permalink for this thread : http://search.catflaporama.com/post/browse/1726804
massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 21:36
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Some bloke was banging on about "unfashionable Middlesbrough" and the government wanting rid of us.

Why do some people from round here feel the need to play the victim? It's embarrassing.

The place is closing down and although it's unfortunate, you just have to deal with it. Nobody has it in for you, me or us.

Certain people need to get a grip.

Bren_MFC Posted on 19/02/2010 21:42
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

when was it in Boro???? must have missed that one....

redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 21:45
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Here here Massive !!

Take note Butter my Ring ..... see its not just me with that opinion

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 21:54
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Bren: It was on last night. It'll be available on iPlayer.

redisameancolour: A few people probably agree with us, they're just too scared to say.

It really does my head in when people from round here play the victim - in life and in football. It's pathetic. Grown men are crying, saying people have it in for them. It's ridiculous. You'd think they were children or something.

Yes, you've been made redundant. Yes, it's unfortunate. But life goes on. If the government hated you that much, they'd have you killed, surely? Alas, they don't.

BobbyG Posted on 19/02/2010 22:00
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I've always found this mindset really frustrating, I blame religion....catholicism in particular.

redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 22:03
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Happened to me mate..... as much as i have sympathy with them unfortunatly u have to get on with it..... All of us in the chemical industry had to.... If u look at all the plants that have shut down over the last year redundancies went into thousands too...... did they make such an issue out of it ? No !

Teesside was always known for its Chemical industry too but we have had to accept its now finished..... We have had to move on just like all others whose industries have gone tits up have had to.....

As much as its sad that Teessides industries are finished we have to fight on as individuals...... I had to, and ended up with a good job in a totally different sector.... there is jobs out there believe me

Butter my ring take note

Bren_MFC Posted on 19/02/2010 22:04
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

haven't people always had to leave home looking for work over the years, I'm sure there was a big influx of Irish into our town to work at the steelworks,......

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 22:11
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I've been through it too, redisameancolour. It was awful, but moaning/crying/playing the victim wasn't going to get me anywhere. I think these people need to realise this too.

It makes me laugh, really. A lot of people are quick to say that Scousers are good at playing victims. I think some people want to look a bit closer to home.

What's next? Will the victims start coming up with crazy ideas that the government will stop delivering food to local supermarkets in a bid to starve us?

redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 22:15
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Its actually heartening to know that someone has the same opinion as me...... Like i said its sad to hear of anyone being made redundant but crying about it aint gunna do much good....... I've had it twice in 3 years and just had no choice other to accept it and move on ........ All will be well in the end

leave_my_arse_alona Posted on 19/02/2010 22:20
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Sad news but life does go on. Great tradition of steel in the area.

We are all lucky that we live in a nation with mass employment, health care and welfare which stops the majority of us being dead before we reach 40

could_it_be Posted on 19/02/2010 22:28
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

aye

time to man up like for these whingeing bastads

many a teessider had to travel for work but now some of these corus lads dont fancy the idea of staying on isaacs hill or wherever

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 22:30
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Some will struggle to find jobs, that's obvious. There aren't many places round here that require people to pour melted steel into casts, but what can you do? If that's your job and you can no longer do it: diversify and find something new.

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 22:32
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

They will if it comes to that..plus the Windfarm yards will start up and theres enough Industrial land to get work back here.

And its not over yet something will come up[;)]

Sitrep Posted on 19/02/2010 22:35
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Is this the “I’m all right Jack thread”?

redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 22:39
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

No its the " Time to face reality and diversify if thats what is needed " thread

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 22:40
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Sorry?

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 22:41
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Some are pleased as they have been bladdered before and nobody cared.

Theres still hope Yet Sitrep.

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 22:49
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

This is the bend over and take it up the arse thread.

Nothing we can do , nothing will change , don't support each other I'm alright jack.

Fukkin sychophants ..... [V]


redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 22:52
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Dont support each other ??? Wot the Fooook are the people of Teesside supposed to do ??? All club together FFS ?

Its not a case of " i'm alright jack " its a case of accept the inevitable like others in the same situation have had to.... end of

adelfsmitler Posted on 19/02/2010 22:53
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

i remember having a pint listening to the,,,i`m alright jack corus foookers,,,,not givin a XXXXXX about other lads on the dole...so foook them....

Bren_MFC Posted on 19/02/2010 22:55
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

it is a sad situation, but as said, similar things have happened all over, the mining industry was hit hard, things will move on and so will people, it is not the end of the world but it will be hard times for many people.....

redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 22:56
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Would'nt have put it like that but everyone these days looks after number one and rightly so

I cant remember loads of people being sypathetic when Invista and loads of other Chemical plants went the journey

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 22:57
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

XXXXXXin hell , it does n't take you lot long does it.

