you? You're the epitome of the type of person I actively avoid in life. Oh, and I'm not going to the match anyway I won't be back to the Riverside until this F***ing cast is off my leg.

benpoolie Posted on 01/04/2008 17:21
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

you sold a flat in Dubai??!
bet the WTB+TS love your contributions!!!



don't think there's any need for anyone to resort to threats or violence either....
slap on the wrists you boys [;)]

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 17:22
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"So written evidence isnt real evidence is it?

How about if I come upto you in 6000 or 4000 or even 2000 years and give you darwins theories of evolution which as far as we know is solid, would you take that as fact because there is very little difference except the language and the medium.
Also you clearly know little about how advanced past civilisations have been if you think they had little understanding in astronomy or archeology."

And clearly you read into what has been said whatever you want to. Yes it's fact that compared to today's standards ancient civilisations and very little understanding in both astronomy and archeology. Did these civilisations thousands of years ago have the means to excavate vast portions of land to reveal evidence of previous beings that roamed the lands or the means to reveal the construct of distant stars and planets like we do today?

Scrote Posted on 01/04/2008 17:23
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

YDSM - all evidence points to your particular brand of athiest modus operandi as being abusive and petulant on message boards about religion - erm, hang on... i mean football (some mistake surely??)

"Evidence isn't about thinking it's about facts" - and how, pray tell, do we get these facts if we aren't allowed to think?

TSM - if ancient tablets can't be used as evidence how do you feel about the recent computer simulations of the destruction of sodom and gomorrah based on said tablets (link below)?

wokingmassive - i think video piracy comes under theft


Link: Up and down like the Assyrian empire!

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 17:29
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Typical Scrote taking things completely out of context and failing to understand yet again, what a surprise! Go read the what it was it response to, clever dick.

If you don't have facts it's not evidence is it? Trying to build evidence based purely on thinking that such a thing happens or exists e.g God or Creationism is exactly why such arguments get shot down.

This would be clear to you if you practicing what you preach and read the posts throughly instead of this selective nonsense you're guilty of.

number9point5 Posted on 01/04/2008 17:43
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You_Drive_Me_Swayze have always been this aggy or do you practice in front of the mirror?

Heading for an embolisim sonny, just because you aint got hair on yer nuts yet don't mean you can't have one.

You have made many false statements in this thread, too many to list.

My advice to you is get a life.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 17:46
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False statements like what exactly clever dick? It's fair enough claiming so but how about backing yourself up?

If you don't like content of this thread go get F***ed, yer doyle.

Scrote Posted on 01/04/2008 17:46
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

typical scrote?

does that mean you are in fact an older poster using an assumed name and that we have had these discussions before?

would explain a lot i spose...

as an aside TSM - the assyrian astronomer who spotted the meteor described it as being like a white bowl - this wasn't perhaps the famous china tea-pot that we are continually being told by athiests doesn't orbit the sun?


number9point5 Posted on 01/04/2008 17:48
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

tut tut go wash yer mouth out with soap.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 17:52
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"typical scrote?

does that mean you are in fact an older poster using an assumed name and that we have had these discussions before?"

No, typical in that you fail to understand what has been posted yet again and simply read into it whatever you choose to as you have displayed countless times already on this thread.

I haven't visited this forum before and have only done so because I'm off work so I've never encountered you before.

number9point5 Posted on 01/04/2008 17:54
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

back to skool soon then laddie

TheSmogMonster Posted on 01/04/2008 17:56
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Scrote that link says:

"Tales of fiery destruction raining from the skies are not, though, restricted to the Bible. Hempsall told the Times that "at least 20 ancient myths record devastation of the type and on the scale of the asteroid’s impact" - including the Ancient Greek myth of how Phaeton, son of Helios, lost control of his dad's chariot and plunged into the River Eridanus."

And why I'm bringing that up is thus, its not a common everyday event, but you can find other 'evivdences' similar for other religions.

It also plays right into the God of Gaps (in our knowledge) as it happened then, they ignorantly interprate it as an act of god, would it be put down to an act of god these days?

I think the point about the teapot is that its probably not orbiting the sun at a Lagrangian point L3, its about the power of chinese whispers over generations more then anything.

number9point5 Posted on 01/04/2008 17:58
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You_Drive_Me_Swayze is a good argument for adoption of eugenics imo.

TheSmogMonster Posted on 01/04/2008 18:11
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

What a fooking awful thing to say.. go give your head a shake point5

Scrote Posted on 01/04/2008 18:44
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"No, typical in that you fail to understand what has been posted yet again and simply read into it whatever you choose to as you have displayed countless times already on this thread."

perhaps if you posted in half readable english without all the swearing i'd be able to understand a bit better

however where you have pointed out a lack of understanding i've asked you to clarify - which you've failed to do "countless times already on this thread" (i'm assuming you can only count to two based on the evidence in your previous post)

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 18:53
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

No, based on the amount of times I've asked you direct and simple questions that you've purposefully avoided and proceeded to spin and twist a laughable amount of S***.

The questions are there, already posted I'm tired of reiterating my points when you're so reluctant to divulge in detail your own beliefs and opinions instead rely on the cowardly task of side-stepping any questions and resort to nitpicking and pedantry like some arrogant C****.

Scrote Posted on 01/04/2008 19:11
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

my beliefs are quite clear - i believe in God

trying to explain why on a messageboard is pointless - trying to explain why to someone openly hostile to even the possibility is even more pointless

i can't offer any concrete proof for God and anyone who says they can is probably lying or misguided

going back through the thread i think i've answered every other question apart from the one that you are still to clarify (although i think i answered that one anyway but you didn't like the answer)

and pedantry in a religious debate is a given - if you say something then be prepared to either back it up or accept it as wrong - that is what you have consistently failed to do (except for astrology which you scientifically amended in your original post)

yet again you can't seem to answer without swearing - do you have anger issues?

