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Bernie_was_right Posted on 28/02/2008 13:06
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

From Todays Gazette:

"MIDDLESBROUGH is set to become home for 66 Ethiopian refugees.

They are currently living in a refugee camp in Kenya, but in April will make the 4000-plus miles trip to begin a new life.

Middlesbrough Council is preparing for the arrival of the refugees. They will be individuals and in family groups.

On Tuesday the council’s executive is expected to give final approval to the arrangements.

Under the Gateway Protection Programme for Refugees the Government will cover the first year costs - likely to be between £380,000 and £525,000.

The refugees will be able to claim benefits as soon as they arrive, but it is hoped some will speak good enough English to find work as translators".


Now i can see the benefits of controlled migration, where we accept people who are bringing skills that we have shortages of. But what benefit will we get from these people coming here?
And why don`t the media be more honest and say that we, the Tax payer will cover the costs, as that`s where the goverment`s money comes from. Funny how there is always money available for things like this, but never for extra police or NHS nurses.


mickbrown Posted on 28/02/2008 13:08
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

So you'd rather they spent the rest of their days in a refugee camp?

T_N_T Posted on 28/02/2008 13:09
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

i thought u were announcing a new signing!

Duncan_Blackheart Posted on 28/02/2008 13:09
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

or why are they coming here when they have flown over Italy, Germany, etc to get here?

Bernie_was_right Posted on 28/02/2008 13:11
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"So you'd rather they spent the rest of their days in a refugee camp?"

Of course not. I wish them all the best. I just don`t see where the British Goverment or M`bro council got the mandate from to invite people to come and live here and claim benefits.

captain5 Posted on 28/02/2008 13:11
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Did you read the full story??

mickbrown Posted on 28/02/2008 13:12
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

We're just doing our bit.

Rodney_Trotter Posted on 28/02/2008 13:13
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Everyone knows there is a shortage of Ethiopian translators in Grangetown.


slipshod Posted on 28/02/2008 13:13
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Mick, are you for real, wtf has them living in a refugee camp got to do with the british taxpayer or people living in Middlesbrough, at the end of the day they will bring F*** all to this town. I know it sounds harsh but they should not be our problem.

HolgateEnd Posted on 28/02/2008 13:13
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

In a word mick, yes.

I'd rather see my tax money going to something that is likely to benefit me - more police, nurses, doctors, teachers for schools. Not to immigrants who are only coming here for the free money.

I was told yesterday that the government is planning to raise the basic level of income tax from 22.5% to 25%. So first of all i hear that more money will be taken from my wages each month, and now i hear that some of it will be used to fund 66 people coming from a different country to ours.

mickbrown Posted on 28/02/2008 13:14
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Selfish bollox the lot of you.

Hope you're never in their position one day.

captain5 Posted on 28/02/2008 13:15
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Did Alastair Darling mention anything else when he told you about the income tax rise??

ridsdale Posted on 28/02/2008 13:15
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I can't see why Thirsk could not have taken a dozen of these.

Critical_Bill Posted on 28/02/2008 13:16
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Maybe there's a potential London 2012 medal winning athlete amongst them.

the_elf_unit Posted on 28/02/2008 13:17
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Other EU country's will be taking a proportion of other refugee's in tohse camps as well.

mickbrown Posted on 28/02/2008 13:18
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Elf - stop being reasonable. We're all going to be out of pocket, they are going to move into our houses and eat our dogs.

jono_feds Posted on 28/02/2008 13:18
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I'd rather contribute to people whose lives are at risk (this doesn't mention if this is so) and would probably graft given the opportunity than current UK residents who are happy to take their dole and never want to work.

ccole Posted on 28/02/2008 13:20
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Would it not be much better to give them £300k so they can buy some land and build a new village for themselves with farming equipment?

This way, they wont have to move as far and we are contributing to some african economy?

TheSmogMonster Posted on 28/02/2008 13:21
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"I was told yesterday that the government is planning to raise the basic level of income tax from 22.5% to 25%"

Why would they drop it down to 20% in April coming then - because they are doing that.

As Mick said these people need a place to go - read the full story - they arn't even allowed to speak their own language.

"Deputy mayor and lead councillor for community cohesion, Bob Kerr, said: “We are anticipating a mixture of people who have been persecuted, were in genuine danger of death and were forced to flee and live in another country."

The money issue is more complicated like, but the reason they arn't paying for police & the NHS is because they want to save the money to pay for ID cards and DNA databases instead.


Link: Linky

Revol_Tees Posted on 28/02/2008 13:24
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

They'll certainly bring more to the town than a number of people on this thread, namely the ignorant f***wits who would prefer them to remain in a refugee camp rather than come to Middlesbrough.

Ivan_Drago Posted on 28/02/2008 13:26
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

hope they get them cross country running across Eston hills within 24 hours of arrival.

the_elf_unit Posted on 28/02/2008 13:26
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Well according to Channel 4 living in a refugee camp is a better proposition than living in the wose place in Britian [:D]

slipshod Posted on 28/02/2008 13:27
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Revol, why don't you let them live in your back garden in a tent then. I am sorry but charity begins at home......................

bigrichardthe4th Posted on 28/02/2008 13:29
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ethiopions r good runners,grangetown will have the fastest paper boys in the country...

mickbrown Posted on 28/02/2008 13:29
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Little scenario for you.

Boro is hit by a tidal wave and you need somewhere to live. Do we help you or let you wallow in your own S***?

gravyboat Posted on 28/02/2008 13:31
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

'Selfish bollox the lot of you'

Don't you get it Mick? They're brown and talk funny, so therefore don't deserve to live in humane conditions. Especially if it's gonna cost everybody a few quid. The bloody cheek of them.

Obvious when you think about it.

captain5 Posted on 28/02/2008 13:32
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I wondered why sports and soccer had ran out of their 'I'm not racist but....' T-shirts.

Snoop_Smog Posted on 28/02/2008 13:32
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Personally I'd rather use a miniscule amount of tax to try and help 66 people not live in what can only be inhuman conditions.

These people have probably never been given the opportunities that 90% of the 1000s of chavs and dossers from round here have had their whole lives.

mickbrown Posted on 28/02/2008 13:33
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

...but there not from round here.

bigrichardthe4th Posted on 28/02/2008 13:34
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ethiopia was the birth place of man kind...

Lefty Posted on 28/02/2008 13:53
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

'They'll certainly bring more to the town than a number of people on this thread, namely the ignorant f***wits who would prefer them to remain in a refugee camp rather than come to Middlesbrough.'

[:D] Well said.