You will be calling them unemployed scum before long.

Brainwashed fukkin idiots....


redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 22:58
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

??????? Crazy answer [V]

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 22:59
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Some quite enjoy seeing others fall.

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:00
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

dodger: Wanting a change and fighting for your rights is one thing. Playing the victim like a child and crying is another.

If this whole situation had been dealt with with dignity, I'd be supporting it. Unfortunately, it hasn't.

People coming out with statements like "the government want rid of us" is ridiculous. Gibson coming out saying this could ruin the attendances of the club is pathetic. He doesn't care about the people who worked there. He cares about his pockets being lined.

As I've said, people playing the victim and saying "oh, we're from Middlesbrough, aren't we badly done to" is pathetic. Grown men should have self respect. The vast majority of people voicing their opinions on this (i.e. Corus workers) appear to have none of that.

They're embarrassing themselves and the area.

Sitrep Posted on 19/02/2010 23:00
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I cant remember loads of people being sypathetic when Invista and loads of other Chemical plants went the journey

Then you have been knocking about with the wrong sort of people, and its obviously rubbed off on you.


Like I said, I’m alright Jack

adelfsmitler Posted on 19/02/2010 23:00
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

[^][^],

redisameancolour Posted on 19/02/2010 23:01
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Seems i am then...... so be it

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 23:04
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

People react differently to problems.

Have all the redundant been on here crying playing the victim card?

A bit of sympathy to our own is the least you can give.... oh no notXXXXXXs like you.

Ever thought of a career in politics?

rob_fmttm Posted on 19/02/2010 23:06
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Today is a time when anyone with a heart and a brain on Teesside is in mourning for the passing of a way of life and for the passing of the very era that Teesside was founded on.


ridsdale Posted on 19/02/2010 23:08
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Well said Rob.

We ask no favours.

We demand respect.

Bren_MFC Posted on 19/02/2010 23:08
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

absolutely, a sad day for Teesside and its history and the effect on many families in the area but not exactly like a Haitti situation....things will move on, many have been through these things before

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:10
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

dodger: I never said they all acted like that. I said the vast majority.

I've said it's unfortunate. But coming out with rubbish about the government having it in for us and wanting rid of the area and not caring isn't going to help their case with me. Like I said, it's pathetic.

They're not "our" own. Well, not mine, anyway. I am me. I am a man. I look after myself, my family, my girlfriend and my friends. They are the only people I care about. I couldn't care less about a load of people losing their jobs, to be honest.

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 23:11
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Sometimes people have no affinity with each other or their area..Altruism is alien to them..it may be there upbringing or an insecurity, but in the same way they cant feel a belonging when things turn good.

Its a tough old world but its nice to be nice

Sitrep Posted on 19/02/2010 23:12
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

what a apt username

adelfsmitler Posted on 19/02/2010 23:12
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

i`m sure there b jobs at tesco.....

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:14
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"Today is a time when anyone with a heart and a brain on Teesside is in mourning for the passing of a way of life and for the passing of the very era that Teesside was founded on."

Mourning? Come on, Rob. I've got my own worries. I've got my own life. Why would I want to worry about people I don't know?

You say all this for effect. You don't really mean it. You see yourself as some kind of voice of the people. That's why you come out with this stuff.

I don't care about what has happened. As long as I and everybody I know and care about are fine, nothing matters.

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 23:16
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Naw they just go abroad and earn a fortune or retrain all paid for,and the old guys will be telling you about there foreign jaunts and pensions.

Be nice to them they may buy you a pint[^]

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:18
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"Sometimes people have no affinity with each other or their area..Altruism is alien to them..it may be there upbringing or an insecurity, but in the same way they cant feel a belonging when things turn good.

Its a tough old world but its nice to be nice"

It is nice to be nice. That's why I'm saying that the whole thing is unfortunate.

I can't pretend to be something I'm not and be sympathetic to people.

God knows how many people died in the earthquake in Haiti. They're people who need sympathy. Not a load of people who have been made redundant.

What next? Collection buckets on the gates at the next home game?

I wouldn't be surprised if it happened, I'll say that.

Bren_MFC Posted on 19/02/2010 23:20
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

exactly mate, a bit of perspective please.....