ThePrisoner Posted on 01/04/2008 19:25
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"my beliefs are quite clear - i believe in God"

Are they really clear or are they just a vague, woolly inkling that there must be something or someone out there?

Do you hold specific religious/confessional beliefs? If so, how did you come to hold them? I am intrigued by how people arrive at their beliefs. Is it just due to being told so by parents, is it due to some momentous event, is it just from the beauty of a rainbow, or is from reading a religious book and thinking it makes sense, or is it just to conform with societal norms?

You may have answered this already but I can't be arsed reading 180+ posts to find them.


You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 19:30
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Right so whilst you can't offer a modicum of proof as to the existence of God and aren't prepared to explaining why you choose to you have no quarrels whatsoever in denouncing and dismissing what others say who make it clear that they do not, What a F***ing crank!

"and pedantry in a religious debate is a given - if you say something then be prepared to either back it up or accept it as wrong"

Quite possibly the most laughable thing I've read since in ages! It's amazing that you've not backed up your opinions or beliefs and avoid doing so hiding behind the B******* excuse of "explaining so on an messageboard is pointless", in other words you can't or won't simply because you're not prepared to deal with the insurmountable tirade of questions and counter arguments that inevitably will be directed your way. You just stick to your blinkered and naive beliefs sonnyjim!

LeitrimBoro Posted on 01/04/2008 19:38
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

YDMS...Relax. Use those breathing techniques we talked about last night. Breath in.....hold it... and out.
These "issues" are really stressing you. I understand. I really do.
For every problem, together, we will find a solution.
Now lie back and tell me about your childhood. I`m listening.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 19:39
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You're funny.

LeitrimBoro Posted on 01/04/2008 19:48
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Progress at last.
Well done. All this anger is wasted energy.
Lets make small steps first.
Think of a balloon floating gently in the air. All your anger is inside the balloon.
Remember you breathing. Relax.

You_Drive_Me_Swayze Posted on 01/04/2008 19:54
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The balloon has popped, you F***er!

number9 Posted on 01/04/2008 21:26
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Well just got back in and thought i'd have nosey before retiring and blow me over this thread is still going.....

How it got 180+ after running round in circles for 170+ posts is beyound me!

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 01/04/2008 23:06
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Jesus Christ what a debate i was only looking at facts against myths didn't expect this type of response [:D].

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 02/04/2008 00:15
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

A good way of summing this thread up is maybe somebody who does believe in God could give half a dozen reasons or facts to why a God does exist and how he may help us through life or what positive things he has done for us over the last 5000 years ?.

bobstermarley Posted on 02/04/2008 00:17
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

That then goes back to the "fall from grace" and all that stuff about "free-will", non intervention etc.

Personally, I've always thought that that was just an excuse for why god doesn't interfere when houses burn down with children in them and planes fall out of the sky killing all passengers.

littlejimmy Posted on 02/04/2008 00:22
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

But what about children getting cancer and stuff like that? How does that reconcile with an all-powerful, all-knowing, merciful God?

If God doesn't know about suffering, he can't be all-knowing.
If God knows, but can't do anything, he can't be all-powerful.
If God knows and won't do anything, then he can't be merciful.

Asking believers for proof is futile. They don't have to prove it, because it is all about faith at the end of the day.

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 Posted on 02/04/2008 00:37
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Suppose your right Jimmy i am not asking them to prove it because i think they should try and explain themselves , i don't think they should if they believe God luck to them.
Its just this thread will go on for ever and its starting to take up too much of my time reading through it every time i come on lol.
All i was trying to say at the start was if you look at facts regarding previous life on this planet , the universe , proven Evolution finds , ect ect with an open mind it does become quite difficult to understand where an almighty super being or god comes into it all , unless of course you have been brain washed into believing in what ever God or religion you follow.

littlejimmy Posted on 02/04/2008 00:39
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

You're wasting your time. This subject will be back in another week or two and the same old sophistic arguments will be trotted out. By both sides, it must be said. I'm an agnostic, because absolute certainty either way is absurd, in my opinion. I'm F***ed if I'm wrong. Time to play Pascal's Wager?

br14 Posted on 02/04/2008 01:21
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

"All i was trying to say at the start was if you look at facts regarding previous life on this planet , the universe , proven Evolution finds , ect ect with an open mind it does become quite difficult to understand where an almighty super being or god comes into it all , unless of course you have been brain washed into believing in what ever God or religion you follow."

Gibson_Wheres_My_P45 - the creationist point of view covers all eventualities. Thats why it needs so little argument. You either accept - or don't - or don't know.

For example, suppose for a minute there is an extra terrestial being that exists outside of our dimension and can manipulate matter and energy in such a way as to generate the "big bang" or whatever.

Absolutely nothing is impossible. In fact, most of the findings that suggest adaptation are perfectly plausible with or without a creator. Only the truly fundamentalist will argue with that.

The only real argument is whether the whole thing came about by chance or by design.

The question is not creation vs. evolution but rather, where did the matter/energy come from to start the whole process and in what context did this matter/energy exist.

We'll probably never know. So the only logical choice is that expressed by LJ.

However, if you believe one or the other option presented so far I congratulate you on your faith. May it comfort you always.

king_hellfire Posted on 02/04/2008 17:50
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

'Time to play Pascal's Wager?'

I wouldn't bother jimmy, it doesn't work.

woodymfc Posted on 02/04/2008 17:53
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Good night - God Bless!!!!

king_hellfire Posted on 02/04/2008 17:56
Reasons Why God Can Not Exist.....

Good night - Dawkins Bless!!!! [;)]