Ivan_Drago Posted on 28/02/2008 13:57
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

If there's a tidal wave I'd rather go to Eithopia than Bolton.

rivals_oldschool Posted on 28/02/2008 14:00
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I wonder what the carbon footprint is of transporting these people and how it will be offset or am I stumping up for that too?

nashvagasboro Posted on 28/02/2008 14:03
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

It's definately a national effort as we will be accepting 200 refugees in Nashville TN.There is plenty of work for them over here and many of them work in the large supermarket chains at night stocking shelves.My employment gives me the opportunity to kinda chat with them and they are good people.We should though get them season tickets at the riverside.Lots of colour,singing,drumming and white teeth.Plus it would increase the average attendance

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 14:09
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Ridsdale, I for one would welcome them, and I'm sure if the boot was on the other foot, they would be more generous than any of us.

GillZean Posted on 28/02/2008 14:12
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"Boro is hit by a tidal wave and you need somewhere to live. Do we help you or let you wallow in your own S***?"

To be honest, I wouldn't expect to get relocated at someone else's expense 5000 miles away into an alien culture.

mickbrown Posted on 28/02/2008 14:19
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Drago - little experiment - go on Rightmove and check out the property prices in the respective towns. You'll be surprised.

Anyway - I fecked off years ago and now live amongst professional sports stars and media types.

GillZean Posted on 28/02/2008 14:21
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Anyone think mickbrown sounds like the fella off of Vic Reeves Big Night Out?

ExiledInBolton Posted on 28/02/2008 15:29
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Typical Boltonian in my experience!

HolgateEnd Posted on 28/02/2008 15:32
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

So why do they need to come to England? Why not just move to another village?

They, in theory, should learn to speak English and use it as their first language when they come here, so coming here cos they cant speak their own language at home is a load of bullsh!t.

At the end of the day, everyone who works is penalised for doing so by the government taking huge amounts of my/your/our wage away. And now their using up to £525000 of it to bring 66 foreigners over. They are not our problem, so why should it cost us money?

Gravy, its nowt to do with them 'being brown and talking funny'. I would be saying exactly the same if they were Polish, Albanian, French or Geordie.

Whoever said charity starts at home is spot on. There are English people living in sleeping bags in shop door ways, begging for money and going without food or drink for days. Yet our government, and the PC brigade like you lot, choose to ignore them and help people from our countries, who England has no responsibility for.

GillZean Posted on 28/02/2008 15:37
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Graham Lister, mick, that's the fellamelad


Link: I love Lofthouse, me, thaknows. I say, I

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 15:39
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

The surprising thing is that it took 40 posts before the PC Brigade were mentioned.

If anyone thinks Britian doesn't have responsibility for the state of the Third World, they need to read up on their history.

GillZean Posted on 28/02/2008 15:40
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Don't the Eyties lay claim to Eritrea/Ethiopia?

junkyard_angel Posted on 28/02/2008 15:41
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Leaving aside the fact that they will eventually benefit our town and add to the cultural mix (we already have a few Kurdish cafes and Restaurants, run by refugees who found their feet in Boro) why the hell should "benefit" be a prerequisite to looking after the unfortunate?

Piggy Posted on 28/02/2008 15:41
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I think the council needs to be applauded on this one.

Its not so long ago that Middlesbrough had the negative publicity of having one of the most obese populations in the country. Now some councils would have initiated education programmes, fitness regimes, healthy eating drives...but no, what do we do?

Ship in a few dozen Ethiopians to bring down the average weight. Brilliant.

I'm keeping my head down just in case theres a comparable scheme in Ethiopia to increase the average weight.

Lefty Posted on 28/02/2008 15:44
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Good point, we should insist on camouflage netting at Goals.

MoggasDog Posted on 28/02/2008 15:44
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

the daily mail type stance on immigration boils my F****g pish more than anything else.

all the F****g alf garnett mongs with their 'country full:borders closed' shyte.

F****g mongs. absolute shameful F****g mongs

HolgateEnd Posted on 28/02/2008 15:46
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Jimmy, history is exactly that, history. We in 2008 are not responsible for something which happened hundreds of years ago.

Should we be inviting hoardes of germans and argies over cos we flattened their countries? Of course not. So why should should we be responsible for the 3rd world?

junkyard_angel Posted on 28/02/2008 15:51
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

er... because we're human?

mailinator Posted on 28/02/2008 15:53
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"Jimmy, history is exactly that, history. We in 2008 are not responsible for something which happened hundreds of years ago."

But we will happily enjoy the benefits of living in one of the richest countries in the world despite huge amounts of that wealth being incurred at the expense of a lot of third world countries.

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 15:53
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Europe and the rest of the west are only prosperous because the Third World is kept in the dark ages. Our politicians pay little more than lip service to helping them, giving the illusion that we are helping countries out but in reality they create sweatshops and use all the dirty trade tricks they know so we can enjoy cheaper gadgets, clothes and food.

When did we flatten Argentina, by the way?

mailinator Posted on 28/02/2008 15:57
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Anyway, why should we help people living on the streets in this country? Charity begins at *home*, remember?


littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 16:00
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I love these trite phrases people come out with to support their stance. There's one for every occassion.

Ooh, Charity begins at home...no man is an island. A nod's as good as a wink...two hands in the bush is worth two on the bird.

mailinator Posted on 28/02/2008 16:02
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Come on James, if I repeat something enough until it becomes a little catchy phrase that rolls of the tongue then it becomes true. If it rhymes, then god help you.

HolgateEnd Posted on 28/02/2008 16:02
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

The UK government is not the cause of the 3rd world countries being poor. That is due to the corruption inside their own governments. The money which we give them to fight poverty etc, never reaches the people who needs it. It gets divvy'd up between the politicians.

The presidents and prime ministers of these countries keep the money for themselves and look after the rich people, at the expense of the people in the villages/shantytowns etc who actually need it.

It is not our fault that they decided to settle on a piece of land where the climate wont let them grow crops etc and be self-sufficient. And it's not our fault that they breed at extreme rates and are now at the point where their countries are too small for the number of people.

bigrichardthe4th Posted on 28/02/2008 16:03
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

iam no raceist but we are a small nation brimming at the seams surely we have took our fare share of immagrants...

zoec Posted on 28/02/2008 16:04
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Jesus.

captain5 Posted on 28/02/2008 16:04
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

[:D] Quality HolgateEnd [:D]


I bet you actually believe all that as well.

Piggy Posted on 28/02/2008 16:08
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

HolgateEnd, if we cant be sure that the Ethiopians would spend the money wisely over there, isnt it better that we bring them over here?

junkyard_angel Posted on 28/02/2008 16:09
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

They get free mobiles, y'know.

billywizz Posted on 28/02/2008 16:10
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

F*** them thats all i can say if that sounds racist so F***ing what not my problem who the hell would help us if out went wrong here ill tell you no one

mailinator Posted on 28/02/2008 16:11
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"The UK government is not the cause of the 3rd world countries being poor. That is due to the corruption inside their own governments. The money which we give them to fight poverty etc, never reaches the people who needs it. It gets divvy'd up between the politicians."