Ouroboros Posted on 19/02/2010 23:20
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

massive_doyle, do you work?

mickymacc Posted on 19/02/2010 23:20
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Take your blinkers off doyle,the impact may be felt by those you care about.Mass unemployment kills an area/community in so many ways.Read Robs post again.

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 23:20
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Massive doyle... fair enough you only care about yourself and yours... that's good.

Others care extends beyond that... even better.

I assume you have never needed or will ever seek others help... that's sad.

Bend over you idiots... Tesco awaits.

Not_Smog Posted on 19/02/2010 23:24
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

From what i can gather about this situation the problem is Corus, not the government, not the area or the economy.

Corus supply steel, Corus have decided to shut the plant down, who's fault is it? CORUS.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:24
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Ouroboros: Yes, I do work. I work full time. Why?

rob_fmttm Posted on 19/02/2010 23:26
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Doyle - are you better known to me as Leon?

adelfsmitler Posted on 19/02/2010 23:26
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

i worked at corus and now work at tesco.....
i feel lucky to have a job...I heard some lads from corus saying it`s beneath them to work in tesco.....this is some of there mentality.

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:27
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"From what i can gather about this situation the problem is Corus, not the government, not the area or the economy.

Corus supply steel, Corus have decided to shut the plant down, who's fault is it? CORUS.

Wake up and smell the coffee."

EXACTLY.

There was some idiot banging on about it all being the government's fault on Question Time last night, playing the victim and sitting shaking his head at anybody who said anything he didn't agree with.

Pathetic.

Ouroboros Posted on 19/02/2010 23:27
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

May I ask what it is you do?

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:28
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"Doyle - are you better known to me as Leon?"

Yes. Why? Who told you?

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 23:29
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.



"From what i can gather about this situation the problem is Corus, not the government, not the area or the economy.

Corus supply steel, Corus have decided to shut the plant down, who's fault is it? CORUS.

Wake up and smell the coffee."

It's TATA , and if you think they have acted alone , please do some research before joining the debate.

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:31
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"May I ask what it is you do?"

I'm an electrician.

I've had a lot of bad times, just like those in question. I've been finished and made redundant myself before. It's not nice, but I dealt with it. I didn't go crying to anybody or sit wollowing in self-pity. I got on with life.

Before I got the job I'm in now I was unemployed for 6 months and had to take a job in a certain place in Middlesbrough serving drinks behind a bar. It wasn't nice, but I had to do it.

These people will have to do the same.

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 23:35
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

You will have been the divvy who could not mix a JD and coke then.

rob_fmttm Posted on 19/02/2010 23:35
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

It's totally obvious Leon.

Banned several years ago for linking to a picture of a limbless mine-victim and telling everyone what a hoot it was.

First of many times you have been banned over the years.

Tony Mowbray used to say its not big and its not clever.

alvesdad Posted on 19/02/2010 23:35
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Well said Sitrep and Rob
This is a time for mourning a way of life for thousands of Teessiders after 150 years.
Your Fathers and my fathers way of lives coming to an end and then when i see comments from ----heads like Massive Doyle and others it makes my blood boil. Well said Ridsdale WE DEMAND RESPECT.

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:36
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"i worked at corus and now work at tesco.....
i feel lucky to have a job...I heard some lads from corus saying it`s beneath them to work in tesco.....this is some of there mentality."

Really? Well, they deserve everything they get if they have that attitude.

When I worked in the place I mentioned above, what I earned in a month there, I used to earn in a week. It was awful, but it had to be done.

You can't sit there playing the victim, longing for sympathy like some pathetic puppy.

Did any of these people offer to take paycuts in order to sustain their jobs and compete with their competitors? I bet they didn't.

They got paid to pour melted metal into a bloody cast. It's not rocket science, is it? I dare say some should be thankful they've been in employment for so long.

Sitrep Posted on 19/02/2010 23:37
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

TATA Steel = carbon credits this plant to them is worth more Dead than Alive.

Ouroboros Posted on 19/02/2010 23:38
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I'm sure you have, very few people nowadays have the luxury of indefinitely secure employment.

No, I was just wondering why you apparently feel no sympathy or affinity with these people, or apparent sorrow at the loss of a traditional industry. I guessed it wasn't your background, that's all.

mickymacc Posted on 19/02/2010 23:39
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

If you were unemployed for 6 months,it must have been your choice lazy man.Sparks usually find work worldwide on good money.If you don't care,why come on here posting.

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:39
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"It's totally obvious Leon.

Banned several years ago for linking to a picture of a limbless mine-victim and telling everyone what a hoot it was.

First of many times you have been banned over the years.

Tony Mowbray used to say its not big and its not clever."

Watch out, Columbo.