While there are countries with corrupt leaders, your view is an outdated one. You probably think all African children have pot bellies and fly encrusted faces too.

I watched a news report a few months back showing how parts of Africa do not have electricity. They have oil with which to power a power station but we won't let them due to the environmental impact. Was ok for us when we were developing though.

"The presidents and prime ministers of these countries keep the money for themselves and look after the rich people, at the expense of the people in the villages/shantytowns etc who actually need it."

Don't forget though that these people are being brought here because they are persecuted in their own country, not just because they are a bit skint.

"It is not our fault that they decided to settle on a piece of land where the climate wont let them grow crops etc and be self-sufficient. And it's not our fault that they breed at extreme rates and are now at the point where their countries are too small for the number of people."

So we're not responsible for our actions from 100 years ago but they are responsible for their ancestors 'choosing' where to live? Congratulations to you by the way on your excellent choice of being a descendant of an ancestor from hundreds of years ago who chose to live in the UK.

John67 Posted on 28/02/2008 16:13
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

HE: Thats a pile of crap. In fact Ethiopia has only been suffering these terrible droughts for the last 40 years or so. Since, I might add many scientists began seeing the effects of global warming (caused by the Wests use of fossil fuels to get rich) about this time. How do you think the West got rich in the first place. It raped and pillaged its way through the rest of the world, inflicted hundreds of years of slavery and grabbed the natural resources belonging to others and now causes drought and famine. How can you begrudge a few poor people a better life? We are all descended from economic migrants, don't forget.

HolgateEnd Posted on 28/02/2008 16:20
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

No piggy, it's better that we stop sending them money and leave them to sort themselves out.

Mailinator, There are corrupt governments over there still, so how is my view 'outdated'? My view will only be outdated when there are no corrupt governments.

And how the hell can we physically stop them building a power station?

So they are coming here cos they've been persecuted... well, how many safe countries are they bypassing en route? Why do they need to come to England? Why not go to South Africa, or Cameroon, or Congo, or some other African country? Why do they actually, physically need to come to England? Hmm, nowt to do with the free money and free house they'll get is it?

And yes, I am lucky that my ancestors came from England, and that my family has remained here. But that still doesnt make me responsible for what previous governments and monarchies did hundreds of years ago.

captain5 Posted on 28/02/2008 16:24
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I salute your superior Giffinesque attitude.

junkyard_angel Posted on 28/02/2008 16:27
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

holgate end, they are being shared out. If we followed your policy they would all live in Spain or Greece.

gravyboat Posted on 28/02/2008 16:34
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

'Right lads, it's a bit hot for all this crop gorwing business these days, and quite frankly, and sick of not being able to pitch me tent without being surrounded by all these other F***ers. Dunno about you, but I'm off to Boro'

Capybara Posted on 28/02/2008 16:35
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Hmmmm ...... intolerance, racism, a valiant attempt by Piggy to lighten things up a bit, disgust, mickbrown, the PC Brigade ......

This thread is lacking only one thing to give it that last gentle push towards a ton.

Anyroad. I'm sure these Ethiopians will be highly thought of when they arrive. I'll be seeing you.

junkyard_angel Posted on 28/02/2008 16:37
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Lovin' em already, Capy[:)]

Piggy Posted on 28/02/2008 16:40
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I can never see why people get so uptight about people who arent from the UK coming to live in the UK. I've never knowingly met an Ethiopian, but I'd quite like to. Unless of course the git insisted on telling me that Downing needs to get stuck in more. In which case he could pack his bag again pretty sharpish.

We should get some Eskimos too.

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 16:42
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Piggy has a great eye for the absurd. I salute you, sir.

gaz79 Posted on 28/02/2008 16:44
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

These posts are pathetic you may as well say
whos racist and whos not.

Piggy Posted on 28/02/2008 16:46
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Its an absurd world LJ, theres plenty to highlight.

Ivan_Drago Posted on 28/02/2008 16:48
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Piggy [:D]

zoec Posted on 28/02/2008 16:51
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I feel left out. Quite a few people seem to know that their ancestors were the first to populate Britain and only they have a right to be here. I haven't a clue when our lot turned up.

captain5 Posted on 28/02/2008 16:53
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

zoef - do you mean women??

Ivan_Drago Posted on 28/02/2008 17:05
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Zoe as I am sure you're aware - you're over simplifying things, simply because we're all immigrants does not mean we should have open borders.
I do believe we should have much stricter quotas than we currently have. The open borders of the Eu are a far bigger problem due to the inequality of salaries which ensuring blue collar workers are continually undercut.

The likes of capybara and littlejimmy are not directly affected by immigration as they're part of the hypocritical apologetic middle class and don't surround themselves with the underclass... It is therefore easy for them to scorn. I'd like to see their opinions if they were living in the council estates where refugees are housed.

In fairness to Capybara he was probably around when the Royal family first stepped foot in British shores.

ridsdale Posted on 28/02/2008 17:47
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Good post Ivan.

GillZean Posted on 28/02/2008 17:48
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Racist.

asredastheycome Posted on 28/02/2008 18:32
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Holgate End wrote "There are corrupt governments over there still"

Take a look around you son there are corrupt governments over here as well and nobody is blaming you for that. Why should these peolple be blamed for their governments do.

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 19:19
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Trust Ivan to personalise the issue (and nick material from your biggest fan, who posted straight after you as ever). Shame you aren't able to debate anything with any maturity. Like I've said before, I don't live in Brighton and I'm not homophobic. Where I live doesn't matter. As for your class obsession, it's ironic to hear you calling anyone middle class when you repeatedly berate anyone who you perceive to be an "oik" or who has a strong working-class accent.

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 19:56
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

And I don't understand where this absurd generalisation about where you live/what class you are dictating your politics. If you're saying that council estate residents are right wing and xenophobic because they're surrounded by immigrants (is that an excuse?), what makes rural residents right wing and xenophobic? Shouldn't they be lefties because they don't have to live next to the Khans? Having been an immigrant myself on several occasions should give me some perspective, I would think.

However, if you want to get back to debating issues instead of engaging in futile ad hominem nonsense, I'll be more than happy to engage. I haven't called anyone racist on this thread, I've tried to stick to dealing with the points raised.

Let's look at your concerns about blue-collar jobs - well the fact is that Eastern European immigration has peaked and now falling because their economies are improving and many Poles are going home. This is the way the open labour market works, and it works both ways. As for the downward pressure on wages, I can't see the government going for any kind of protectionist measures when big business demands ever-higher profits and an ever-lower cost base. I can't remember enough of my Economics A-level to suggest a practical solution, but I do know that the current system is making for even more inequality.

Then there are concerns over illegal immigration (which some people seem to mix up with Asylum seekers, purposefully or otherwise), but it isn't black and white. A lot of the illegals are coming here on the back of human trafficking gangs who promise heaven and deliver them to hell. It happens all over the world, especially where there is perceived prosperity. It happens a lot in Dubai, for instance.

What I find problematic is tabloid rhetoric which plays on people's fears of difference and disseminating stories about the dreaded PC brigade giving all-comers free houses and money. This kind of language doesn't really add to the debate, it just pushes people who read it into the arms of extremists, and when they start bleating about Freedom of Speech, it's time to stop debating.

ridsdale Posted on 28/02/2008 20:12
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Good post Jimmy.

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 20:14
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Thanks.

Boomerang Posted on 28/02/2008 21:07
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I would rather more people bought FAIR TRADE goods, so less people would come here.

Then we could birch those on the dole every day until they got a job.

Then we could rebuild the empire with those people who stayed in their own country but wanted to be British.

Then I could hoist the Union Jack once more over the post office in Dublin.

Oh what a life.

Then I would be President of the UK empire and would ban all other football teams from winning against the Boro.


ridsdale Posted on 28/02/2008 21:12
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

It amazes me that so many liberal types condemn the unemployed. Like Tebbit type tories they tar all the unemployed, whether they are living in an area with few jobs and may lack skills. Just as they tag anyone who dresses in a certain way as chavs. Even if these kids might just chose that dress. They are often just youg men who are working on building sites and suchlike.

It is the language of the middle class bigot. And the Daily Mail.

Boomerang Posted on 28/02/2008 21:16
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I am not condemming the unemployed . I am finding an outlet for the sick depraived to work out their aggression, it just seems appropriate to utilise a hither to untapped resouce of human man(woman)power.

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 21:21
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Good post, ridsdale.

ridsdale Posted on 28/02/2008 21:28
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

thanks.

Boomerang Posted on 28/02/2008 21:32
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Do you realise we could charge some sicko £30 a time to flog an unemployed person.

Therefore 2 floggings a week they could be self sufficient, and if they took 3 floggings in a week we give them the extra £30 after tax.

F***ing chancelors ( right & left wing) have not got a clue.

up free enterprise. vote LIB-DEM i am your next president

Ivan_Drago Posted on 28/02/2008 21:42
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Jimmy you're still an immigrant - you're a sweatie. Oh and until you're fired a bullet in Nam you don't know what the jungles like, you learn the delights of immigration by reading the guardian.

What exactly do you want? Open borders?

jam69 Posted on 28/02/2008 21:52
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"its not our problem" yes it is they are fellow humans,i hate these greedy T***s whose first reaction to a story like this is "why do we have to pay"believe me you wont see any change in your paypacket,you will still be able to buy the daily mail whilst you order your indian takeaway having friendly banter with gunga din behind the counter!

littlejimmy Posted on 28/02/2008 22:04
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Sad. I offer to raise the level of debate and you let your personal feelings get in the way again. You don't even know which paper I bloody read, you just assume.

As for Thirsk, I wouldn't say it's Home Counties. House prices aren't much different to Nunthorpe or similar places. If I was living in Harrogate and had my kids in a private school, then I might feel slightly ashamed. Or lucky.

Open borders? There's an idea. We supposedly have them in the EU.

SplendidStuff Posted on 28/02/2008 22:11
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

This money, lets take the £380,000 figure works out at £110 per week for each of the 66 people. When you deduct the cost of rent even for a council property then they have probably £50 a week to live off.

Considering the scrotes who get this every day, i think these people could use the help.

Ivan_Drago Posted on 28/02/2008 22:24
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I've fallen on hard times James I live in G-town these days, I can see it all from the front line.

Dibzzz Posted on 28/02/2008 22:25
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

You'd have thought they were trying to better their situation. ;o)

elnino1 Posted on 28/02/2008 22:41
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Good point raised earlier for me was why not give the money this is costing to help them develop in their homeland?

Also, an answer from someone on this one:

London and other big cities have many, many homeless people living in squalor(sp), why don't we offer these people homes first?

We should put our own house in order first.

erimus11 Posted on 28/02/2008 23:25
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"The refugees will be able to claim benefits as soon as they arrive,.."
How does that work then?
You can work for 21 years, be made redundant, then not be eligible to claim a brass tack for 3 months. Find employment for another 7 years, be an unlucky sod again and end up being redundant.... no benfits for 3 months...... and so it can go on.
I find it difficult to justify the reasoning behind that - don't contribute a thing to our economy but we'll give you a hand out as soon as you land arrive in town. Put in thousands of days honest graft, pay your dues and don't expect the steam off anyone's pi$$ when you are put on the scrapheap.

Dibzzz Posted on 28/02/2008 23:28
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Yep,,,it's all wrong,,,,aren't they bringing in a new scheme where you have to work fo 3 years before you can claim owt?

Great idea.

borowoller Posted on 28/02/2008 23:40
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

At the end of the day Boro already has enough of its own problems that are well documented without the need for more people on benefits.

I'm sick of paying for people on benefits who can legitametly work. There are already a lack of decent taxpayers in Boro without more scroungers. Whats wrong with Berkshire, Hertfordshire or Oxfordshire type places picking up the bill where there's a lot more money, why a deprived area like Boro.

Also they never seem to send decent educated immigrants they always seem to be strolling round the parks of Boro lucking for young girls.

Dibzzz Posted on 28/02/2008 23:43
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Yep,,we have enough rif-raf of our own alright.

zaphod Posted on 29/02/2008 02:59
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

These Ethiopians are probably among those who had to flee Ethiopia after the (mostly student) protests against the rigged elections were violently suppressed by the Ethiopian military. They're in real danger & not just looking for work. They can't go back. You'd need to be particularly heartless not to sympathise.

BTW Ethiopia was never colonised (except for about 5 years by the Italians), so the evil white people littlejimmy blames for everything are definitely not responsible for Ethiopia's corruption, violence & extreme poverty.


Link: In Danger

Surgeon Posted on 29/02/2008 07:52
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I agree with a few posts on here that say why not allow these Ethiopians to live in more affluent parts of the UK where there is more money and a better class of living.
Muswell Hill or Hamstead maybe?. lets see how the left leaning liberals who make these decisions and live in these places like it then.

They will be writing to the Daily Mail within five minutes.

zaphod Posted on 29/02/2008 08:06
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"left leaning liberals" writing to the Daily Mail? Not very likely, I'd have thunk.