What I posted years ago cannot be brought up in a pathetic attempt to discredit what I am saying now. Stop being a child, Robert.

Saying that, I wouldn't really expect anything different from somebody like you.

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 23:41
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Yeah doyle... they deliver the metal and they just pour it into casts..

No wonder it got shut down..[|)]

mickymacc Posted on 19/02/2010 23:42
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"What I posted years ago cannot be brought up in a pathetic attempt to discredit what I am saying now. Stop being a child, Robert"-gives an insight into your mentality though.

mickymacc Posted on 19/02/2010 23:43
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Sparks only have three wires to work with,and they're colour coded,it's not rocket science is it.[:D]

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:45
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"If you were unemployed for 6 months,it must have been your choice lazy man.Sparks usually find work worldwide on good money.If you don't care,why come on here posting."

It wasn't my choice. Why would I choose to scrimp and scrape?

Like I said, I got that desparate for work that I took a job that I wouldn't normally take.

Also, I wouldn't like to work away. It's not for me. I wouldn't enjoy it.

Saying that, why do I need to justify myself to somebody like you?


It's not about me not caring about the place closing. It's about me bring up the subject of the people in question acting like pathetic victims.

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 23:46
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

[ref]


Link: Cold as ice

Sitrep Posted on 19/02/2010 23:46
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Massive, you have the attitude of a sociopath

Mavrick Posted on 19/02/2010 23:47
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

This thread deserves a nomination for the 'Very Poor Taste Award'!!!

Playing victom?? If you think thats what its all about then your not at all clued up on the circumstances around this whole situation! Its a sad day for Teesside, many will lose jobs directly and indirectly plus our heritage has been taken from us. If you think its just a case of spitting your dummy i'm made redundant then you really have no scope or understanding of what is happening in our own back yard!

[V]

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:47
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"gives an insight into your mentality though."

No it doesn't. If you're going off what he is saying, you wouldn't understand what it was.

If you actually saw what I posted, you might think differently.

Saying that, you might not. Either way, I don't really care.

dodger Posted on 19/02/2010 23:48
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

You would not exist or be here without that industry and the people it brought here.

Fukkin insensitive troll.

mickymacc Posted on 19/02/2010 23:49
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"Saying that, why do I need to justify myself to somebody like you?"-why what am I.?.Touched a nerve?.

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 23:49
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Hey miccmac unless your wiring a rocket[:D]

rob_fmttm Posted on 19/02/2010 23:49
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Doyle - anyone banned in the past for being exceptionally offensive, bigoted, racist (and yes you have been), aggressive... time and again deserves to have their past thrown up and aired in public when they show such a total and utter lack of respect for his fellow Teessiders. Working families with an uncertain future ahead of them and all you can offer is ridicule.

Some might say you are pitiful or maybe just totally immature. Some might say it is you that has the victim complex.

I think in this world you have to know when it is best to keep your trap shut and show some flaming RESPECT.

massive_doyle Posted on 19/02/2010 23:51
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"You would not exist or be here without that industry and the people it brought here.

Fukkin insensitive troll."

How do you work that out?

Was I created by a man having sex with a piece of steel? Did a piece of steel give birth to me by immaculate inception?

red_shamrock Posted on 19/02/2010 23:53
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Get in there Robbie lad[^]

degsyspesh Posted on 19/02/2010 23:56
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I have massive sympathy for those at Corus who have lost their jobs - just as I have for anyone in countless industries who have found themselves in a similar position over recent years.

The problem is that as insensitively put as Doyle's argument is - he is basically right. The world no longer owes anyone a living - what is currently happening to steel has happened to most other industries over the years. Whether you think that this is right or wrong is completely immaterial - welcome to everyone else's world.

Whatever Tata's motivation was for closing TCP is irrelevant - as is speculation over how much or little the government did to try and save the plant - it has happened and those affected now have to make the choice of whether to sink or swim.

Teesside is all about grit, graft and ingenuity - it doesn't play the victim card very well

alvesdad Posted on 19/02/2010 23:57
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Massive Doyle the name suits you if all these jobs go its not just Corus jobs down the Swannee its Contractors Shop Workers a figure of 8 to 10000 jobs wil also go so you had better keep your nose clean as Electricians from Corus will come on the market and what i read from your comments will probably take your job because you are not a full shilling.

Not_Smog Posted on 19/02/2010 23:58
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Dodger - please can you educate me on this situation?

TATA are the parent company of Corus, Corus sells it's steel to TATA (probably at a massively discounted rate). For whatever business reason (probably cost cutting) TATA has decided not to buy the steel from the Teesside Corus plant.

What am i missing here? Who's agenda are events following?

I don't understand what you want the Government to do regarding this? Use public money to buy the plant?
If the plant really is a profitable plant why aren't they investment capitalists lining up to buy?

We don't live in a socialist country, we live in a free market capitalist world and as such people will and regularly do get f*cked over and out by big corporations.

Tell me what needs to happen realistically to keep this plant open? How i see things is if there are offers to buy the plant and Corus are refusing the offers then surely the blame lies solely at the feet of Corus or it's parent company.

So please feel free to educate me.

LingdaleLegend Posted on 20/02/2010 00:00
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.


Degsy nail on the head right there son [^]

Sitrep Posted on 20/02/2010 00:01
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Massive get Yourself to the doctors ASAP


Profile of the Sociopath

This website summarizes some of the common features of descriptions of the behavior of sociopaths.


* Glibness and Superficial Charm

* Manipulative and Conning
They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.

* Grandiose Sense of Self
Feels entitled to certain things as "their right."

* Pathological Lying
Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.

* Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt
A deep seated rage, which is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.

* Shallow Emotions
When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.

* Incapacity for Love

* Need for Stimulation
Living on the edge. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal. Promiscuity and gambling are common.

* Callousness/Lack of Empathy
Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.

* Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature
Rage and abuse, alternating with small expressions of love and approval produce an addictive cycle for abuser and abused, as well as creating hopelessness in the victim. Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their impact on others.

* Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency
Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.

* Irresponsibility/Unreliability
Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.

* Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity
Promiscuity, child sexual abuse, rape and sexual acting out of all sorts.

* Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle
Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.

* Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility
Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 00:06
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"Doyle - anyone banned in the past for being exceptionally offensive, bigoted, racist (and yes you have been), aggressive... time and again deserves to have their past thrown up and aired in public when they show such a total and utter lack of respect for his fellow Teessiders. Working families with an uncertain future ahead of them and all you can offer is ridicule.

Some might say you are pitiful or maybe just totally immature. Some might say it is you that has the victim complex.

I think in this world you have to know when it is best to keep your trap shut and show some flaming RESPECT."

Offensive? Certainly.
Aggressive? Maybe.

A bigot and racist? I don't think so, Robert.

There's a difference between outright racism and little quips. Obviously somebody with zero personality wouldn't understand that. You have no right to say that I am a bigot or a racist, though. That is ridiculous and you certainly have no proof to back this up.

What gives you the right to tell me who I should respect? Why should I respect people just because they come from the same area I do? That's a ridiculous philosphy. If you want to live by that, fine. You're welcome to it.

Some could say I am pitiful or immature. They'd be wrong. But they could say it. They're welcome to think whatever they like. A lot of people could the same about you, mind. But lets not get personal, eh? (Even though it looks like you want to)

I think in this world everybody is entitled to their own opinions and people like you should accept that fact, whether you agree with it or not.

You're not God, you know. You own a fanzine and you moderate a messageboard. Get a grip.

Mavrick Posted on 20/02/2010 00:07
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Rob i'm offended by this doyle. Can we string him up by his balls and throw darts at him. Even better can you just IP ban him?

LingdaleLegend Posted on 20/02/2010 00:10
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.


freedom of speech would be better [8)]

rob_fmttm Posted on 20/02/2010 00:11
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Doyle - look back over the thread and you will find it was you that started the personal stuff.

For me a racist joke is racist. Why else would it be called a racist joke.

You are right it is up to you how you behave and you have a right to express your opinions. But maybe not here, eh!

Good night.



Not_Smog Posted on 20/02/2010 00:13
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Why would you ban doyle? He is only expressing an opinion. He has not been racist or bigoted in this thread at least anyway.



dodger Posted on 20/02/2010 00:17
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Not smog... Tata will recieve £600 million in carbon credits from the mothballing of the plant from the EU.

They will open up two new plants in India ( more eco friendly ) and get more ££££s#

Their chairman is the director on EU carbon credit payment. ( Rajenda Pachauri ).

The uk government signed up for this without giving us a vote... as promised.

Hope this helps with your education.


Link: For not smog;

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 00:18
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Where did I get personal? I could say a lot about you, you know. I could belittle you if I wanted to. You're lucky that I respect a certain person (and some other people), seeing as though that's your buzz word.

I've never told a racist joke on here. Find some proof and back up what you're saying, otherwise keep your mouth shut. You can't go around calling people racist. It's not right.

Yes, it is up to me what I say and think. Have I said anything racist in this thread? No. Have I said anything that can warrant a banning or a warning? No.