I think you'll find that London, including Hampstead, has a very high percentage of refugees & immigrants already. 20 years ago, when my kids started school in Finchley, just North of Hampstead, only about 50% of the intake spoke English as their first language. There were no complaints or protests to the Daily Mail from the resident "left leaning liberals".

I think it's a good idea to spread refugees around a bit so they don't put too much pressure on the resources of certain local authorities.

Surgeon Posted on 29/02/2008 08:19
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I live in Muswell Hill now and not 20 years ago. I can say with some certainty that gangs of Foreigners hanging around parks and shopping centres gesturing to Teenage girls as I have see them doing when I visit Middlesbrough, would not go down well with the locals.

I am sure the main topic of conversation as they stop and chat to their neighbours on a morning (Guardian underarm) would soon change from house prices to this.


zaphod Posted on 29/02/2008 08:41
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I still live in Finchley when I'm in UK. It's very racially mixed: Indian/Pakistani, Turks, Greeks, Africans, Japanese, Iranians, Jews etc. etc. No racial problems at all.

Kilburn Posted on 29/02/2008 08:47
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Speaking as one of these metropolitan left-leaning liberals, I would and do welcome them.

Anyway, who else am I going to get to clean my home? A Brit? Not likely...

SmogOnTheRhine Posted on 29/02/2008 08:50
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I'm not sure what the problem is, there are bloody hundreds of us on this board that don't live in the Boro any more, loads of room for Ethiopians - I'll get my mam to tidy up my old bedroom.

jam69 Posted on 29/02/2008 09:08
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

the population of middlesbrough has been dropping for years,so theres lots of room for them,lets hope they are more hard working than alot of the locals

Pauluka Posted on 29/02/2008 09:11
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I would imagine if it was 4000 Welsh coming to town you would all be papping your pants..............

rokkers Posted on 29/02/2008 09:27
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Zaphod,

Ethiopia has never been colonised but many countries have tried and failed (due to the terrain and the fearsome defence of their country). Most of Ethiopia's problems have also come from their climate and tribal differences - such as we find here.

I for one welcome political refugees to Teesside and think it's great for the town. Let's face it boro is still a fairly culturally homogenous place (despite the claims of the rabid bigots on this board). I hope their kids play for Boro one day!

speckyget Posted on 29/02/2008 09:30
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I love this thread. All board life is here. The PC Brigade, the Charity Begins Down the Pub Brigade, the burgeoning romance between ridsdale and capio (seems to be at the wearing each other's clothes stage).

But I'm genuinely heartened by what seems to be a majority feeling that, although we have no legal obligation to help these folk, as a wealthy country we have a moral duty to show generosity of spirit. Nice, I'll go with that.

Oh, and I don't know what the population threshold for opening a restaurant is, but if they open an Ethiopian one I'd recommend a visit - not the 'Biafran Cookbook Joke' you'd imagine.

osvaldojnr Posted on 29/02/2008 09:46
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

What a load of bollox! Fair enough, leave the scruffy dole wallers, they shudnt be gettin any benefits anyway, but just because they are does it mean everyone else should? NO! Half those people living rough, you go on about saying dont give them nothing, where fighting the argies for us before being left for dead by thatcher. What were you doing, watching it on the telly mick? 525,000 for refugees is nothing to help someone i seen somebody had posted. Childline and the NSPCC have to beg for donations to keep up and running! So what if some kid is gettin battered, we have a moral duty to look after 66 people from a country where millions are in the S***, and dont know any better anyway. Its not like the ethiopians go to school and look at the other kids nike air max and get jealous! I know where i'd like my tax to go, stopping little B*****s kicking people to death in the street and smashing cars up! Helping children who are bein abused and mistreated. "the ethiopians cant even live in their own culture". We cant even put a feckin england flag on our cars in feckin England! F***in do-gooders!

captain5 Posted on 29/02/2008 09:53
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

And breathe.

osvaldojnr Posted on 29/02/2008 09:54
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

and another thing......

mickbrown Posted on 29/02/2008 09:54
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"We cant even put a feckin england flag on our cars in feckin England! "

Can you not read the instructions?

SmogOnTheRhine Posted on 29/02/2008 09:55
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

did you cut-and-paste that directly from the Daily Mail ?

osvaldojnr Posted on 29/02/2008 09:57
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Sorry i meant :
Tell them to p iss off!

Cut from the sport

Where ive jus recieved my englad flag with a sticky back plastic english proof adhesive pad.
On the same level, Mick is a D ick

osvaldojnr Posted on 29/02/2008 09:58
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Just recieved my instructions for the flag, There in arabic!

BenJammin Posted on 29/02/2008 09:58
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I work in an investment bank in the City and have earned millions (and paid millions in taxes) over the last few years selling subprime mortgages to people that can't afford them.

I don't see why my taxes should be subsidising people that live in deprived areas like Middlesbrough. It's only gonna get worse as your house prices plummet and you can't afford the repayments. I don't see what benefit I get, charity begins at home and I want a bigger swimming pool.

mickbrown Posted on 29/02/2008 10:01
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

So you've been party to fleecing the vulnerable of this country?

No wonder you don't give a feck about some johnny foreigners.

SmogOnTheRhine Posted on 29/02/2008 10:02
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

BenJammin....

...I almost believed you there until you said you paid taxes, if you worked in an investment bank you'd have some dodgy tax-avoidance scheme like the rest of the thieving B*****s and would pay no tax, but would feel equally entitled to your "Daily Telegraph" views.

osvaldojnr Posted on 29/02/2008 10:05
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I dont know you sunshine, u might have a good job, But i'd like a wager ive paid more in the way of income tax, corporation tax and VAT than yourselve my lad. I wont be stayin to take a state pension here, even though my current N.I is paying for the current state pensions, as i have made sure i look after myself and my family through graft and bein broke for a few years before EARNING my money. If only you knew what really goes on with your money!

rob_fmttm Posted on 29/02/2008 10:08
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

There are a couple of people on this thread that were banned for continual racism on the old fmttm/Rivals site can you guess who they are? One of them on at least 4 occasions.

Oh and I've been meaning to ask for sometime Surgeon you say you live in Muswell Hill and I've seen you posting on other sites, are you a Boro site because you are not registered to this site?

SmogOnTheRhine Posted on 29/02/2008 10:12
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Sorry, maybe you do work in an investment bank after all, I can tell from the standard of your grammar the level of education necessary for such a high-profile position.

Kilburn Posted on 29/02/2008 10:17
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

From my experience, such postitions are not gained due to the level of a person's education. It is the location.

Many of them are not the sharpest of brains, but they went to the right public schools.

SmogOnTheRhine Posted on 29/02/2008 10:22
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Very diplomatic Kilburn...

...I'd have just said they are normally as thick as pigS***

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 10:54
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Why is it that when people express concern about immigration, they are branded racist?

Selfish?,,,, Definitely.
Just want to look after number one?... Certainly
Racist? Not necessarily.

It is attitudes like these which helps to keep the subject off the political agenda for nearly all but one of the political parties, The British National Party.

Because of ignorant, stubborn and blinkered people shouting down anyone who wants to discuss this matter, it only helps in giving the likes of Nick Griffin and his scum bags a bigger platform and the voice on the subject to people who are rightly concerned about this counties policy on immigration.

mickbrown Posted on 29/02/2008 11:04
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Don't be so naiive.

If they were blonde Californian baywatch extras, do you think people would bat an eyelid?

littlejimmy Posted on 29/02/2008 11:08
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

It works both ways, ccole, as I said above.

Zaphod, I mentioned Dubai as well, which you seemed to miss. The oil-rich Arabs are building the place on little more than exploitation. I am well aware that historically things cycle, and at the moment The West are the dominant, rich culture, but this wasn't always the case, and it won't always be the case. Civilisations rise and fall. Doesn't make it right. I thought we were supposed to be in enlightened times.

rokkers Posted on 29/02/2008 11:16
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ccole: They are probably branded racist because of the way they view 'others'. They dehumanise them into one homogenous (sorry, word of the day!) person with no discerable positive attributes and perceive them merely as scroungers who want to take our jobs, steal our houses and eat our kids.

A few questions for you.

How is what we're saying keeping immigration out of the 'political agenda' when it's never out of the media and papers (and certainly this website)?

Why do you view Nick Griffin as a scumbag?

Why are people who express opinions such as ours ignorant, stubborn and and blinkered?

(Soz, edited)

scuzzmonster Posted on 29/02/2008 11:29
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

BenJammin, can I borrow a score?

rivals_oldschool Posted on 29/02/2008 11:48
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Sorry I don’t quite get the opposing views here.

People are merely suggesting, is flying these people to different destinations globally possibly the right course of action?

Seems ridiculous that these people have to be flown over 3000 miles out of the worlds second largest continent in order to find them somewhere to live, depsite what you may or may not think we owe them. Strikes me as an excessive use of resources just for 66 people.

What about the next 66 people to be persecuted from the country, are we flying them over too?

I’d have thought you being a believer of climate damage would appreciate that jimmy.

mickbrown Posted on 29/02/2008 11:52
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

So these people are cncerned about global warming?

My mistake - feck em then, let em starve.

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 11:55
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Rokkers –

I am concerned about immigration. I am concerned that it is part of the drain on our public services, housing and welfare state which our society offers the its weaker members as a safety net. I accept that immigration is needed for skills which our workforce are short of and as haven those with no alternative but to flee for fear of their lives.

I would also go along with the Aussie theory of “This is Australia, this is how we live, you are free to join and live with us, but you are free to leave if you don’t like it or object to our culture”

To many on this thread, my comments show that I am racist. I don’t believe I am.

To answer your questions.

Nick Griffin is a scumbag because his party is involved in stiring up hatred and violence.

Anybody who brands someone racist just because they are express a concern about immigration is in my view, ignorant of the definition of the word racist, and stubborn not to listen to the concern just because not the same as theirs,

Snoop_Smog Posted on 29/02/2008 11:59
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Anyone who says we should be helping out the homeless in this country.

...There is very little excuse to be homeless in this day and age. There are shelters and half-way houses in the vast majority of cities that cater for the homeless.

The reason people are on the streets are they refuse to abide by hostel rules ie no drinking or drug taking etc.

Another instance of people having the resources to better their life but not using them.

The_same_as_before Posted on 29/02/2008 12:06
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Basically if I did not have a bean and knew by moving to another coutry my kids would be looked after, my moral duty would be to move there.

A lot like the lads who have lived in the Middle East for years. What is the difference apart from the skin colour?

littlejimmy Posted on 29/02/2008 12:06
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I'm not convinced it's as simple as that, Snoop, but that's another debate entirely.

Did anyone else notice that today marks the start of the new points quota system for non-EU immigrants? Only skilled workers who can fill gaps are allowed in now.

Snoop_Smog Posted on 29/02/2008 12:15
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

This is just what I have been told by people in social services I work with Jimmy, but your probs right.

This immigration quota wouldn't apply for asylum seekers though would it? Which is what I think these migrants would be classed as.

littlejimmy Posted on 29/02/2008 12:25
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

That's right. Many asylum seekers are highly skilled anyway and if they manage to obtain refugee status they can get jobs.

Ivan_Drago Posted on 29/02/2008 12:54
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"There are a couple of people on this thread that were banned for continual racism on the old fmttm/Rivals site can you guess who they are? One of them on at least 4 occasions."

No I can't - well other than Enoch Elnino.

The_same_as_before Posted on 29/02/2008 13:45
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

£6 billion positive effect on our economy this year alone from the 750,000 east Europeans arrived in the last 2 years. Send em home the dole wallers, there again.

osvaldojnr Posted on 29/02/2008 14:09
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

What! We wont see any benefit on the 6 billion, just because its good for the economy does not mean its good for us. It could be the opposite. If the economy gets to swelled you get companies dropping prices to compete for your business, more people spending and having more disposable income, hence a rise in inflation, then a rise in interest rates to combat it, then higher mortgage payments and the mess the economy is in at the minute. Immigration is a balls up by the government, and in that i mean controlled immigration. Dont comment if you havnt got a clue what your on about.

rokkers Posted on 29/02/2008 14:21
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ccole: Soz for the delay mate, meetings and that...

OK. Firstly, on your point of them going to be a drain on our public services. That may be true initially but if these people are allowed to work (probably doing menial work that us good Teessiders don't want to do) they will eventually contribute, that's if they're allowed! Secondly, these people aren't going to be put up in the Ritz, they'll probably end up in the centre of Boro, where there are loads of empty houses that need filling.

I honestly cannot believe you are suggesting we go down the Aussie route. To bleedin right they're saying 'live our way or else', they've destroyed the indiginous population and have had one of the most racist immigration policies ever (whites only please!).

I am not accusing you of being racist yourself (though undoubtably, some on this board are), and of course, there are many legitimate concerns but I for one would rather see them welcomed here than being killed or tortured at home.

gareth Posted on 29/02/2008 14:26
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

So some people are furious? Why? Because they have to pay less than 1p per person to help some people whose lives are at risk. It's not like this happens every week.

Instead of worrying about your lost 1p why don't you get angry at the corporate tax dodgers who are cheating the country out of millions every year.

Lefty Posted on 29/02/2008 15:11
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I don't quite follow all of that osvaldo, could you expand?

gareth Posted on 29/02/2008 15:33
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

rokkers.

You're completely wrong.

The White Australia policy ended decades ago.