I've simply said something you don't agree with and you're that childish that you've spat your dummy out.

Get a grip.

LingdaleLegend Posted on 20/02/2010 00:27
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.


indeed dodger

thats the bottom line

wtf wasnt this brought up on question time ffs

Mavrick Posted on 20/02/2010 00:30
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I think this is Doyles way of spitting his dummy. You seem to be going on a lot about this in a negative way. Maybe you should deal with the coverage that the Corus workers are getting and stop resenting it!

Not_Smog Posted on 20/02/2010 00:30
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Thanks for the information dodger, i wasn't aware of that. However upon learning that information my initial reaction is, wasn't that my original point?

The closure is TATA/Corus fault, not the government, not the people of Teesside, not the economy.

As a company they will make more money from mothballing the plant then they would selling it or continuing to produce steel there.

What would you like to happen here in a realistic business sense?

Bear in mind that the government cannot make TATA sell the plan to anyone. It cannot make Corus/TATA keep the plant open.

Yes it can try to negotiate deals but at the end of the day the reality of the situation is their hands are tied. Be it Labour, Tory, Lib Dem or BNP it would make no difference here.

I understand Doyles point and i also understand the financial devastation that it will cause the Teesside area but i honestly cannot see why you can attribute blame to anything other then the powers of free market capitalism.

As someone famous once said its a giant shyte sandwich and we've all got to take a bite.

If my evaluation of this situation is wrong please feel free to point out the errors in my logic. I'd love to be able to put them blame for this at someones door but i can't see how you can blame a company for acting in the best interests of itself in a fee market capitalist world.

dodger Posted on 20/02/2010 00:38
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Very slippery of you not smog.. nice turn of track.

You forget to mention the thank you for the free education.

Dan_Ashcroft Posted on 20/02/2010 00:39
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I think this thread is definitely a case of bad timing given the emotions running tonight.

Massive_Doyle's fine having an opinion though, it wasn't the time or place for a spat to kick off. I think that was a bit disrespectful myself.

Julios_Hairband Posted on 20/02/2010 01:26
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I thought the QT thing definitely did get a bit too 'wah wah everyone hates teesside' on the Corus issue, when there were valid points to be made about British industry in general that got missed.

HolgateCorner Posted on 20/02/2010 01:28
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

It was a terrible question time, mainly because the panel was the worst in living memory, only the Tory Etonian guy was any value and I can't stand the air the Tories breathe so what does that say about the rest?

br14 Posted on 20/02/2010 04:00
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"the closure is TATA/Corus fault, not the government"

You should have listened to the UKIP MEP bloke speaking in the EU parliament.

According to him, it is entirely the governments fault.

He claims they're so up their own rear-ends over CO2 emissions, the entire EU is actively encouraging the transfer of "dirty" industries to India etc. And in answer the EU Commission President more or less admitted that was the case.

I'd be willing to bet that if the plant was in a marginal Labour constituency there's no way it would have been allowed to close.

Tata in all it's forms is decimating British jobs. And laughing all the way to the bank in the process.

Time for a health dose of protectionism.

The west is in a race to the bottom for the middle and working classes, and a race to riches for corporate owners.

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 05:34
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Massive_Doyle:
You must be a distinctly average electrician if you were working in a bar. I could have guessed you were a spark even before you said. So many in the trade are spineless, selfish and short sighted. This resonates through the trade and is one of the main reasons our agreements and rates are so poor. Fair play to the steelworkers and scaffs and fitters, they stick together and don't only consider themselves and their birds.
Thank god the world isn't populated by people of your mindset.

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 12:04
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

A distinctly average electrician? I wouldn't say that. I can do my job, that's all I can say.

I was working in a bar because I needed the money. There wasn't many jobs about at that time and any jobs that were about were asking for things I don't have (inspection & testing etc). Plus I didn't fancy working away. So what else could I do?

Should I have just sat and cried like the Corus lot?

So you're saying I'm spineless, selfish and short sighted then? Is that it? That's quite an assessment from somebody who doesn't the person they're talking to.

Do you know what? If the world was populated with more people like me, it would be a much better place. People round here are all too willing to the victim, giving false support and false sympathy (that's you, Robert) to people who don't really need it. It's pathetic.

If anybody on here thinks I'm this or that for what's coming out of my fingers (words), I don't really care. I can only say what I think. I can't be false like so many of you and others can be.

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 13:08
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Massive Doyle:
I've judged you in the most pure way I can. No discrimination of any kind could sway my view. Like you said, purely your words have condemned you.

Capt_Tiffy Posted on 20/02/2010 13:12
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

"Thank god the world isn't populated by people of your mindset. "

Why? Cos instead of milking the system he got off his ersa and worked in a bar till he got another job?


Capt_Tiffy Posted on 20/02/2010 13:20
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

This deserves to make the hundred mark.

[^]

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 13:30
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Capt_Tiffy:
No, thank god there are people in the world, whose only concern is not themselves or their immediate family. If such a thing happened there would be no society. We'd all be hunter gatherers in small tribes.

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 13:34
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Not sure how you come to that conclusion, like.

As I've said, why should I care for people who I don't know? They're not suffering, starving or dying. They've lost a job. That's all. Their families haven't been murdered because of war or religion. They have lost their jobs.

It's not that big a deal.

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 13:39
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Perhaps that's when empathy comes into it. I can feel for people who are going to struggle for work and have to see their children go without. War and murder are different. Do you feel for the victims in Haiti? You don't know them, so why should you?

Capt_Tiffy Posted on 20/02/2010 13:43
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

But dont you think that what has happened in Haiti puts things into perspective??

i.e There's always someone worse off than yourself??

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 13:47
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

If you read what I've written above, you see that I mentioned the Haitians.

Yes, I am sympathetic towards them. They live in a completely different world to us and it has been absolutely destroyed. Lives have been ruined. Lives have been lost. Families have been torn apart. People are staving.

But what's that compared to Corus closing their plant down, eh?

red_shamrock Posted on 20/02/2010 13:51
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Local Families local Heritage future jobs..Yes I feel for and support them, as when any lad or community loses jobs and their prosperity and livelihoods.

I have sympathy and upset for the people of Haiti I don't ration my sympathy or feelings... life goes on but its appalling when people enjoy seeing this happen.

Capt_Tiffy Posted on 20/02/2010 13:51
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

You're wasting your time Doyle.
People dont like hearing that they should give their head a shake. On here the majority fall into the 'there there, I must appear nice' brigade.

Capt_Tiffy Posted on 20/02/2010 13:52
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Who in this thread has said that they have enjoyed seeing this happen like?

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 13:53
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Correct. Losing a job is on a smaller scale than natural disasters or mass genocide. Both make me feel bad.
I wasn't criticizing him for taking a bar job, more having a dig at his trade skill level![:P]
However some of the massive doyles comments make me cringe. Maybe some of it is attention seeking. Or are there some people who are only concerned with themselves and immediate family?

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 13:58
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

red_shamrock: Where did I say I was enjoying it? All I've said is that I think the whole victimisation thing is pathetic and embarrassing.

Local families/local heritage/future jobs? You do realise that only one plant has closed, don't you? You do know that that wasn't the only place in the area to employ people, don't you?

Life goes on. Diversify. Surely this is the moment people should be thinking about a fresh start - new industry.

It won't happen, though. The reason being that people like you and everybody else who is/was involved in this is too busy whinging and moaning, saying everybody has it in for us. Well, they don't. So stop being so bloody stupid.

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 14:04
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Do you think people are not looking for new work because they're enjoying sitting around having a moan instead? Perhaps they've booked the next 6 months off from their lives to mourn? People are trying to move on and will be seeking new work, but is it so wrong to fight until the fat lady sings?
I think you need think about the bigger picture and do some research.
Out of curiosity do you ever pitch in at work if one of the lads gets hurt and is forced to retire early?

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 14:06
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Kevlar: Have as many digs as you want. I don't really care, to be honest.

None of what I have said is attention. Why would I feel the need to seek attention? I've said what I've said because that's how I feel.

Would you prefer it if everybody in the world was like Robert and pretended to care about everybody and pretended to be concerned about everything? Nobody would ever get anything done.


QUESTION: What's the difference between God and Robert Nichols? God doesn't walk around Middlesbrough thinking he's Robert Nichols.

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 14:10
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I'm just looking for that shred of humanity that seperates us from the beasts in the fields. No-one cares about everybody. For example fat people who can't get out of bed. There may be a glandular reason, but I don't buy it! I do like to think, however, I have a degree of compassion. If somebody falls down, pick them up.

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 14:11
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Well that's where we differ. If I see somebody fall over, I'll laugh. I'd only pick them up if they were hurt.

rivals_oldschool Posted on 20/02/2010 14:13
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I've no real strong bond myself with the steel industry, my granddad worked in British Steel but had retired from there well before I was even born.

Some of the Corus workers I'd met over the years were absolute pr*cks. Throw backs from the British Steel days of job's for the boy's. Corus was a last bastion of those days. Some were as thick as two short planks, who only got in there because they’re dad worked there before them.