There are literally hundreds of Asians entering Australia every day. Whites are welcome if they have the right skills.

It took me, a teacher, 18 months to get through all of the application process. And if I was a day over 35 when I first applied I wouldn't have got the required points to be accepted. No advantages being white here.

And there are thousands of Vietnamese here who came as refugees. And recently thousands of Sudanese refugees arrived. And their skin is the blackest of black.

No 'whites only' here.

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 15:43
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Rokkers

Your arguments are based on the fact that all those coming here want to work, and have something to offer after fleeing oppression in there own country.

If only that was the case.

The reality is that a LARGE number of people heading for this country have nothing to offer, but know they will be provided for when they get here. These empty house’s in central Middlesbrough you talk of are owned by private landlords who charge the going rate for rent. Add this to the legal support to fight to stay here at £60 per hour, the health care/social workers/translators/Council tax etc and benefits while they wait for their case to be heard, and then appealed and it is a huge drain on our system. There is also the crime committed by criminals amongst these people.

As I said earlier there is a need for immigration, for those with skills to benefit our society and as a safe haven, but far too many are abusing our countries hospitality and generosity.

My understanding of the Australian point of view is “this is us, if you want to be a part of what we are, you are welcome, if you don’t like the way we live, then don’t come or leave”

I would have the same policy for anyone invited into my home, wouldn’t you?

The_same_as_before Posted on 29/02/2008 15:47
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Where is the imperical evidence that imigration costs the UK population a penny. Reality is the employment rate amongst the recent immigrant population is far higher than any other grouping.

I am sure you can say this Romanian family or that Iraqui family get this and that benefit, but it is far less of the norm than our home grown talent.

The Daily Mail has a lot to answer for.

littlejimmy Posted on 29/02/2008 15:49
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

I don't know where you're getting your info from, ccole. You make it sound like any old foreigner can roll up and claim a free house and some spending money. From what I can recall, illegal immigrants don't and CAN'T get benefits, and most of them are working in the black market for callous human traffickers. Asylum seekers get less than 40 quid a week to live on while their case is heard and are UNABLE to work, and if they are successful in gaining refugee status, they can then stay and get a job. A great majority of these are skilled and educated and are fleeing persecution for standing up to corrupt, murderous regimes.

neilg Posted on 29/02/2008 15:50
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

alves,skippy,dame edna, kakubu,dglee,juno, boetang,viduka, all foreigners taking the jobs of windass, ricketts,riggot,morrison.

build a wall around middlesbrough.

we dont want east clevlanders in our town. do what the israelis do and build concentration camps.

i could have played for the boro if juno hadnt been here!

just not british old boy :-) (slightly cheek in tongue)

junkyard_angel Posted on 29/02/2008 15:55
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

The imigrant populations of any country tend on average to contribute more to the economy than the indigenous population.

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 15:57
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Jimmy, I don’t claim to be an expert on this matter, but how long does it take to identify who is a legal and who is an illegal immigrant in this country?

Where do these people live while they find out who is legal and illegal?

How are they financed during this and the appeal process?

What is the average legal cost?


neilg Posted on 29/02/2008 15:57
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

espec the good catholic irish in the boro.....and the bad ones!

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 16:01
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

The flipside to neilg post;-

Throw the doors open, let everyong come who wants to come because they all have enough money to support themselves and are all qualified doctors?


Thoughtless and a childish argument?


TheSmogMonster Posted on 29/02/2008 16:02
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"My understanding of the Australian point of view is “this is us, if you want to be a part of what we are, you are welcome, if you don’t like the way we live, then don’t come or leave”"

Sorry mate but thats bull, misquoting an ex aussie pm, you got that from the bullS*** email that's been going around for 5 years I'm guessing.

The way I look at it... genuine asylum seekers, like these Ethopians.. let them come in, they'll work their nackers off in general.

Economic immigrants are fine because they contribute.

Illegal immigrants never cost us a penny as such and are by definition illegal - so they already have laws against them.

It amazes me that in this day and age, people still listen to the overly sensationalist media to the point they don't appear to know the difference.

neilg Posted on 29/02/2008 16:06
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

yes childish

hence "cheek in tongue".

keep redcar reds in redcar......costing us time having to queue up at the bar on a satdy dinner.....disgraceful....put em on a boat at teessport and transport em to hartlepool.

thatl teach the blighters. jolly hocky sticks :-)

littlejimmy Posted on 29/02/2008 16:09
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ccole, I would have thought it is exactly how TheSmogMonster says. If they're illegal, they can't get benefits, and are working in the black market. If they declare themselves to the authorities, they will more than likely be booted out. Legal immigrants have visas and work permits, and we all know how thorough a process this is when we see it in action with various footballers (like Alves). Asylum seekers are again a separate case, but sometimes they get lumped in with illegals, when they shouldn't be. That's how I see it.

neilg Posted on 29/02/2008 16:13
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

off with their heads - thats what the queen of hearts would have said - but she wasnt nice.i likes the tin man...reminded me of worzel gummage

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 16:14
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

My last post on this thread.

Like I said above, what about the time between them landing on these shores and then been declared illegal?

Untill some one answers the questions a couple of posts above, to suggest that "Illegal immigrants never cost us a penny" seems silly statement.

As for "miss-quoting the Aussie PM"?


Link: you got that from the bullS*** email ..?

neilg Posted on 29/02/2008 16:16
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

come quickly! a load of illegal norweigans have just landed at seal sands. i bet theyve been a whaling and a drinking.

Snoop_Smog Posted on 29/02/2008 16:16
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

The asylum process if anyone's interested. Not the most interesting read though....


Link: bbc

junkyard_angel Posted on 29/02/2008 16:19
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

And then of course, there are the asylum seekers, who do get benefits but are not allowed to work even though they are willing.
Who thought of this?

rokkers Posted on 29/02/2008 16:19
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ccole.

Well, you're beginning to blur the lines of discussion now; this tread is about Ethiopians fleeing persecution not about economic migrants?! (littlejimmy's is totally right by the way about their ability to gain benefits)

Anyway, to pick-up on your tired rhetoric about economic migration (as usual the negative aspects are automatically assumed) - Immigration has over the years been economically beneficial to this country. As I've said before, economic migrants do jobs that most of the locals baulk at. They have also propped up the NHS for the last 40 years, helped in the construction of the country (the tube, the roads etc...) and widened the skills base of the country.

Gareth, soz for the confusion; I was referring to past policies and ccoles 'like it or lump it' statement.

littlejimmy Posted on 29/02/2008 16:20
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"Like I said above, what about the time between them landing on these shores and then been declared illegal?"