I’ve met so-called electricians down there, who’d struggle to wire a plug.

A lot of the fear about at the moment is because some of the workers down there know they had a very good number that they will never ever have again.

That being said they still have a right to be aggrieved because the plant as a whole has been fu*ked over. It really has, along with the Teesside area.

Kevlar Posted on 20/02/2010 14:13
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Then I feel we've reached a conclusion. Good luck in all your endevours.

Genghis_Khan Posted on 20/02/2010 14:14
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

This area has been sold down the River for generations... they extracted what they needed and left us. We were useful for the growth of the empire, now we're an inconvenience - Internal imperialism failed us.

Any other government would simply force Corus' hand and enforce a sail.

Vin says its better than I ever could.


Link: It's just not fair

red_shamrock Posted on 20/02/2010 14:16
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Yeah I worked there Otto Simon Carves contracting for a few years at all the different plants.. its a lot of jobs that will effect the community badly.

Coming on and telling everybody how you coped with your unemployment and effectively saying your embarrassed by them is poor taste.

People are angry and upset the last thing they need to hear right now is a plastic Norman Tebbit bumping on.

People will come to terms with it after a while..nobody`s unique or special on this board IMHO...and to listen to a lot on here is good for a laugh, a lot of unhappy fascists doing a job that's a waste of time and it shows in their outlook.

Or is it I have a reason to believe..how I fought against the odds.[;)]


willie_falconer Posted on 20/02/2010 14:21
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

[^][^][^][^] To Doyles post at 14.06pm

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 14:22
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

We're an inconvenience? How do you work that one out? That's some inferiority complex you've got there.

We're just as worthy as anybody in the country. The south doesn't like the north and the north doesn't like the south. That's how this country works.

Genghis_Khan Posted on 20/02/2010 14:25
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

A north south divide is overly simplistic.

It's much deeper than that, there are many Northern cities and towns who have seen great development and investment in it's infrastructure.

Middlesbrough train station is a classic example of Teesside.

Run down, not on the main line... they don't want to waste any more money on us.

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 14:26
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

I reckon the people who got finished from Corus should go on Britain's Got Talent or The X Factor. They love a good sob story on there.

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 14:28
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Genghis, if you feel like that, move somewhere that is on the main line. Would that make you happier?

Is that all you long for, to be on the main line?

red_shamrock Posted on 20/02/2010 14:30
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

It depends how strongly your representatives lobby the Government and how much they recognise its a difficult vote to catch.

Jobs = votes
Investment=votes
Poor Representation = no investment
Strongholds = disregard

Vote em out kick Labour into touch.

redwurzel Posted on 20/02/2010 14:49
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

If you are working class outpost, without a national flag to wave you get forgotten.

One day we will need a steel and chemical industry and there will be nothing left and no expertise. I dread to think ben dependent on China. Jobs are getting more and more concentrated in South East which is probably not healthy for the country.

massive_doyle Posted on 20/02/2010 14:53
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

The government sold their soul when they sold everything off to anybody who was interested and offered a reasonable price. This country owns nothing now, so it's not only Middlesbrough that has been shafted.

I'd like to make a montage of the poor victimised folk with an epic Westlife song in the background.

ridsdale Posted on 20/02/2010 15:06
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

The Redcar plant was built and paid for with tax payers money, then hived off cheap to its private owners by Thatcher.

That steelworks belongs to us!

Tommy_Trinder Posted on 20/02/2010 16:14
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

The Redcar plant was built and paid for with tax payers money, then hived off cheap to its private owners by Thatcher.

That steelworks belongs to us!

FFS when will Labour and their Luvvies start taking some responsibility for the state the country is in, instead of harking back to what the Tories did when they were in power!!

Pathetic!

Lefty Posted on 20/02/2010 16:23
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

He's not wrong though is he, Tommy?

HolgateCorner Posted on 20/02/2010 22:18
Question Time in Boro: playing the victim regarding Corus.

Of course he's not wrong, this surrender to the free market which was undoubtedly started by the tories in the 80's and sold in such a way that Labour had to carry it on just to get elected down south will see the ruination of Britain.

There is hardly any point for any young person now to live anywhere other than london.

The nuclear power station building programme is now underway and I have mates who are having to run to Paris at EDF's beckon call every 5 minutes to get contracts drawn up.

Our energy future in the hands of the French - just think about what that means.

Look what our steel industry being in the hands of the Indians has done for us.

Complete shambles this country I'm afraid.