They're not even on the radar, as they are smuggled in on lorries and in boats, etc., and going to try and claim benefits as an illegal without any kind of documentation would result in them being detained, I would imagine. They can't just turn up at ports and airports without the requisite visas and permits and expect to be waved through. It's just not going to happen. Can you understand this? They are UNDETECTED.

As for the Aussie PM, he soon got what was coming. He got booted out on his arse at the last election.

This is my last word, I think it's going round in circles now.

NEIL99 Posted on 29/02/2008 16:24
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

this goverment is crap.send them all back to where there belong and close our borders.not welcome here. i am racist, we are too soft

Kilburn Posted on 29/02/2008 16:24
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"what about the time between them landing on these shores and then been declared illegal"

You've got it the wrong way round. They have to prove they are legal before they get anything.

They can't just walk into a benefit office and say "ok, I've got no proof I'm legally in this country, but give us some money until you prove otherwise"!

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 16:41
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Rokker

Agreed on the bluring and the direction this going. I have stated many times above I am in favour of immigration. It is needed. The NHS is a classic example of why.

Clearly I have the wrong idea of people who land in this country.

So let me get this right. My understanding was;-

a) person lands here from EU country
b) Claims asylum
c) Given benefits, housing, legal cost etc until proven that the are genuine or not.
d) After several months, if genuine, rightly offered new life in this country. If not spends more time here on appeal


But the truth is,

a) Person lands here
b) Claims asylum
c) Doesn’t get a penny support, or any benefits for months until proven genuine or not?
d) If not sent home without costing this country a penny (excluding oneway ticket)
e) If genuine, rightly gets the chance of a new life

Well I am big enough to admit I am easily led by the British media.

Lefty Posted on 29/02/2008 16:43
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Immigration is good for the economy and it is not a burden on the tax payer. It should be made easier, much easier. Immigrants should be allowed in on a temporary, renewable visa. The only criteria as to whether they can remain or must go back home is whether they can answer yes to the question 'do you have a job?'

It doesn't even matter how skilled they are.

ridsdale Posted on 29/02/2008 17:29
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"Immigration is good for the economy and it is not a burden on the tax payer. It should be made easier, much easier. Immigrants should be allowed in on a temporary, renewable visa. The only criteria as to whether they can remain or must go back home is whether they can answer yes to the question 'do you have a job?'

It doesn't even matter how skilled they are."


I would accept that as a ruling on remaining in this country.

Revol_Tees Posted on 29/02/2008 18:35
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ccole -- when it comes to asylum seekers and refugees, it usually works like this:

1. Person flees from their country of origin. Obviously they would risk arrest by the authorities from which they were fleeing if they simply walked into an airport and booked a flight out of there, so it is often by clandestine means, facilitated by third party 'agents' (i.e. traffickers)

2. Person arrives in the UK. They receive nothing until they hand themselves into our authorities and are then sent to Liverpool or Croydon to make a formal application for asylum

3. After the application has been made, they are dispersed around the country

4. Having been dispersed, and while their application is pending, they receive about £37 per week. (This is NOT administered by the DWP/JobCentre Plus but by the Home Office.) They are not allowed to work. They are housed in run-down accommodation provided by private landlords who are awarded contracts on the basis of how cheap (and dirty) their service are

5. It can take years for the application to be dealt with by Home Office caseworkers. If asylum is granted in the first instance (this only happens about 20% of the time) they become refugees with leave to remain and can apply for naturalisation.

6. If the application is rejected, they can appeal to an Immigration Judge against the decision -- if they find a solicitor to represent them

7. If the appeal is rejected, all support is withdrawn unless the 'failed' asylum seeker agrees to return home. If he/she agrees, he is accommodated and provided with subsistence food vouchers until a removal can be facilitated

8. If he doesn't agree to return home, he simply becomes homeless and destitute. This is where a lot of asylum seekers drop off the radar and become involved in the black economy, working for £1 an hour in pizza shops or factories or whatever, living a miserable existence in the margins. It's a policy predicated on the false assumption that asylum seekers are 'bogus' and will simply go home when they realise they will no longer be supported. By and large, that's not the case.

I haven't read all the details, but the odd thing about the case of these Ethiopians is that they seem to have been granted refugee status without ever having entered the country. I can only assume it must have been done through the UN, who will have interviewed them and processed their applications actually in Ethiopia (or in the refugee camp) which is a good proactive approach to take.

ridsdale Posted on 29/02/2008 19:11
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

"They are housed in run-down accommodation provided by private landlords who are awarded contracts on the basis of how cheap (and dirty) their service are"

Not the case in central Middlesbrough. The houses provided were completely refurbished. New central heating, double glazing etc. And new carpets and furnishing. I don't know how much money they receive, but all bills, including gas and electricity are paid, which means they may be better off than some others on benefit.

ccole Posted on 29/02/2008 19:42
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Revol, Thanks for your note. Its close to how I thought it would be and very different to what a few have said above.

With regards to the Ethiopians, I understand that most of the procedures were done by the UN in Africa.

I would also agree with Lefty last post

TheSmogMonster Posted on 29/02/2008 20:22
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ccole revel isn't talking about illegal immigrants though.

"Like I said above, what about the time between them landing on these shores and then been declared illegal?"

They never get declared illegal because no one knows they are here!

littlejimmy Posted on 29/02/2008 21:26
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Exactly, Smog.

blind_date_reject Posted on 29/02/2008 22:53
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Why cant Bob Geldof put them up instead - im sure he has the room


[:D]

Revol_Tees Posted on 07/03/2008 01:28
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

Hoof FAO ridsdale and other curious parties:

"The houses provided were completely refurbished."

Er, no they weren't. The furniture is old, the carpets are dirty and worn out, the window frames are often as rotten as any property. Repairs and 'refurbishment' are only carried out when absolutely necessary.

"I don't know how much money they receive"

See my above post.

"All bills, including gas and electricity are paid, which means they may be better off than some others on benefit."

They get water, gas and electricity bills paid because they only get about £6 a day in benefit and are not allowed to work. How that's "better off" than some others on benefit I'm not sure.

Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 07/03/2008 09:02
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

If a couple of them were footballers you'd be rejoicing that they were coming over.

Well, these blokes may be able to do a bit for fans at Clairville Stadium ;-)

Good luck to them, they need a break in life and why shouldn't we be the ones to hold out the hand of friendship when it's needed? It's not as if there's not enough to go round, we're one of the richest countries in the world.

The main objectors will be still voting, year after year, to make sure that the country's wealth finds it's way into the same few arse pockets. Keep up the good work.

neilg Posted on 07/03/2008 10:00
Immigration - More coming to Teesside

ctc - that last sentence says it all - try asking why the rich are rich, not blame the poor for being poor. :-).

funny how the last (best ever) ten years at boro - has been the time when weve had more foreign players than ever. variety is the spice of life. more of it i say.